How Young is Too Young?

and wonkothe sane sounds like yet another man resentful that he'll get in trouble for fucking young girls too young to understand the relationship. poor man. there's a whole other thread where 90% of the people posting there were furious and disgusted at a 20+ woman dating a teenage boy. get over it. it's the difference in maturity that appalls most of us.

 

Not at all. I've been propositioned by younger girls and *always* turned them down.

I am disgusted by a society of hypocrites full of double standards and contradictions.

Like: "Sex is bad!"...but sex sells...or "Being attracted to underage girls is bad!"...but we get little Jo-Jo shaking her ass on MTv...or "Women are a strong as men!"...but we act like little girls need protection that little boys don't...or even..."Don't touch MY daughter, boy!"...but "Hey son, get laid if your are a real man!"

Or even "Homosexuality is Evil!", but "Ohhh...lesbian porn is *hot*!"

Disgusts me.

But I guess it somehow all makes sense to you mynameiskc...perfect sense...and you probably even think there are WMD's in Iraq....

 

i agree with wonkothesane.

im so sick of all the double standards it really pisses me off, another reason why i hate people.

 

I haven't checked the pregnancy stats, but I HIGHLY doubt that "pre-teen blow job parties" don't happen. Maybe the numbers are lower, but we have a correspondingly lower population in that age range



Anywho, it depends a lot on the people involved, I think. When I was 16, I was 'dating' a 32 year old online (we met once, no intercourse but almost everything else). And it really didn't work out for me. My sexual needs and desire are kindof messed up since (admittedly, they were a little off the beaten path anyways, but he drew that out and added to it, in a not so good way)

I was still learning about my sexual self a lot though. I was very new to the game of sex, and he was very learned. I don't feel like he corrupted me, but I think that it can be a lot better to explore and learn with someone who's almost equally new to the game as you are. A lot healthier, anyways. So long as protection is used, that is (not the school's job to teach about the wonders of a condom, the parents job - school's do a shitty job on sex-ed)

 

i guess i dont see as much of a problem in it as others. i think no matter what the ages, a nice person has about a 1 in 20 chance of ending up with another nice person when they start dating(you can never tell at first) so a 16 year old dude can due as much, potentially more, damage to a girls physical or emotional state, as a thirty year old. i think im a nice guy and i let an age discepency get in my way of being very happy once and i still regret it, so now im not gonna worry about age, i need a nice woman who stays in shape and is into what im into, im not gonna worry if she's 35,25,15, these things you cant control.

 

i believe in the sacredness of sexuality, and not in your standard fundie christian way. i believe the achievement of orgasm is our god's small taste of what heaven is. sexual union is the closest we come to truly understanding what it is to be god, to be two halves joined as one (and i'm not just referring to hetero sex). i think that's why it's such a huge part of human existance. but it's why i don't believe in tampering with the budding sexuality of youngsters. i dont' want their sexual innocence to be polluted by the socially twisted desires of our own generation. each generation has it's own set of issues, issues that will only truly be understanded by someone of the same emotional maturity. we have a particular set of filters skewing our understanding of the usage of sex, but you're sexually frustrated desires are clearly presented by your own post. i disagree with you, i GENTLY mock your frustration (which i feel myself from time to time, but don't lash out at anoyone) and you completely come unglued. it's kinda sad.

 

Well said.

 

so then it isn't about age, it's about emotional maturity, and age is a rather immature generalization.

 

age isn't that wrong a generalization, though.

 

rather
wait till they come out with emotionally mature id cards

 

on second thoughts I think the reason for sex age laws is that they can cut part of the population's chance of messing things up, but it would be too noticeably unreasonable for them to raise the age higher.
Does that make sense? Do I need to re-word that??

 

I think the whole problem with this issue is that there are no easy answers.

Like I said previously, through most of human history and in many human cultures (even today) the concept of adolesence doesn't exit. You are either a sexually mature adult, or a child. It's a binary state, with no middle ground.

However today -- esp in the West -- we have the phenom of girls going through puberty at younger and younger ages. Some attribute this to homones in the food (and this may be *one* factor) but really it probably boils down to better nutrition. Most girls begin their periods when they reach ~ 110lbs.

Also, in the modern world, thanks to advances in medical science, we live longer, but we are still influenced by the old evolutionary pressures and drive to reproduce as quickly as possible. (However, we stil have problems like difficulty in comception and greater rish of birth defects in women who have children over 30.)

(And least we not forget that girls -- and boys -- have the option of education now, and women -- and men -- who choose to educate themselves and have carriers tend to dely child rearing till later in life...but then flawed biology rears it's ugly head again and like I said above, we have difficulities with conception and pregnancy, and greater risks or birth defects.)

So we have the weird dicotomy of girls becomming able to bear children when they still are mostly children themselves. (This is, IMHO, yet another peice of evidence, IMHO, that there is no "creator" and no grand design.

And then, just when *is* one mature enough to have a child? I have a very good friens (who live is rural Illinois - farm country) who at 16 married a man of 26 and had children. (They are still married, btw, and she is now 34) In her case, she regrets none of it, consideres herself to have been "ready" at 16. Maybe she was, *probably* she was, she seems to have doen a good job of paranting and has 3 well adjusted intelligent children.

But at the same time I know 32 year olds who *still* aren't mature enough to have the responsibility of having and raising kids!

(Oddly enough, in rural Illinois, dropping out of school and having kids at 16 is common. In fact, can name at least half a dozen time I have heard teenage girls say they "can't wait" till they turn 16, so they can get pregnant and drop out or school. Great, I cringe, not only having kids for *all* the wrong reasons -- brining a child into the world not because you want on but because you want a reason to quite *school* -- but by quitting achool you are almost guarenteeing that you won't have the resources to afford a child! But in a poor and uneducated (and boring) midwest farm country, thsi si often all many kids have to look forwards to, sadly. (And this is one reason I will *not* allow my 2 daughters to be raised in bumfuck Illinois!)

So is 16 or 18 or 21 a good blanket age. Well, as I have said before, at 20 i was sexually propositioned by a 14 year old girl. (And *yes*, I WAS sexually attracted to her.) I rejected her advance for 2 reasons...1, I could tell (in my "maturity" - yeah, rght!) that she really only wanted a substitute father -- indeed, and substitute *family* becasue her mom was a drunken slut who was never around. So I just didn't "feel right" with the idea of having sex with her, even though my dick was saying "yes"!

This is maybe evidence that there *is* something inately wrong with an "adult" having sex with a 14 year old...something that my "consience" told me was wrong...or maybe it is more a sign of societial conditioning -- I was brainwshed into feeling that my sexual desires & feelings were quilty or wrong. Or maybe I simply felt that *this* particular girl and this particular reasons for having sex would be wrong...(If I myslef had been 14 I might *still* have felt this was wrong, because at 14 I wanted to have sex, but I also wanted *real* love.)

But the second reason I brok it off was fear of the law. A fear of the law that not only forced me forgo pursuing any sexual relationship with this girl, but that also scared me shitless into running away and ignoring this girl without even so much as telling her goodbye, or why I was refusing to see her, or how I *really* flet about her. (Which was that I really did thinmk I loved her, but wasn't so sure this was the right time/reasons.)

So in the end, she was very hurt, and soon after hooked up with a 16 year old boy who fucked her, got her pregnant, and ran off leaving her to care for the child alone. (So in this case, the law meant to help and protect, kinda did more harm.)

Now, baring such fear of arrest, I would perhaps have had sex with her, perhaps not. (But if I had I certainly would have used protection, and certainly have cared about *her* as a person and her feelings, and certainly have done everything to make sure that she *enjoyed* the sex aas much as i did and wasn't treated roughly.) But hey, the law is always right...right?

And even if I had not had sex with her. (Or had waited much longer to do so, when she was a bit older.) I at least would have felt comfortable and safe remaining friends with her, expressing my feelings for her in other ways, and if the need arised to break it off, I would have been able to sit down with her face to face and told hr *why*, and told her that I *did* care and that she was special and beautiful (without feeling like a "pervert") as opposed just leaving her thinking that something was wrong or unlovable or ugly about her, or that maybe *she* had done something wrong.

So again, they law meant to protect seems to have done more harm than good.

It really isn't such a clearcut black & white issue as many moralists and anti-sex people would wish to have you believe. Real life is messy and complicated and there are no easy answers.

And as for addressing mynameiskc...I won;t because I can tell she just wants to insult an dargue...but I will point out some of the choice language she said in her last post...read this:

"...sexual innocence to be polluted by the socailly twisted desires..."

Innocence..so sexuallity is the opposite of innocence, which is _guilt_. And "polluted", so sex is _dirty_? and "twisted'..so sex is _perverted_?

That doesn't sound like the words or someone who believes in the "sacredness of sexuality"...indeed it sounds like the retoric of a "fundie", which you claim you are not.

But okay I *think* that what you meant to be talking about are the ugly and twisted desires of someone who would simply use another person, a child, for sex. But you aren't wuite clear if that is the case...so look honestly look at the words you use, they sound like the words of someone who sees sex as something shamefull and sinfull.

Maybe we should take a lession form our cousins the laid-back pacifistic egalatarian sexually gregorious bonobo chimps (proof that sex and the enjoyment of it *isn't* only a "unique human experience" mynameiskc) and from our other cousins the violent aggressive sexually controling male-dominated (and rape practicing)...when you repress something -- like sexauality -- it often comes back all twisted and pissed off and fucked up.

Or just look at countires and places like Europe or Canada or Australlia which are much less uptight and more laid back about sexuality -- even teen sexuality (average age of consent being ~14 in these places). They have *lower* teen pregnancy and STD rates and even lower teen sex rates and kids engage in sex on average *later* than they do in countries like the US ,where we push "abstainence-only" and teach that sex is dirty and bad (so therefore only something that two people who really and truley love each other should d! LOL!!!) and we paradoxically have *higher* rates of teen sex, teen pregnancy, abortion, rape & STD's and an on average increasingly *younger* and *younger* average age of first intercourse!

And don't even get me stat=rted on countries with even more fundamentalist religious views on the evils of sex (like the middle-east and most of the rest of the 3rd world) where women are treated like cattle and married off at like 12!!! And rape is punishable by death -- to the *victim*!!!

I am a father of 2 wonderfull pre-teen daughters, and I want them to wait as long as possible before they become sexually active. But even more so I want them cherish and enjoy their sexuality and not fear it or or find it shamefull...and interestingly enough, all of that above is *not* mutually incompatable!!!

 

still getting bitchy because i prefer to see children's sexuality treated with a great deal of respect. get over it.

 

my problem with adults fucking teenagers is that the teenagers are so often USED by the adults, and then they DO feel guilty. i want these children to be able to explore their sexuality in an environment that doesn't promote their use by the more intellectually mature adults. i began having sex when i was 14. i've never regretted or looked back. but one thing i WAS sure of, that 25 year old man who wanted to fuck me was NOT looking for a relationship. he was looking for tits and pussy. had i gone along, i'd have just been another kid-whore. not all children that age would be smart enough to understand that, and i'm glad my mother instilled in me some self respect. keep your hands of the kids, you perv, and quit getting so pissy about it.

 

that was very well said, wonkofthesane. however I am a little wary of why you were in that situation with the fourteen year old girl. How did that come about??

 

I like watching 14-16 year old suck dick

 

hgah
did I say I didn't?

 

he probably goes trolling for them.

 

umm just so you know you couldn't legally sleep with a 14 year old in canada. At 14 you're legally allowed to have sex, with someone within 2 years of age. at 18 its open season.

 

that sounds reasonable to me. expecting abstinence is just stupid. if god didn't want us to have sex, he wouldn't have given us such a strong drive for it.