God (or gods) do not exist

What if some things were not provable? Do you believe something could exist that can't readilly be proven?

And no, that's not "the way the world is", that is the way we've decided to describe and understand the world, in our very human understanding. Understanding that is, by the way, always lacking somewhat.

 

Looks like we are all digging on this thread. I edited my last post while northernlehigh97 and BTM came flying in within two minutes. BTM your points about the significance of intuitively arrived at knowledge make a lot of sense to me. Northernlehigh97, maybe it is the case that there is very valuable information to be had from "spiritual experience" or "intuitive insight" and that some valuable information can be extracted from religious texts. Surely you would not conclude that because you cannot decript a message, possible approachs not exhausted, that the message cannot be decripted; apply any type of encription you like, I can take the argument there by generalizing.

 

Or Jesus is true and all other religions are true. You forget that Jesus said anyone can do what he did, if the kingdom of god within us all is found and realized. The Buddha said the same thing, so do all mystics.

No one comes to the father but through Him? What does that mean? It doesn't say through BELIEF in him, it says through him. I can only take that to mean the Christ within, or, in another way, by realizing our Buddha-nature. From what I've seen, Jesus wasn't setting himself above the rest of us; we are all equally sons (and daughters) of God.

 

The question is, do YOU believe there are things that are not provable? Obviously I don't...

 

OR, they're all false.. I know which one I'm going for.

 

Empirically, objectively provable? No, there are things that aren't going to be proven that way which may exist. But they may be experientally provable. That only proves it to the one person though, so I guess you wouldn't be into that.

 

As far as the Red Sea crossing, and Mount Sinia, there is a lot of new evidence now coming in, we are really on the cutting edge here. These are some of the sites that talk about it, but I know there are others on line as well.

http://www.bibleprobe.com/exodus.htm
http://www.bibleplus.org/discoveries/redsea.htm
http://www.arkdiscovery.com/MtSinaiPAX.htm

The fact that there is more than one virgin birth story from a number of different cultures seems to indicate, that there was a reason why so many have considered such an event. If the Bible was just another Book that authored stories without proof, you could easily disimiss this as just another fabrication. Yet, if you consider the evidence for the Bible which is now being discovered, you might not want to write off the Biblical account of the virgin birth so quickly.

 

Well, if you believe that the New Testament writers falsafied the prophecies, that would not explain why the prophecies are still being fulfilled today. For many of the prophecies are being fulfilled without manipulation of the church. The Bible said that when the Jews return back to Israel they would take South Israel First, and then take Jerusalem second. This happened. South Israel 1948, Jerusalem 1967. The Bible said that Israel would nolonger be two nations with two leaders. Israel is one nation today, with one leader. Just as the Bible said. The Bible said that Jerusalmes East Gate would have an addition built onto it, and that addition would be sealed. This has happened. The Old East Gate is now buried, but the New East Gate was built on top of it. Just as the Bible said. About 400 years ago Moslems sealed the East Gate and it remains sealed just as the Bible said. Scripture states that the Gate will remain sealed until the Prince to come will open it, and all attempts to open the Gate before that will end in failure. Two attempts were made by Moslems to break the prophecy, once around 1917 and the other in 1967. On the very day they tried to break through the Gate, Moslems lost control of Jerusalem. First to the British in 1917, and second to the Jews in 1967. There are a number of other prophecies which the Bible said will be fulfilled before Christ returns. You can't blame their fulfillments on the church, these prophecies will happen because the God who authored the Bible, is in control of them.

 

Since I have no god...
I say:

" ...................................... "

Did I win?!

*Yawn* ...moving on....

 

well, you ignored the entire part about God Almighty's blood sacrifices being nonsensical. just like my christian friends; they also want to avoid that little bit for the awkwardness it causes.

the entire issue of prophecy about the israelites is interesting, because right next to all these prophecies are repeated claims that the israelites are god's chosen people, and whom he will return the holy land to, because he loves them, and wants to save them from the heathen (ie. those who are not god's chosen people, and to whom the holy land does not belong.)

...and they shall be safe in their land, and shall know that I am the LORD, when I have broken the bands of their yoke, and delivered them out of the hand of those that served themselves of them.
And they shall no more be a prey to the heathen, neither shall the beast of the land devour them; but they shall dwell safely, and none shall make them afraid.
And I will raise up for them a plant of renown, and they shall be no more consumed with hunger in the land, neither bear the shame of the heathen any more. Ezekiel 34:27-29

are you one of god's chosen people? i think you would probably be seen by god as an outsider, in this example. is the holy land yours, through heritage?

For you are a holy people unto the LORD your God: the LORD your God hath chosen you to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth. The LORD did not set his love upon you, nor choose you, because you were more in number than any people; for you were the fewest of all people: But because the LORD loved you, and because he would keep the oath which he had sworn unto your fathers… Deuteronomy 7:6-8

these verses of prophecy from the hebrew bible are directed at the jews, whom god reminds often are his chosen ones. to use them as a christian as proof of the prophecy of israel coming true seems absurd to me, because where do you stand, (heathen?). there seems to be only two - the beloved israelites and the rest of the world, the heathens. if god is, in fact, returning the jews (though they be few) to their rightful holy land, does it not indicate that god is blessing and delivering the jews from the "bands of their yoke"? that he loves them and blesses them and is happy with them? if the jews must go through the saviour christ to reach god, why would god "gather them to their own land, not leaving any behind. I will no longer hide my face from them, for I will pour out my Spirit on the house of Israel.." unless they're doing something right? in other words, if this prophecy is coming true, as you say, what does it mean?

maybe we should read another important part of the Old Testament before using it for newfangled means (yes, i just said newfangled ):
You are My witnesses, declares the Lord, And My servant whom I have chosen, In order that you may know and believe Me, And understand that I am He. Before Me there was no God formed, And there will be none after Me. I, even I, am the Lord; And there is no savior besides Me. Isaiah 43:10-11

 

I did not ignore your statement about blood sacrifice because I felt it was awkward. God deals with a culture where they are at. Blood sacrifice my upset you delicate sensabilities. But that was acceptable and understandable to the Jews of that time. It was also a future reference to the sacrifice that God knew Christ would have to make. For Scripture clearly teaches that with out the sheeding of blood there is no remission of sin. So it painted a clear understanding that a great and future sacrifece would have to be made,in order to cover the sins of the world.

God in Ezekiel clearly states that He is not returning the Jews to Israel for their sakes. And He tells us for they, meaning the Jews, polluted my name where ever they wandered. God says, He is returning the Jews for His Holy name sake. You need to read Ezekiel chapters 37,38,39. The day is soon coming when Russia and their allies are going to try to push the Jews out of the land by military force. God did not forget His promise to the Jews. The Bible states that God gave the Jews that land. When Russia makes this move which the Bible speaks about. Well, things are really going to hit the fan. Russia will discover they are not fighting the Jews, but the Holy God of Israel, who has been silent for thousands of years. God will destroy five sixths of their army. After this event, many around the world will know there is a God in Isreal. And the Old Testament states, that the Jewish people will see God above Israel on this day. And the scriptures state that the Jews will look upon Him who they pireced, and will morn for Him as one would morn for their only son. The Jews will discover who Jesus Christ is on that day. Also at about the same time, Christians around the world will vanish from off the earth, America cities will be attacked by Russia, and destroyed in one hours time. And the earth will experienced the most destructive earthquake since man has walked the earth. And a new leader will arise to bring order to the world. This future leader is described in the Bible as the Anti-Christ. He will pretend he is God and the Bible says he will be able to call fire down from heaven in the site of men. The Jews will built their third Temple on Mount Moriah, but will discover that the new leader is not who they thought he was. This leader will have a clone made of himself and it will be set up in their rebuilt Temple. The clone will be able to both breath and speak. All of the Earths population will be commanded to worship his clone as God. If you refuse you will be put to death. Everyone who worships the clone, will receive a mark on their right hand or their forhead. Without the mark you will not be able to buy or sell. It will be a day of horror on earth of devils and demons with human kind. All of this will end when Christ returns seven years later. The UFOs that you see today will be part of the future Anti Christ deception. That why all the earths population will be saying, who can make war with this man. The things describe here I believe are down the road and still some time off, yet I believe many of us will live to see it according to Scriptures time line.

 

Well you know what campbell34, when the day comes that jesus comes back and 'saves' all you christians, you feel free to laugh at me... but until that day, I'm going to laugh at you

 

Well feel free to laugh at me, but everything I just told you, is in the Bible.

 

No, it sounds more like very VERY loose intrepertation... But you go on kidding yourself..

 

Werent blood sacrafices only understanable to the jews 'cause God made them do these things?

 

Actually a number of Christians are stating the same thing I have just told you based on what God has revealed to them. Some by dreams, some by visions, and others by inserted knowledge. Look up end time Babylon on line. When I discovered these things about America, there were about two posts that adressed America in prophecy. Now check it out.

 

The first mention of blood sacrifice comes from the story of Cane and Able, there is no mention as to who got the idea started.

 

They laughed at Noah too..... then it started to rain.

 

hahahaha.....JDFU, i'm going to use that on my drinking buddies one day.

hey since you're about my age,

i want to know what you think of the instances of rape in the old testament? i'm talking about all these times that god tells his people to enjoy the spoils of war and everything, including all the girls who haven't had sex.

i'll name some parts as examples..

judges 21 10And the congregation sent thither twelve thousand men of the valiantest, and commanded them, saying, Go and smite the inhabitants of Jabeshgilead with the edge of the sword, with the women and the children. 11And this is the thing that ye shall do, Ye shall utterly destroy every male, and every woman that hath lain by man. 12And they found among the inhabitants of Jabeshgilead four hundred young virgins, that had known no man by lying with any male: and they brought them unto the camp to Shiloh, which is in the land of Canaan.

numbers 31 16Behold, these caused the children of Israel, through the counsel of Balaam, to commit trespass against the LORD in the matter of Peor, and there was a plague among the congregation of the LORD. 17Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. 18But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.

etc.

 

So you're saying God hooks up those who do God's will?