Ethics beyond the animals/ conscious consumption

Discussion in 'Vegetarian' started by drumminmama, Nov 16, 2018.

  1. drumminmama

    drumminmama Super Moderator Super Moderator

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    I just moved from an apartment that was a stone’s throw away from a bakery I dubbed HaterCakes.

    We all know the story, in 2012, a fundamentalist Xtian baker refused to make a wedding cake for a same sex couple, and the Colorado Commission on Civil Rights came down on the owner.
    Last June, the US Supreme Court ruled, 7-2 in the baker’s favor, but not on his religious liberty, as he was claiming, but rather on freedom of artistic expression. The bakers secondary argument was that confectionary is his art form, and to create for a couple of queers appearantly ruined his artistic vision.
    He does call his shop Masterpiece Cakeshop.

    Locally, we boycott him. And he makes wonderful products.

    (On the artistic vision note, my ex and I refused to make tie dyes with crosses. We would refer people asking to dyers who were happy to do them. Aesthetically, he found crosses to be uninteresting and unchallenging.
    His style, which I replicate, has a lot of flame stitching. A secondary distaste for a cross also arose in how many of them appeared to be on fire. Burning crosses are definitely outside of our ethos. I get the basis of his argument, but as some wise fellow massage therapists once said, racists are not a protected class.
    Then 2016 happened.)

    I ran across a list of chocolatiers, small batch to industrial scale, from the Food Empowerment Project.
    The main spotlight is the use of clhild slaves in cocoa production, but other issues arise.

    At one time, they recommended Eden Foods. Now there’s a link to a Pittsburgh newspaper article from 2013 where Eden had joined other companies in fighting to deny contraception to its employees under insurance. (Like the Hobby Lobby case)
    Thing is, contraception is usually shouldered by the woman, at least when major money is involved. And insurance covers Viagra, the closest analogy in the pharmaceutical world insofar as it involves sex.
    But contraception can also be regulating endometriosis, cystic acne and other hormone related conditions, including perimenopause.

    My personal response is to avoid companies who have standards that are in direct contrast to my own. Maybe not a boycott in full, but I definitely use my dollars as a voice.
    For example, I neither donate to nor purchase from Salvation Army because their evangelical stance is in direct opposition to my own faith, and I avoid Hobby Lobby because of their paternal position on their employees health. I’ve avoided grocers who actively fought against their employees unionizing or engaging in collective bargaining in an area where most stores were union shops.

    So, where do you personally draw the line with company ethics?
    How do you respond to companies who have practices that impact their employees beyond the work day?
     
    rollingalong likes this.
  2. YouFreeMe

    YouFreeMe Visitor

    This is a tricky question. Whatever decision you make must be sustainable--so if you swear off of every company that uses x business strategy, you need to make sure you can follow through realistically without burning out and giving up.

    So I try and make priorities. I don't purchase or prepare meat or many animal products. I avoid buying from businesses that are known to be anti birth control for employees, or anti gay. I have started to avoid the purchase of products containing palm oil. Most other things being equal, I buy fair trade and sustainably harvested when possible.

    There are just so many options that there is no reason that you can't pick a cause or two and vote with your dollar.
     
    rollingalong and drumminmama like this.
  3. drumminmama

    drumminmama Super Moderator Super Moderator

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    Do you notify the companies/shops?
    If so what do you say?
     
  4. Meliai

    Meliai Banned

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    This is a really interesting topic and I wish it was in a different subforum. Ethical consumerism is something even us barbaric meat eaters can give some consideration
     
  5. YouFreeMe

    YouFreeMe Visitor

    You should start one, I would love to hear different opinions on this--you are right, it is an interesting topic. Not sure where the "barbaric" thing came from, though.
     
  6. Meliai

    Meliai Banned

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    It was meant in a joking way, doesnt always translate well through text :/
     
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  7. walkoflife

    walkoflife Some Assembly Required Super Moderator

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    There are numerous companies I boycott. I even write their respective CEOs (often in a vitriolic-fueled state) to tell them why I (and others) won't shop or eat with them.

    A few examples:

    • Salvation Army, Wounded Warrior Project and Susan G. Komen - will NEVER donate since they either treat employees like shit, refuse to fully support their causes, or pocket more than their fair share of donations;
    • IKEA - treat employees like shit;
    I refuse to align myself with companies who either misappropriate funds, mistreat employees or use animals to test their products.
     
  8. drumminmama

    drumminmama Super Moderator Super Moderator

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    Oh, I will direct people away from Locks of Love for the misappropriation of funds angle.
     
    walkoflife likes this.
  9. srgreene

    srgreene Members

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    The only moral interactions between adults are mutually consensual ones. It is an exercise in authoritarian rule to tell someone that he must do business with someone he does not want to do business with.
     
  10. drumminmama

    drumminmama Super Moderator Super Moderator

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    So any business can refuse their services based on something a person is? A hospital can refuse to provide care to a homeless person, a member of any minority, based on faith, or sex, or gender? Or because they have red hair, use glasses or like a certain food?

    Plus, I’m asking as a consumer, where do people decide they cannot or will not support a business based on the company’s actions.
     
  11. MeAgain

    MeAgain Dazed & Confused Lifetime Supporter Super Moderator

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    [​IMG]
     
  12. srgreene

    srgreene Members

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    The answer to your questions is yes, a business should have that right. It would be irrational to do so, as a business might be sacrificing profit, so that kind of behaviour would, over time, be deselected from the marketplace. Freedom does come with some cost- but you do not have the right to impose yourself on other people.

    A hospital might very rationally refuse treatment to someone with a substantial unpaid balance. Physicians in private practice in the US do that routinely. Now in most countries, hospitals are largely quasi-government entities, so please rea my next paragraph.

    The truly pernicious acts of legal racial discrimination (I want to make sure I exclude lynchings) have come when government discriminated on the basis of race. Government should make sure that its house is free of racial discrimination.

    BTW, you as a consumer have the right to boycott a business that violate your sense of ethics. Under what circumstances any individual might chose to do so is left to him or her.
     
  13. srgreene

    srgreene Members

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  14. srgreene

    srgreene Members

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    So open your own business and proclaim "No Whites Allowed"! BTW, I could still patronize your establishment (but probably wouldn't).

    What was reprehensible was a couple of years ago when Evergreen State University (a government funded "educational" institution) had a "no white people day". You can imagine the outcry had they had a "No Blacks" or "No Hispanics" day.
     
  15. tikoo

    tikoo Senior Member

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    I would not play music for a gay wedding . I do not respect this behavior be encouraged . Should I be
    required to , I'd make the music awful like a pukey salty cake . Too bad . The best wedding I ever played for
    was of a very old man and a pleasant young woman , both tripping I think . Grandpa Woodstock was there ,
    too . floo tee o floo tee oh inah de woo dze

    Touch me with sexual neurotica and you will in a flash of moment be rejected .
     
    Last edited: May 8, 2019
  16. MeAgain

    MeAgain Dazed & Confused Lifetime Supporter Super Moderator

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    That would be discrimination.

    Evergreen State University did not sponsor a "no white people day". A group of students called for the day.
    The college was shut down. The students reversed the normal "day of absence" in which those of color leave the campus for a day to illustrate their importance to the college.
     
  17. srgreene

    srgreene Members

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    True, it was not an "official" university event, and I did not claim it was. But campus police did tell a Caucasian professor they could not provide for his safety on campus. The university capitulated to the thugs and, per my understanding, did nothing to distance itself from the "no whites" day.

    Depending on the circumstances, discrimination can be an entirely rational action. I think we all practice it daily.
     

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