how can atheists use the word "god"?

:sunny:

nothing!

 

Here we go right of the top, the distortions of belief. It is the absence of food that leads to starvation. You could just as well say that the lack of generosity of some people leads to starvation and homelessness. The absence of money does not cause destitution or desperation. The only real component of money is the agreement to have it be so. You could say money is paper, but what makes paper money different from any other paper.

Many people believe that money makes happy. No matter how substantial the evidence for money is, it is a common superstition that money makes happy, or that money protects or supports you. There are real facsimiles of other kinds of gods too.

While a common conjecture, it is not met so often with truth. People who register this complaint are never swayed by the insidious religious education, but have in fact rejected it.

That we all feel there is good in the world and we ought to have for ourselves, does not guarantee a belief in invisible beings, but there is far more belief in invisible things embedded in even the atheists model of the world, than is commonly understood.

 

and THAT IS MY POINT you silly person. It makes no sense to argue with insane people on their terms, you dont argue with the insane, you treat their condition

 

mean :love:

 

On these two points I am convinced I made a mistake and you are right while not allowing these mistakes to invalidate my entire argument. I believe i should have thought the answers more clearly but yes on correcting my mistakes there you are correct

 

Oh yes. Unfortunately those ideas are there and widespread, and unless atheists and rationalists do speak out against oppression, violence and nonsensical voodoo from the dark ages, this will always be the case.

This debate is a fairly new one, believe it or not. Of course atheists have been around for a hell of a long time. But times were such until relatively recently that they couldn't speak out or they would be burnt alive, censored etc. Thankfully times have changed and debate is open to everyone in the Western world, which is a real blessing and one we should enjoy. Free speech accelerates learning and the spread of common sense, and it'd be foolish for those with a brain to step aside while the religious nuts continue to indoctrinate their children and wage war on eachother without pointing out how ludicrous it is.

 

A surprising number are just plain stupid, thoughtless, misguided or childish. I used to believe firmly in spirits and reincarnation and astrology and such, even some kind of mystical gods and goddesses. I wasn't really insane as such. Deluded and paranoid, yes. Lonely, yes. I had issues in my life and I was surrounded by unstable people. Being around a level-headed person with a firm grasp on reality was all it took to make me rethink my position and take steps towards seeing the world for what it actually is and dropping my delusions.

I've heard the phrase thinking it skilled work, and I believe it is true. It takes effort for many people to be rational, as superstition comes from instinct. Basic instincts or very human ideas like wanting to be loved, following the consensus, believing everything has to be created, fear of the unknown etc. Total rationality takes work. Even pretty enlightened people often have their foibles, signs of that primitive drive that still remain, like not wanting to open an umbrella indoors or having a lucky mascot. These things are nuts too when you think about it.

 

ok thank you for debating this with me but unfortunately I have kind of run out of steam on the issue (just cant be bothered to debate it with any conviction anymore). I am not one of those people who pushes ideas to the nth degree and beats on about the issue to the millionth post

I would just like to summarise though that what I thought I was arguing was that

it makes no sense to argue with christians anymore using their terms as that is an impossible method, attempting to defeat an idea whilst using its definitions and moving on from an impossible definition of a word to assert that other parts of their theory are false is ridiculous.

Furthermore, arguing with christians who are powerless to change the legal status of a religion is also pointless, better to argue with politicians and other legislative functionaries who can change things, such as making sure that schools cannot teach children that religion is anything other than superstition and false beliefs

also if the term "god" means absolutely nothing when christians, muslims, jews, etc, utter the word it must necessarily be true that the word has no meaning for atheists and so anyone who uses the word and attempts to construct a rational argument which implies that there is any meaning, even in the minds of religious delusionals, must be irrational

 

Yeah. The fact that you can't debate something through has a lot to do with you posting this thread. It's a plea to end debate, and just censor religion, treating it's adherents as insane.

You can not possibly treat an affliction that involves the existence of imaginary beings without discussing those beings. I'm pretty sure any psychologist would agree with me. If you ignore the imaginary friend, they.... wait for it.... just keep talking to it! AND it tells them that you're the insane one!

Arguing with each and every christian has a great point, and that's to use logic to save another person from wasting their life on dark-ages superstition. Good luck, sidestepping them and arguing with the RELIGIOUS lawmakers and religious leaders applying religion to everything.

God has a meaning. You keep saying it doesn't, but it's a cop-out, and a nonsensical one. How can you make such silly claims while claiming to carry the flag of logic and sanity?

This whole thread is a cop-out on your part, because you can't argue. If you can't play the game, change the rules, ehh?

 

Well I suppose I am an atheist... but I do use the word God quite a lot. It's not because I believe that 'He' exists or anything, merely that I have been brought up around people who do. I think that that is the case for a lot of atheists, we, as humans, pick up habits from others around us.

 

'GOD' cheer the fuck up.

How to i treat your condition?

 

I think we should all pray for his soul.

 

You win!

 

stonk, have you never run across perfectly intelligent people before whom for whatever reason also use words carelessly, and perhaps, occasionally act a little irrationally?

or, just use a word they may not like so that they may be more clearly understood by others?

something about some smart-ass saying something about god not playing dice with the universe comes to mind . . .

 

Tasty thought, I admit, but a roasted pig is still a pig, and a hot pig at that.

 

Oh really well I suppose the next time you are arguing with Bernard williams, Ted Honderich, or discussing the works and life of Wittgenstein you will just continue until everyone is so bored of what you have to say they are leaping out of windows simply so they dont have to listen to your considerably astounding and most fully rounded intellect droning on endlessly for hour after hour about the time you thought you had some atheists beat with the idea that you could prove god exists because the bible exists, or that you almost bored a christian to death with your theory that you read off the back of a box of matches that god couldnt exist because someonelse says so.

no its a deliberation on the value of words which have no cognitive or empirical meaning in a logical construction that is based upon empirical evidence.

and I am pretty sure that psychologists do not generally, or specifically agree with you

well if your interest is mindless banter using words that have absolutely no meaning with delusional zealots that have absolutely no authority then good luck to you too

then define god, and then tell me how you know that definition other than by some second hand evidence such as being told that is the definition of the word, and when you cannot find any empirical evidence for the the meaning of the word then good luck when you use it I look forward to having a rather rational debate with you about joe methdrinker, a local guy who lives in the park near us and is convinced that he is the son of a space commander called Ludovic "rabbit ears" aardvark, that has gone to fight emperor ming - he is convinced that ming is hiding in the bushes watching him. I am apt to disagree with him and yet you may find his arguments rather convincingly delivered and it may cause you to have a lot of great conversations with him, if you can understand what a muggenablaster is (which according to him is a mind control machine made out of invisible sharks with legs and it hovers just above his head but we cant see it as we arent him)

no the argument I have delivered is that its time for atheists to get serious on the issues and make legislative powers to prevent and contain the spread of the insanity that is being inflicted on children by theists. Their illness is affecting the politics and social well being of others and its about time we put a stop to it with legislation, starting with schools and other institutions and ending with the church itself

you might like to read up on how to deconstruct the arguments of others before attempting to argue with others you seem to have a penchant for 1)missing the obvious 2) attcking the wrong points 3)making assumptions you arent entitled to make and therfore becoming irrelevent

 

good one however einstein was referring to the fact the universe was operating on principles established by the observation of causally connected events, not on the existence of "god"

 

Rather than having one of us define god, can we agree on a definition instead? No one ever made a language to talk to himself....

Meaning doesn't need a vehicle if it has nowhere to go.

When you say god, you must have something in mind, else you are making an incorrect reference with the word. That's the god we are talking about.

 

In regards to this whole thread;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hfYJsQAhl0"]YouTube - Billy Madison - Ultimate Insult (Academic Decathlon)

This horse has been beaten so far past dead, it is glue.