Eastern Gate: An Atheist's Worst Nightmare

When you accept Christ you become part of His kingdom, and it truly is within you. For when you accept Christ, His Spirit actually enters your body. Yet the Bible states that when Christ returns to this world, every eye will see him. The Pharisees were speaking of Gods physical return. Jesus was speaking of His Kingdom more in the spiritual sense, which involves all individually. The Kingdom of God comes to all who ask for it, and it does not come by observation.

 

All I have to say about this is that this gate is not my worst nightmare. It is simply a structure with mythology surrounding it. There is plenty of that around the globe. It isn't going to scare me into believing in god. All I see is the twisting of circumstance and events to fit prophecy and mythology.

Trippin is right, a PORCH is in front of a door or gate (regardless if it is covered or has columns and arches on it). Porches are not on top of gates. The door to my home has a porch, it is covered, and my front door in not buried in dirt underneath it.

And I believe it was Varuna (or maybe someone else - lots of pages on this thread) that mentioned that people have used the gate in the past. So it was closed and reopened numerous times. That fact is convienently explained away saying that the last time it was closed it was "sealed" but that is just BS convienent for argument. It could be opened and closed again, and you would try to fit it in with prophecy claiming it is just now sealed.

Something more than prophecy is going to be needed to convince the average atheist that your god does exist. Prophecies and prophets are nothing more than psychics. We don't believe in that supernatural crap. Accuracy is obtained through prophecies by making forseeable predictions and keeping it vague (without detail) so it can be interpreted to fit many places or events. Most biblical prophecies are spoken and fulfilled in the same book, making those suspect as it is. Others are vague interpretations. For example, lands surrounded by water...could be australia, south america, europe, whatever. Surrounded by enemies, enemies to the north. Once again, could be anywhere in the middle east, europe during WWI, WWII, roman empire, ect...

You guys are free to believe your prophets and prophecies all you want, but don't expect me to buy it any more than I would by a psychic telling me I would fall in love with a tall man with brown hair at some point in my life. I myself can look at the state of the world these days and make some reasonably accurate predictions of future events. I could probably make hundreds, maybe more if I put some time into it. Especially if I had a indeterminate amount of time for these events to take place. Prophecy will not sell me on your book or your god.

There are my thoughts on the East Gate, since it seems you guys are interested. Don't worry folks, my sleep has been undesturbed - no nightmares.

 

The East Gate Prophecy has nothing to do with mythology, but is clearly talked about in the Bible. The orginal East Gate is not just a Gate but was a building, and that is why they could use it as a foundation for another building that was built directly over it. Also, a porch is an open or enclosed gallery or room attached to the outside of a building, a verandah. To think that a porch can only be built on the front entrance of a building is almost laughable.

Then you go on and talk about lands that are surrounded by water could be any number of lands. Do you even read what has been stated. It's like saying a combination lock with the number 7, could be for any number of locks. Yes that is true, but all the other locks would have to have all the matching numbers to open them. I believe you are talking about the prophecies that speak of America. And you might be able make one prophecy fit other countries, but only America fits all the prophecies. America is the nation of mingled races and people, it is the nation that is built on many waters. It has mounted up into heaven, it is the nation that speaks with a great voice in the world, it is the merchant nation of the world, it has made the merchants of the earth wealthy from her abundances, she has her own INLAND SEA. She has a DESTROYING MOUNTAIN. she has a large JEWISH POPULATION, she is a land that is beyond the rivers of Ethiopia, she is a land that glorifies herself, the nations stream to her. And this land is described as a COUNTRY, which ruels out the Continent of South America, and Europe. And the last time I looked, Australia does not have a destroying mountain, an inland sea, or speaks with a great voice. Anytime you only consider only 5% of what has been stated you can walk away confident in your own mind that your statements are correct. I would sugguest you consider all the evidence presented, before you make any conclusions.

 

In most cases porches are built in the front of the home, but not always. That is why if you check on Answer com. they give three definitions for porch. and one of them simply states, ''an open or enclosed gallery or room attached to the outside of a building.''

 

GLORY! The Prophet FuzzyNutz is 100% accurate in his prophecies! Woooo!

 

The only way christians can make Ezechiel 44 mean what they say it means is to isolate it from the rest of Ezechiel and take it out of context.

If you read a little farther you'll see that in order for the prince in Ezechiel 44 to be Jesus, and in order for his passing through the east gate to be the signal for the start of the "Tribulations" spoken of in the new testement it would mean that you'd also be saying;


1.That after the rapture Jesus will decide to hangout on earth as an orthodox jew again for awhile (nothing about this anywhere in the new testement)

2. He'll reinstate blood sacrifice (also nothing in the NT. about this not to mention the fact that doing so would pretty much negate the whole purpose of the crucifixtion).

Ezekiel 46


1 " 'This is what the Sovereign LORD says: The gate of the inner court facing east is to be shut on the six working days, but on the Sabbath day and on the day of the New Moon it is to be opened. 2 The prince is to enter from the outside through the portico of the gateway and stand by the gatepost. The priests are to sacrifice his burnt offering and his fellowship offerings. [a] He is to worship at the threshold of the gateway and then go out, but the gate will not be shut until evening. 3 On the Sabbaths and New Moons the people of the land are to worship in the presence of the LORD at the entrance to that gateway. 4 The burnt offering the prince brings to the LORD on the Sabbath day is to be six male lambs and a ram, all without defect. 5 The grain offering given with the ram is to be an ephah, [b] and the grain offering with the lambs is to be as much as he pleases, along with a hin [c] of oil for each ephah. 6 On the day of the New Moon he is to offer a young bull, six lambs and a ram, all without defect. 7 He is to provide as a grain offering one ephah with the bull, one ephah with the ram, and with the lambs as much as he wants to give, along with a hin of oil with each ephah. 8 When the prince enters, he is to go in through the portico of the gateway, and he is to come out the same way. 9 " 'When the people of the land come before the LORD at the appointed feasts, whoever enters by the north gate to worship is to go out the south gate; and whoever enters by the south gate is to go out the north gate. No one is to return through the gate by which he entered, but each is to go out the opposite gate. 10 The prince is to be among them, going in when they go in and going out when they go out.

Like I said this is only a bit farther on in the story and it's obvious that the prince in Ezechiel 46 is mean't to be the same person mentioned in Ezechiel 44.

If you read the entire story of Ezechiels vision you'll see it was never mean't to be a prophecy of coming events in the first place but was merely a story of God dictating instructions for the rebuilding of the temple destroyed by the Chaldeans.

 

I'm in a hurry on this but if you read ezekiel 44:4 it states I believe his feet will be on the mount of olives in that day, and if you read Luke 22:39 it states that when Christ returns his feet will touch the Mount of Olives when he returns, so there is a reference to that in the New Testament.

 

Here is a good verse about what dirrection the Messiah will be facing when He returns:

Then the LORD will go out and fight against those nations, as he fights in the day of battle. On that day his feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, east of Jerusalem, and the Mount of Olives will be split in two from east to west, forming a great valley, with half of the mountain moving north and half moving south.

 

This is true. The fact is is the passage states when the Lord returns He will return to the Mount of Olives, which just so happens to face east.

Please do not attack me personally but only my message...

 

Well junior, Fuzzy you don't mind if I call you junior, you know I am 10 years older than you are, and it is obvious my kid has a far more respectable nature than I believe you ever will. I have to say I feel sorry for you. You really must of never learned how to speak to people without calling them names. I don't know what your life was like at home, but it appears you never learned how to speak to anyone without trying to insult them. Yet, if you don't have anything of substance to say, perhaps that's the only thing you can say.

 

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Fuznutz, philosopically, I'm dead center of you two...certainly don't go along with Campbell's and JDFU's extreme Christianity but neither am I an atheist nor believe that Jesus was imaginary, the Bible is hogwash, etc.

I've got to give 100 unbiased points to Campbell and JDFU on this aspect of the ongoing discussion...they've been gentlemen throughout, used very little if any bad language, if they "insult" someone it's not a direct attack on character, maybe more of an "insult to the intelligence" and that's a subjective thing.

 

Then please prove us wrong in manner that does not attack the person with vulgar names but rather the message we are presenting... That is all we ask

 

God said well over 2000 years ago in Ezekiel that when this gate found in Jerusalem facing east is sealed that it will remain sealed until the messiah returns and walks through it. It was sealed in 1517 and it still remains sealed today after almost 500 years and after several attempts to falsify the prophecy.

Interestingly enough, in Ezekiel it states that the messiah would not walk though the original gate but a porch of the gate which was an addition to the orginal. How could Ezekiel even know about such an addition hundreds of years before it was built. On top that, how would he have know that it would be sealed and when the gate was sealed, it would remained closed until the messiah reveals himself and is exalted. Furthermore, the fulfillment was not brought about by those who believed the prophecy but those who did not believe the Bible.


PLEASE NOTE: FUZZY will not refute this post I have posted this post so many times to him and each time he refuses to reply with anything of substance except one-liners and vulgar jokes... LET US ALL BEAR RECORD OF FUZZY'S WEAKNESS

 

First of all I need to point out that what Ezekiel was discribing here was a vision. Second, this is a prophecy which is believed not only by Christians, but Jews as well. Third, the Old Gate did not have a Porch which Ezekiel 44:3 speaks of. Forth, when prophecy is spoken of in scripture, it is often part of the text, but does not fit the text. And if you consider what is being stated in verse 2, the reason the Gate is being shut, is because the Lord God of Israel has entered in by it. Now, when did the Lord God of Israel enter that Gate?
Now the only person I know who entered the East Gate, who one billion people believe to be the God of Israel, is Jesus Christ.
In the Old Testament in Zechariah 14:1,2 it states that in the day when the nations attack Jerusalem, God shall defend Jerusalem. And in Zechariah 14:4 it states His feet shall stand in that day upon the Mount of Olives.
If you go to the New Testament in Luke 24:50,51 you discover that just before Christ was carried up into heaven, he led his followers to Bethany and then assended up. The ancient village of Bethania is located on the southeastern slop of the Mount of Olives. And as his followers were looking up and worshipping Christ. We find two angles begin to speak to them and say, ''Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven. The day will come when the nations of the world will march on Israel. On that day it will be Jesus Christ who will be standing on the Mount of Olives. And in Zechariah 12 starting at verse 9 it states. And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem. And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and morn for him, as one mourneth for his only son, and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for his firstborn.

 

Fuzzylives, are you the son of Fuzzynut ; )

PLEASE, I would like to hear YOUR educated respose to the east gate ; )

 

Next questions, Are you the member formaly none as ImFuzzyNut

 

You know how when you subscribe to a magazine, and you get your first copy in the mail, it is still full of those cards that try to get you to subscribe to the magazine? Well, that is exactly what is happening these days with most religious discussion. It seems to be a lot of advertizing and very little product.

I have always taken it on faith that there may be some actual meaning to all of this, that Christianity (and Judaism, Islam, Hinduism, Buddism and all human relationships with the divine) means something. I believe I have put out considerable effort trying to learn and realize this meaning and, when asked, I have gladly shared with others whatever meaning I am able to share. This is the way the religion is actually practiced.

Now, I would be more than happy to take part in this conversation with you. But if you are not going to bother to learn and apply the actual meaning of the tradition, if all you are going to do is argue about stones and stories, or worse yet, if you are going to hinder others from finding the meaning, then there really is no conversation.

I am sure you mean well, but when you forego the meaning for the symbols, when you ignore the spirit of the law for the letter of the law, then you risk (inadvertantly, I hope) playing the part of the Pharisees.

Do you ever wonder what they missed?

Yes, and so are you and so am I and so is everyone, whether they know it or not. In light of this idea, maybe a little kindness and respect is called for, you may be surprised what it brings to your relationship with the divine.

I believe the phrase is Eternal Life. I hope you know what this means.

If he were to stand there facing you, would you treat him with kindness and respect, would you allow your relationship to be one of love, truth, consciousness, creativity, wisdom, peace, mercy, compassion, mystery, harmony, and so on, or would you fight about mantras and symbols, and signs and wonders, and Dogma and Dharma?

I put some effort into these posts. Please respond, I would appreciate it.

Peace and Love

 

Yes, Jesus Christ is the Son of God, but He is also one of the three members of the God Head. And since God exist as three persons, this makes Jesus God. And we have the ability to become the Sons of God, are you one of God's sons? And I'm not into Dogma, only Biblical truth. And I would not have to fight with Jesus, because I surrendered my will to Him long ago.

 

I am too. Aren't you?

Umm, no. Jesus is a soul that feels God's will, as we all are. Of course, the actions that we see carried out are carried out by God, so our actions are those of God. This doesn't make us God, it just means we are moved by God, even someone who is confused and thinnks that they move themselves: God moves for us, these words are God's gift to us (me, you, everyone who sees them).

When you move I move... I like it like that... uhuh..