Homosexuality, Christianity and the Theory of the Anachronism.

Discussion in 'Philosophy and Religion' started by Jimbee68, Jul 19, 2021.

  1. Jimbee68

    Jimbee68 Member

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    This one is for my Christian and gay board members. Specifically those who are wondering if they can have gay sex, and still 'save their souls'. You can, and I will tell you why.

    A lot of Christian morality (especially that stemming from the Old Testament) may be just an anachronism. Simply put, it was based on ideas and assumptions that presently are relics to history.

    I'll give you a couple of examples. People used to believe a man's semen contained his 'seed', i.e., a fully formed human (naturally they gave the woman none of the credit ;) ).So naturally any sexual activity outside of missionary sex with a woman, would be tantamount to murder. We now know that this is not true.

    Also some sexual offenses, adultery specifically, were not sexual crimes at all. In RC high school, they taught us it was a property crime, since the woman was just the property of her man. I also needn't point out it was a paternity issue. Interestingly, only woman were punished for this crime. I assume, I hope, we have all advanced beyond this.

    And Jesus said, all you really have to do is love God and your neighbor as yourself, the Golden Rule. If you believe Jesus is truly divine, you might even speculate, he foresaw all I just said. That is why he gave us the Golden Rule.

    So if there's love in your heart, why should it matter then who you love? Or how you show your love?

    Pat Robertson has said San Francisco may some day be destroyed like Sodom and Gomorrah. But it hasn't happened yet. And maybe he forgot the other thing Jesus taught us about sin. Let he who without sin cast the first stone. And I would add to that, people who live in glass houses should not throw stones.

    Do you see what I'm getting at :) ?
     
  2. Piobaire

    Piobaire Village Idiot

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    Bilby likes this.
  3. Piobaire

    Piobaire Village Idiot

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    It is worth noting that the Biblical texts containing the word "arsenokoitai" specifically proscribed sex with young boys. Female children were considered by God to be fair game, who could be captured, bought and sold as sex slaves, as young as three and a half years old (Exodus 21:7-11,Judges 21:10-24, Numbers 31:7-18, Deuteronomy 20:10-14, Leviticus 25:44-46, et al.).
    Something to keep in mind the next time you encounter Bible believin' Christians who hold the Bible to be the literal Word of God; "true and inerrant in all it's aspects."
     
  4. Toecutter

    Toecutter Senior Member

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  5. Tishomingo

    Tishomingo Members

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    It means literally "man bedder", and was apparently coined by Saint Paul. Paul also used the word malakoi, meaning "soft" which the King James Bible translates as "effeminate", suggesting that limp wrists might be a problem. John Wesley translated it as those "who live in an easy, indolent way; taking up no cross, enduring no hardship." The New International Version translates malakoi as “male prostitutes”, and arsenkotoi as "homosexual offenders". Not clear that's what Paul had in mind, but in trying to figure it out, it occurred to the translators he was talking about men who played the "active" (arsenkoitai) and the "passive" (malakoi) roles in the relationships.
    Paul, who first used the word arsenokoitai, was apparently also the first to say there was something wrong with lesbian behavior, based on the idea it was "unnatural"(Rom.1:26).This may show the influence of Stoic natural law thinking. Stoicism was big in Tarsus, which he supposedly hailed from.

    The earlier taboo against male homosexuality developed in Israel in the context of a highly patriarchal society. Sex was never a relationship between equals. To use a man like one would a woman was an outrageous assault on the foundations of society. Moreover, doing that was a common form of humiliation by conquerors to the males of conquered peoples. Leviticus 18:22, which proscribes men sleeping with men is thought to date to the sixth century BCE, during or after the Babylonian captivity, or a combination of both. Keeping Jewish identity and traditions was paramount during this time, when the pressures to stray would be great. All of the patriarchal societies of the time regarded males who took the submissive role as contemptuous, but the Jews carried it further and prescribed the death penalty for both parties.
    Lev, 20:13

    The prohibition in Deut. 23:18 against male and female temple prostitutes goes back to an even earlier time, the 7th century BCE, when King Josiah was cleansing the religion of foreign influences, including "sacred prostitutes, who were forbidden to bring their earnings to the priests The female prostitutes are called "whores" and the male prostitutes are called kelev כֶּלֶב (dogs). .None of the daughters of Israel shall be a temple prostitute; none of the sons of Israel shall be a temple prostitute. (vs 17) (Some modern gender researchers have questioned the extent or existence of temple prostitution in the ancient world--a controversy which is at least partly semantic.Matthias, 2010; Stol. 2016) I'm just goin' by what the Bible sez.

    Then there is Sodom, whose wickedness became proverbial Genesis 19:24 in the "J" (Yahwist) source, possibly going back to the 10th century BCE but probably reworked in the 6th century and the post-exilic period. This isn't your ordinary case of gay sex, but the male townspeople showing up to intimidate strangers, foreigners (actually angels, but they didn't know that; they found out the hard way). What was the sin of Sodom? Ezekiel 16:49 tells us: “Now this was the sin of your sister Sodom: She and her daughters were arrogant, overfed and unconcerned; they did not help the poor and needy” (niv) .Sound like anybody we know today (Don't say the LGBTs in San Francisco).
     
    Last edited: May 6, 2023

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