Gun Control Proposals For The Usa

I have been rational.

This has once again become a circle conversation with a condescending tone. I do not do those.

 

Yeah whatever liar

You posted those same proposals in the last thread you made. You're not fooling anybody. This thread is without a doubt a continuation of the previous one. You've exhumed a dead horse just to beat it some more.

 

I'm following along just fine. Are you? You repeat this proposal as you ignore my example about how guns can still be stolen from a secure spot in an owner's motor home or automobile, and my example of how it's still possible for a theif to steal an entire safe.

You do realize most gun owners need to transport their guns away from their home in order to practice shooting, right? They'd especially have to transport them to present the ownership of those guns after 6 months and every 1-5 years under your other proposal. Do you expect them to carry government approved safes with them everywhere they go (not that it matters because safes can still be cracked)? If they get their guns stolen from them during the transport outside their home, are they never going to be allowed to own again because they didn't show due diligence? Is the motor home owner with the guns who got their entire home stolen never going to be able to own a gun again?

In my hometown, an armed security official got whacked over the head and had everything on her duty belt stolen, including her pistol. Did she not follow due diligence? Should we blame her, the victim, for losing her gun to a theiving assailant?

Not at all. That would be like saying the gun theif is the victim. You must be missing my point still.

When you claim the gun owner gets robbed, your proposal places the blame entirely on the theft victim. For being a robbery victim, they must face a serious fine or become banished from future gun ownership. This is blaming the victim. Sometimes thefts still happen despite the all the preventative measures taken. Just as rapes still occur despite preventative measures one has taken. Yet I'll never understand why there are still people out there who will always resort to blaming the victim. Disgusting....

 

Rhad

I don’t think of someone refusing to debate as a win, in fact for me it’s a lose, it means I can’t understand why they think the way they do.

It means I’ll never work out why you think brutality is a good way of tackling the symptoms of society’s social and economic problems.

(An aside - Do people really fall for such obvious debating tricks as faux righteous indignation, Oh my I’m being belittled, I must go away and lay down in a darkened room -[SIZE=11pt]oh come on if someone was that thin skinned they'd never leave their house let alone go on the web[/SIZE])

 

[SIZE=11pt]Heat[/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt]It would only be circular if you repeated yourself if you actually addressed the questions put to you it would be linear as it is you seem desperate to cut it short- it’s almost like you don’t have any answers. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt]I mean can you explain your position. I’ll explain why I think it important – you seem to be arguing that such gun control proposals would have little or no impact on criminals or the irresponsible getting easy access to guns, undermining their validity. The problem is that you do not seem to be putting up any rational argument to back up your claim and when asked to do so, you refuse to debate further. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt]Are you able to back up that claim in a rational way because it seems to me that you don’t? [/SIZE]

(and that righteous indignation again - oh Balbus you are so condescending I too must go away and lay down in a darkened room)

 

[SIZE=11pt]6[/SIZE]
[SIZE=11pt][/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt]Oh maybe a should run away claiming I’m so upset by Six’s beastliness, oh my I’m going to faint. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt]Nah [/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt]Well you can only take my word but let look at it shall we -

[/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt]Yes, I posted the list in the last thread and I reposted them in their own thread to see if they could be built on or improved that is why I end the OP with - These are just suggestions and if people think of improvements please post your ideas. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt]YES -It was in that last thread and the pro-gunners had every opportunity to put up rational arguments against it there - they couldn’t , you couldn’t. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt]And if people like you couldn’t there then I’d ask why the hell are you coming to this thread?[/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt]Don’t you see it’s not me flogging a dead horse (I want to move things forward) it is you once more posting in a thread the same completely flawed ideas that couldn’t stand up to criticism in that last thread (or any other gun issue thread). [/SIZE]

 

[SIZE=11pt]Sorry 6 but what is it about due diligence that you don’t understand?[/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt]Due Diligence - reasonable steps taken by a person to avoid committing a tort or offence.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt]OK in hoping this make things clearer for you –[/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt][/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt]I had not put forward specific ideas on this but I had presumed they would be along the lines as those in other countries – here are two examples -[/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt]Canada[/SIZE]

Restricted and prohibited firearms

• Unload the firearms; and
• Attach secure locking devices to the firearms; and
• Lock the firearms in a sturdy, non-transparent container; and
• Remove the bolts or bolt carriers from any automatic firearms (if removable).
• Obtain an Authorization to Transport (call 1-800-731-4000).

Leaving Any Class of Firearm in an Unattended Vehicle

• Lock non-restricted firearms and locked containers carrying restricted or prohibited firearms in the trunk or in a similar lockable compartment.
• If the vehicle does not have a trunk or lockable compartment, put firearms and firearm containers out of sight inside the vehicle and lock the vehicle.
• If you are in a remote wilderness area and cannot lock your non-restricted firearms inside your vehicle, unload them and put them out of sight. Attach a secure locking device to the firearms unless they are needed for predator control.

[SIZE=11pt]United Kingdom [/SIZE]
FIREARMS AND
AMMUNITION IN TRANSIT
Carriage by Road – Section 1 & 2 Firearms & Ammunition
Private Individuals
7.1 When carrying firearms etc in a vehicle, the following steps are considered to accord with
the duty to ensure the safe custody of the items.
Vehicles Left Unattended
7.2 Whenever possible, the vehicle should
not be left unattended for long periods.
7.3 Vehicles containing firearms and left unatt
ended for any length of time should ideally have
an immobiliser and/or alarm fitted.
7.4 Where possible, they should be parked in a position that would frustrate attempts to enter the
vehicle unlawfully. (eg with the boot close to a wall).
7.5 Where possible, they should be parked where they can be overlooked.
7.6 For preference, the firearms should be stored in the locked boot or other secured load
carrying area of the vehicle. They should be out of sight from passers-by.
7.7 In the case of estates, hatchbacks and si
milar vehicles, the certificate holder should ensure
that:
a) where fitted, the lid or cover of the load carrying area should be in place, or the
firearms are covered and concealed to prevent their identification;
b) if the vehicle is to be left unattended for any length of time, the firearm and
ammunition should not be stored together;
c) where the boot or load carrying area is the most practical place, ammunition should be
secured in an appropriate container ideally, but not necessarily, secured to the vehicle;
d) where it is practical, the bolt magazine or
other operating part should be separated
from the firearm and either carried on the person, or kept in a locked container, ideally
secured to the vehicle, or concealed elsewhere.
7.8 Where firearms and ammunition are being carried on a journey which involves their being
kept away from their usual secure storage, the
certificate holder should make arrangements to
ensure that they are, so far as is possible, secure. Considerations when firearms are being taken
to venues involving overnight or longer accommodation include:
a) obtaining accommodation that already provides secure facilities;
b) separating and retaining possession of integral
parts of the firearm, eg the fore-end of a
shotgun, bolt of a rifle etc;
c) utilising portable security devices, ie security cords etc

[SIZE=11pt][/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt]Safes especially small safes have to be properly secured (often bolted in) if they could be easily carried away then it isn’t a secure safe and so it would not be showing due diligence be using it. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt][/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt]Yes she did show due diligence. [/SIZE]

Only if they were not following the laws about securing their firearms.

 

[SIZE=11pt]Ok – the pro-gun advocates have had ample opportunity to put up rational counter arguments to the proposals if they had any they would have – I believe they haven’t because they just don’t have them, it’s that simple.[/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt]And once again I wonder how the flawed and weak pro-gun arguments are still accepted as somehow valid in the US. [/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt]*[/SIZE]

[SIZE=11pt]Now – The proposals are just suggestions and if people think of improvements could they please post their ideas. [/SIZE]

 

Gun control laws are people who ebey the law. To me making it harder to purvhase a gun is not the answer. We should be concentrating on keeping illegal guns off the streets. The gansta people don't buy guns at gun shops, they get them off the street.That is what the government should be concerning themselves with.

 

Johnny

Did you read the thread before posting, because that has been covered and explained numerous times already (and Heat why are you ‘liking’ a post whose subject you know has already been covered?)

OK AGAIN –

[SIZE=11pt]Now according to the FBI virtually all guns in criminal hands were bought legally in the US by American citizens. They were either stolen from the legal owner or passed on to a criminal for favour or money. It would therefore seem prudent to try and limit those ways in which criminals obtain guns.[/SIZE]
If you read through the suggestions in the original post you will see that many of them are aimed at doing just that trying to keep guns out of the hands of the criminal and irresponsible.

AND AGAIN –

If you have any rational and reasonable counter argument against these suggestions can you please present them.

 

MeAgain would like to add to the list -


Mandatory reporting of lost or stolen guns.

Transporting of all guns across state lines prohibited except by license. A hunting license would be one type.

Once convicted of assault, battery, or domestic violence ownership of firearms would be prohibited.

As a compromise privately owned guns would not have to be registered unless they leave the private property of the owner, in that case they would need to be registered or a wavier or permit attained. (Such as loaning a weapon to a museum for display).

 

Some more ideas from MeAgain

1. improved and increased background checks,

2. outlawing the manufacture of assault weapons as defined by the federal government,

3. outlawing high capacity magazines as described by the federal government,

4. federal licensing of gun sale businesses, including internet sales,

5. background checks for all weapons purchased by trusts,

6. co-operation between state and federal authorities on background checks,

7. hiring 50 percent more personal to handle back ground checks,

8. hiring 2000 more ATF personal to enforce current laws,

9. increasing local, state, and federal co-operation to address mental health issues,

10. adding 500 million to fighting mental health issues,

11. having the SSA provide mental health information about those prohibited from possessing a weapon,

12. sponsoring research into technology designed to prevent accidental firearm discharge,

13. requiring state attorney generals to focus on gun trafficking,

14. allowing some health insurance providers to report mental illness issues about those prohibited from owning guns.

 

We're all for and fully support your second amendment rights! We just want to make sure you don't hurt yourselves so just a couple reasonable restrictions I'm sure you all can agree with (under breath: to make it so much of a hassle that it's virtually impossible for you to obtain and keep one bwahahaha gotcha now).

We'll sign right on! I mean nobody ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American people.

 

Christ, there was already a gun control thread right on top of this forum.

 

Lode

Shall i bump up all of the 108,696 other ones?

 

You're addressing me? While I recognize I have a few redeeming qualities, I'm still quite short of that ideal.

 

Name one...

 

Okay. Sabrominator. I'll name one "Sabrominator".

Now you name one. Let's see whatcha got.

 

Sabrominator? What's that? Your one redeeming quality is a bogus word? lol