I Have Just Joined THE BREXIT PARTY!

Sorry When I looked at the Ballot Paper the options were Leave OR Remain, (Leave with a Deal and Leave Without A Deal) was not on the Ballot Papers.

 

And Leave won.
End of.
So let’s just leave!
Simples.

 

Well hopefully we just Leave. Don't get me wrong I understood why people voted remain (I am a Leaver in a pro remain area). But It seems Remains mostly don't get our side.

I like Most people would never support a Second Referendum (Tho It would be good to win again) but we need to get it done.

 

Why do some keep perpetuating that lie?

I dont see any mention of a deal on the ballot paper

 

You had the European Union Referendum act pass through parliament in 2015. Thats the legislation that includes the nature of the question

"On the bill's second reading, on 9 June 2015, MPs voted by 544 to 53 in favour of the principle of holding a referendum with only the Scottish National Party opposing the Bill,[10] and by 316 votes to 53 on its third reading in the Commons on 7 September 2015.[5]"

So all Labour MPs voted for it, including the question on the ballot paper not having a reference to a deal

 

I guess I worded it wrong. What I mean is that although it wasn't specified on the voting ballot what a lot of people THOUGHT/EXPECTED they were voting for was a sensible brexit, not a hard brexit with no deal. This is also one of the primary reasons why there's so much demand for a second referendum (which at this point I don't prefer either. I also just want the UK out now. They're rather destructive atm.)

 

Asmo

But when does giving in to disruptive bullies and giving them what they want ever end up been a good thing?

Isn’t that just appeasement

I love my country and want it saved from these people and I look to the future (most young people are remainers) rather than some mythical jingoistic past.

Leave voters dying and Remainers reaching voting age means majority will soon oppose Brexit, study finds

 

That's not what EU members are doing when letting the Brits have it. The british system is abused and has worked against the remainers, it caters to a miniscule majority. That the British government is at an alltime low is not solely due to 'disruptive bullies'.
Best the EU can do at this point is do damage control and let the Brits sort their mess out themselves. In some situations people only learn the hard way, by experience (like in Greece ), and there's no need most of Europe has to learn the lesson the brexit supporters will learn the hard way.

 

Having no mention of a no deal on the ballot paper

The leaver leadership ruled out a No Deal Brexit, they said time and again that would be bad and would never happen, it was always that they could get a ‘better deal’. The whole idea of a No Deal was called ‘project fear’ by the leaver leadership, no deal was something to be feared – in other words - to not be voted for.

So many people voted on the promise that no deal was NOT going to happen and I’ve talked to and heard many others on different media that say they wouldn’t have voted for leave if they had though it would mean the crashing out without a deal.

 

Shouldn't we be able to assume that the choices stand for the things said in the campaign for the choice?

 

Asmo

The thing is that as I’ve said before I don’t think the hard-core leavers will ever ‘learn from the experience’ if things go wrong they will be blaming everyone else but themselves and the right wing Brexit media will lie to back that fantasy up.

So as I see it giving the diehard leavers what they want will not work as a teaching aid it will just cause the rest of us to have to suffer the pain and work long and hard to pick up the pieces while living under the yoke eternal austerity.

 

Probably still will, looks like the EU will cave

But you never vote in an election assuming the winner is going to keep all their election promises

Saying they should stick to the details from a campaign over 3 years ago is the same as saying they should have been able to predict the future.

Its been the irish border for the most part thats blocked deals. Something you will all eventually have to work out either remain or leave. That issue is not going to go away

And of course Labour didnt say anything about a 2nd referendum 3 1/2 years ago if you dont like the results of this one in their campaign either

 

More people tend to get conservative as they get older. The number of people that have gotten past 18 in the last three years pales to the number of older people that have simply gotten three years older and vote soley on what affects their superannuation and investments


And the former yougov president using three year old data and assuming the younger voters havent changed opinion is hardly convincing

 

It's primarily damage control. The UK is gonna leave, the longer it takes to try to get some kind of deal the more negative impact it has on the EU. Hurrying up is best for the rest. No need to let more european businesses and citizens suffer unneccesary negative consequences by catering to a hopeless british government. I assume at least some brexit voters will acknowledge the hard lesson eventually, but yes surely far from all. Sorry, but your country is on a collission course with the EU. People and politicians in the EU are not primarily concerned about the british. We are concerned don't get me wrong. But we can't save you from your own countrymen here.

 

Asmo

Yours is a completely rational argument for someone in another EU country looking at the UK or rather looking at what I think of as English nationalists are doing to the UK.

If we do get a people’s vote maybe we can stop the worst consequences of this madness but I do realise a lot of damage has already been done.

And do you know LOL I often think that even if crashing out ended up with people fighting to the dead over a tin of beans in a burnt out Tesco’s the hard line leavers would still be blaming Brussels bureaucrats.

'Outrageous': European newspapers react to No 10's Brexit strategy

 

This part is actually quite baffling to me.
I can't really understand why visible borders and checks etc are a threat to the peace.

 

Drift

OK as I understand it.

Irish nationalist violence

I don’t like it or agree with it but there you go

To the Irish nationalists (and other less militant Irish people) the border of Ireland is the beach.

Any English border in Ireland is not Irish.

The thing is if you have different trade and migration regulations on either side of any border you will need a hard border to be able to do checks on goods and people crossing to make sure they comply with the regulations. (And during the troubles to stop the movement of guns and explosives).

To violent Irish nationalist any such border is seen as an affront it shows that Ireland is partitioned and it would once again become a rallying cry for such terrorist organisations as the IRA.

They have always vowed to try and destroy any visible manifestations of it put up by the English (and the people running it). So if you have custom post you will need armed protection with the prospect of armed confrontation and terrorism.

Well when the UK and Eire both became part of the EU then here was no need for a hard border

That became one basis for the Good Friday agreement, the dismantling of all physical evidence of there been a border and a promise (backed up by law I believe) that there never would be any type of hard border between the two areas.

So in this case the Irish would have to put up borders (although Irish nationalist have said they will blame the British for that) checks goods coming in from outside the EU.

As a Law Professor Aoife O’Donoghue of the University of Durham explains that “the harder the Brexit, the harder the border.”

You could say why doesn’t the UK just let good come in without checks but then you come up against WTO rules

“If the UK chooses not impose any tariffs on goods coming across the [Irish] border… that would mean that the UK is giving the EU (because Ireland is the EU in this context) complete open access. So its most favoured nation tariff is zero. That means it would have to give a zero tariff access to every single country in the WTO.”

So the UK would have to put up some type of hard border

It is a mess.

 

You may have joined a Brexit group - but it looks far from being a Party

 

Double post.

 

A prophetic image you describe there!
I see it myself.

Thank you. So... There doesn't HAVE to be a problem then? There isn't any inherent problem, it's that some people would choose to make it a problem? Do these people (nationalists) have any valid complaint worth fighting about? Or is this the same kind of mentality the leavers have over Britain..