If God Exists...

Discussion in 'Philosophy and Religion' started by relaxxx, Dec 29, 2015.

  1. Moonglow181

    Moonglow181 Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

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    and here is my theory....energy never dies...energy is what is creating the life or expressing itself in many different ways.
    It runs though all living things, and is not a separate entity from the life itself......
     
  2. NoxiousGas

    NoxiousGas Old Fart

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    what type/form of energy would that be?
    there are many different forms of energy.
     
  3. Moonglow181

    Moonglow181 Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

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    energy is energy no matter the form it takes, right?
     
  4. Okiefreak

    Okiefreak Senior Member

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    Really? Where did you get that information. It's certainly true that new strains of virus mutate from old ones, but I've never heard of any popping "into existence..all of the time." That would be spontaneous generation of life (not to be confused with abiogenesis) which isn't supposed to happen. And BTW, antibiotics never have worked on viruses.http://aboutviruses.weebly.com/theory-of-spontaneous-generation.html
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spontaneous_generation
     
  5. Moonglow181

    Moonglow181 Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

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    popped into existense was the humor in me...ok, bacteria, then......duh...happy?.....you caught my mistake! Whippy!

    Same meaning stands.
     
  6. Moonglow181

    Moonglow181 Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

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    I saw fungus pop into existence once on a treadmill where i sweated on in a matter of only a couple of days .....LOL

    and fuzzy living stuff popped into existence once in a cup I left a small amount of soda in in the sink, which i forgot to wash and put away before i went away for a week once...... :D
     
  7. deleted

    deleted Visitor

    The mold spores are in the air all around you, the soda pop was just a medium for them to colonize and grow on..
     
  8. relaxxx

    relaxxx Senior Member

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    Everything is a natural process. Things would appear to "pop" into existence because of limitations in observational accuracy. Just as the writers of the book of Genesis were oblivious to the billions of years it took nature to develop life. It made sense to the people at that time that a God could "pop" the universe together in a few days. There is one thing or place in nature that things do pop into existence, that is random spatial fluctuations in the quark gluon field occasionally produce quarks.

    Energy in this field could be described as looking like static "snow" on an old TV screen.

    Sometimes in nature, wind energy, naturally pushes snow into balls...

    [​IMG]

    Go figure.
     
  9. themnax

    themnax Senior Member

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    if god exists, love it, hug it and call it george,
    but don't make it an excuse to beat anyone over the head,
    or destroy what your and their very existence depends on.
    and if the god or gods that exist are worth anything,
    they wouldn't want you to do that anyway.
     
  10. mohsin qureshi

    mohsin qureshi Members

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    God definately exist. What do you think is this universe created by chance ???
    [SIZE=12pt]Some of the people believe that this universe was created just by chance and they also try to prove it through science. But God says that all those things that happens just by chance, they don't have such an order in them. Different colors are used together to make a picture. If we just throw the paints on a paper, will they ever make a picture? Houses are made of bricks, but if we just throw the bricks in a pile, will they form a house? It is true that sometimes some of the things are made by chance, but a close analysis of the universe clearly refutes this 'by chance' theory. All right, for a moment, if we believe that matter was created by chance, and this world also came into being by chance, I will ask the readers to study deeply the creation of human beings, Is it possible that such a perfect being was created by chance? See the stars, the planets, sun etc. and then the creation of day and night. Every thing just fits so nicely in a finely woven net, doesn't that orderliness speaks of a powerful creator? [/SIZE]
    [SIZE=12pt]Even in this world we can easily judge the power and wisdom of a creator of anything by closely examining his creation. A good picture is painted by an excellent painter, a powerful computer is made by an intelligent team of researchers. Looking at the orderliness of any things tells us that how intelligent its creator is. God has given to every being an appropriate body and shape, so that it can sustain itself. God kept the food for trees in earth, therefore he gave roots to the trees, so that they can get their food. God made flesh as food for tiger, therefore He gave strong nails and teeth to the tiger, so that it can kill its prey and eat it. God made grass as food for horses and camels, therefore He gave them long neck, so they can graze it. God created lungs for human beings, therefore He also created air, so that they can breath. Human beings depend on water, so God created Clouds, so that they can take water to them. Such an enormous and perfect order could never have been created just by chance? Only a super-being could do it. [/SIZE]
     
  11. relaxxx

    relaxxx Senior Member

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    Mmmm yeah, GOD's all about the details.

    [​IMG]
     
  12. Okiefreak

    Okiefreak Senior Member

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    I agree that the integrated complexity of the universe, especially the "fine tuning" of natural constants to permit physical reality and life, requires an explanation. So far, the best explanations humans have come up with are God and M-theory (which is also, for all practical purposes, an untestable theory). However, the way you state your case doesn't take into account the effects of natural selection and complexity theory. You suggest that God adapted nature to the needs of animals, plants and humans. Darwin, however, suggests that it was the other way around: animals, plants and humans adapted to their physical environments by the process of natural selection. That is not entirely a random process, but Dawkins argues in The Blind Watchmaker, that it can account for an amazing amount of integrated complexity. Likewise, complexity theorists argue that a remarkable amount of order can arise at the brink of disorder. Termites, seemingly unconscious automatons with simple nervous systems, pursuing rather simple routines, can produce elaborate architecture with a maze of interconnecting passages, ventilation tunnels, etc. Yet all this comes about as a result of the termites mindlessly following a few simple rules. I have no doubt that God is ultimately responsible for all this, but I marvel at the elegant simplicity of it all. In his book At Home in the Universe, Stuart Kaufman, theoretical biologist and complex systems theorist, posits that "laws of complexity spontaneously generate much of the order of the natural world" and that autocatalytic systems are responsible for life itself. It's "only a theory" but something to think about.
     
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  13. Space_Trippin

    Space_Trippin Banned

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    God did fix it and will never ignore his creation. Even if he did tell you his true nature you might miss it, but the main thing is he did tell his true nature to humanity, but lots of humanity have ignored it...


    *edit
    and no I'm not a bible thumper
    I'm not christian either or muslim or whatever I am of the one true god
     
  14. Asmodean

    Asmodean Slo motion rider

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    Christians and muslims too :p
     
  15. relaxxx

    relaxxx Senior Member

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    Well... what was it? A devilish voice from a burning bush on Mount Horeb? What is God's true nature?
     
  16. relaxxx

    relaxxx Senior Member

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    In the video "If God Exists", the child Yahweh tells the adult that he plans to revel himself to only a few primitive people in the middle east...

    [From 07:43-]

    Adult: Tell me, Yahwey, why have you decided to limit yourself this way?

    Yahweh: Because I wanted it to be a clockwork universe. You see how precise it is? It all runs automatically, if I wanted to do that then this is how it needs to be.

    Adult: but you are God?

    Yahweh: Yeah, So?

    Adult: You have unlimited power so you need the universe to run automatically to what end? You don't need to concentrate, you don't need to conserve energy, you don't need to devote time or resources elsewhere because you have unlimited time, unlimited resources. Yahweh, one day people will be able to look beyond earth and where once they thought they'd find you, instead they're going to find countless other worlds and stars and galaxies. They're going to find a clockwork universe, automatic running and dying all on its own according to the laws of nature. Without requiring an omnipresent omniscient omnipotent omnibenevolent space-less timeless supernatural being to run anything.

    Yahweh: Ah, but they're going to ask who created those finally tuned laws of nature. The design of the universe itself will be there evidence of my existence and nature.

    Adult: Will it? The question of fine-tuning will be inevitable indeed because each and every unknown that was attributed to your doing will eventually be discovered to be nature's doing. The question itself however will lead to an infinite regress. Why would you need to finely tune the laws of nature unless you were being restricted by some other laws beyond your control? And who created the laws that govern the necessity for God to fine-tune the laws of nature? If these laws dictated the nature of your creation then how could you be called omnipotent? How could you be called God? If your creation could only be created in one kind of way? If the laws of nature could only be one kind of way to permit life and if the universe runs all on its own then what does it need with a God? Because if that's the case then you didn't actually design anything. You merely followed a set of instructions. Who's instructions? The presence of an all-powerful God doesn't explain anything at all. In your current state I'm afraid you are ridiculously superfluous.
     
  17. Okiefreak

    Okiefreak Senior Member

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    Interesting the video communicates in this form: metaphor and allegory. Apparently you take it seriously.
     
  18. relaxxx

    relaxxx Senior Member

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    APPARENTLY, you'd rather fixate on the format and ignore the message.

    Good, hope that works out for you.
     
  19. Okiefreak

    Okiefreak Senior Member

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    If the message is examined, it's meaningless, because it's rooted in a faulty format. Apparently, atheists have the same difficulty religious fundamentalists do: forgetting that their metaphors are only myths.
     
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  20. relaxxx

    relaxxx Senior Member

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    Said the christian church goer.
     

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