fuck them JWH-018 and 250 were nice (but gave me the odd uncontrollable muscle spasm/seizure -like symptoms and extreme paranoia every now and then), but it seems like they're just going downhill from there. maybe this is just hyped but: http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm6206a1.htm some of them are supposed to cause accute kidney failure You've got your immunosuppression from all the more CB2-selective ones You've got your infections, your immunosuppression, your organ failure, your seizures and your extreme schizoid paranoia and your uncontrollable shaking/muscle spasms. Sounds like these drugs are crap to me. Like I was saying, when used responsibly (which is difficult with a drug that you smoke tiny grains of off of tinfoil) were not so bad. You only got the shakes/fear if you vaped too much and the oral administration was great, but all of the new drugs they have spawned seem to be shit. I feel like the synthetic cannabinoids thing is kind of like the dawn of the RC stims/cathinones thing: and by that I mean, sketchifying the use of awesome compounds for everyone. I mean everything about them screams sketch, the naphthelene, the kidney failure, the "bath-salts"-like reactions, the sale in sketchy herbal mixes. The real culprit here is assholes who are drug testing people for their jobs (what the fuck is that?) but I still think these drugs are crap Thoughts?
true long time pot smokers don't bother with those fake weeds....they been selling fake smoke since the early 70s....ive never tried it and never will
what did they sell back in the 70's back before they came out with stuff like HU-210, CP and the Huffman compounds? I tried them back when I was on a drug-testing order. Seemed like a smart decision at the time, but may have caused some degree of lasting damage... And the new ones are even worse. One time I accidently ate a vial with somewhere between 50-150mg of JWH-018 in it while I was on benzos. I forget what I got it mixed up with. Since then I've had these shake attacks that get me every now and then whenever I smoke wayyy too much cannabis. Not sure if it's related, but, yeah, fuck these drugs...
rollin, the "fake smoke" of today is a lot different from back in the 70s, or even just a decade ago. back then, it was herbal stuff that didn't get you high. now it's herbal stuff, laced with ridiculously potent and untested chemicals...that gets you too high. but i'm with ya - i've never tried it and probably never will.
I hate to say it, but my LAST thought when reading this is "man, those drugs are just not safe". These substances are not particularly toxic in themselves. What's toxic is when people don't respect them. Unfortunately they are marketed as "fake weed" and so people think they can just eat a fistful of something that is active in the single digit mg range. I'd also be careful reading too much into the kidney failure reports; kava kava was also reported to cause acute liver failure in americans who bought it from online vendors, but what confused people is that the locals in Oceania who have eaten and drank it for millenia have no reported liver problems. Then they realized it was due to improper plant cultivation. The point is that it takes a long time for facts to get straightened out, and these things are still brand spankin new in the universe. So far most of the bad reports have been from people who flat out overdose on it. Well, overdosing on any drug is not going to be a good time. Are they as safe as cannabis? probably not. Are they very dangerous? probably not.
yeah most of us have made at least a couple mistakes with RC's. I won't be taking ay more synthetic cannabinoids though. These things are not chill. And they bring not chill people. Stimulants and synthetic cannabinoids were not good for the rc scene.
toxicity is in dose; dose is not done properly when there is a lack of respect. Thus lack of respect can create toxicity.
i hear ya there. but it's hard to dose ultra potent compounds like synthetic cannabinoids and NBOMes just for another example. so even if someone has good intentions with a blend or a blotter that they bought, they could still end up way too fucked up because the guy above them lacked respect. i would say that since these compounds are active at such small doses...that makes it easier for a potentially toxic overdose to occur. i'll agree that it takes lack of respect to some degree for that to occur.
I'm more worried about effects that will occur no matter the dose... like acute kidney failure. With synthetic cannabinoids, if you choose a bit of powder around the size of a grain of salt, you'll usually be fine -- and if you really wanted to be cautious, you could use an mg scale, but there's nothing you can do to avoid acute kidney failure. You know how much that would hurt if it didn't kill you? It would fucking suck. I don't understand what this Huffman guy is doing synthesizing all of these compounds. I mean shulgin kept on randomly synthesizing analogues in the same sort of procedure, but the he was synthesizing analogues of 2c-b and mescaline, which are GREAT compounds. Huffman and his team are just producing more and more analogues of what started off as a shitty drug to begin with... it's only gonna go downhill from there. Anyone know anything more about what they are trying to achieve with their research? I mean I could vaguely see how it could be valuable for doing tests with compounds that isolate specific receptor sensitivities of cannabinoids, but it kind of sketches me out that a guy like this is working for NIDA. I mean all of these compounds are being used to replace marijuana (mostly by people who can't afford it or by people who are trying to avoid drug tests). What interest does NIDA have in producing marijuana replacement compounds (and allowing their syntheses to make it onto the black market)?? If that's not sketchy, I don't know what is...
There needs to be a lot more research done before we can say that any of these compounds "cause acute kidney failure". YOU SHOULDNT BE TOUCHING THESE THINGS, OR ANY DRUG THAT REQUIRES A MG SCALE, WITHOUT A MG SCALE. I hope I emphasized that enough Any argument or story that starts with "I eyeballed..." sometimes leads to tragedy and almost always leads to me losing respect for that post(er). Would you eyeball LSD? I wouldn't either, and that shit is nontoxic! You have to understand that not only is this opinion (good drug vs shitty drug), the immediate medical applications of synthetic cannabinoids far outweigh those of mescaline analogues. Pharmaceutical and biotech R&D (as well as many/most other areas of science) work on the premise of "well lets make it first and see what happens, I think it will have properies XYZ, lets find out". Science is a discovery of things we don't know. They are making these new compounds because they are currently not made. One might be the cure for cancer. One might cause acute kidney failure. It doesn't mean there is something sinister going on. They are not "allowing" anything. They have no control over the fact that people who are interested in new and exotic highs will recreationally use their synthetic cannabinoids. They are working in a completely different context than we are when we take these compounds. They are trying to develop a substance that has all the panacea-like effects of cannabis, without being cannabis.
First of all, I don't actively use these chemicals, and if I did, I would scale them And, as to the thing about kidney failure, there has been some research done into it, and a lot of anecdotal evidence. It's not that these drugs will always cause kidney failure every time. It's that they're associated with it and are known to encourage it. I wouldn't say that this is enough research, but there is at least this: http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm6206a1.htm And I understand how the system for producing new pharmeceuticals works, I'm just saying it seems a little irresponsible given the nature of these compounds. I mean I see what they're trying to do: theyre for modelling how our brian processes cannabinoids. I'm just saying that now that they have gotten out of the lab, these chems are causing people A LOT of serious health problems -- especially considering that they are being used as a replacement for something very innocuous Personally, I first got my hands on them when I was much younger and less knowledgeable, and I though "oh this stuff is like kush but a 50$ bag lasts me a month. Hell yeah" Only now am I learning how poor a decision that was... I have tried a lot of RCs and I regret very few of them (with the exception of a couple misdosed trips and interactions), but the JWH was probably not a good idea. And 5fur-144 and friends will be a much worse idea. Compared to them, JWH-018 seems to have been pretty harmless.
We'd never get anywhere if nothing got done under the guise of someone abusing the results of research.
