Do you believe that you are saved or that you need saving?

Do you believe that you are saved or that you need saving?

Most religions claim that we have all been condemned by God for some reason or another, and that faith in a certain God or his revealed religion must be adhered to to gain salvation. Most religions say that you cannot save yourself without their help.

Have you been condemned? Was it a just condemnation? What evil did you do to gain that condemnation? Have you been saved from it by your own efforts of the efforts of someone else?

Could you not do it on your own and did you need to pay cash the way religions tell you is required?

I show the poor thinking of religions and their adherents with this Protestant against Catholic view, but as stated, this issue applies to all religions.



Regards
DL

 

Being "saved" or being "slaved"?
Because the latter is highly indoctrinated with mainstream religion. The notion of being "saved" by virtue of following some rules and commandments is nothing more than being "slaved" by that same ideology.

 

I agree, when the ideology or God is idolized.

That is why Gnostic Christians are perpetual seekers the way Jesus taught us to be and not idol worshipers of our ideology and God. We have the best and are bound to stay in that position as we allow ourselves to embrace the best of the ideologies and their rules that are on earth. We never stop raising our bar of excellence.

Regards
DL

 

Once again you display the limited nature of your knowledge with the claim that this applies to 'all religions'. It doesn't apply to Taoism, Buddhism, Most Hinduism, Wicca and other types of modern Paganism, andI'm sure many others.

It applies only to Judeo-Christain -Islamic religions.

 

Seems similar to how I view my heathen path. I don't really follow law or rule, that's what's so beautiful about paganism, it's not about laws and rules, just guidelines on how to live a prosperous life and how to be a genuine person, but if you don't follow this then it's no big deal. You could choose to live through 3 guidelines and disregard the rest, that's probably why there's so many of them anyway in lots of religions because not every person is the same so you cannot really expect them to have the same ideals as you. There is no common sense.

For instance, many followers like me of the Asatrú ways hold Odin's words in the Havamal as pretty much gospel. To me they make great sense, but there's still "ways" in there that I don't agree with and don't live by. Odin is not going to send me to the depths of Hél just because I chose not to abide. He might tell me at a later date "I told you so" and we'll Prost! our mead horns together and have a good laugh about it I'm sure.

 

That all seems fair enough to me. I think that really, each one has their own unique path. That can be following a religion or not, depending on the person. I think for myself that too many rules make for a cluttered and difficult life. I trust myself to recognize good and bad and make my own decisions. I'm influenced in that no doubt by my entire past history and all the influences to which I've been exposed since birth, as well as things I've consciously tried to become open to over a long time now.

I like the idea of 'openess' more than 'finality', and one gripe of mine about those who pursue religions in a narrow or exclusive way, is that finality is what they seem to want. Everything sewn up as they say. I am suspicious of those who think they have all the answers.

 

I guess that you missed my use of the term revealed religions which are the ones you mentioned.

If you want to take a point fort what you put, go ahead.

Regards
DL

 

Yet statistics show that 70% of us use about the same moral tenets.

You have to get about more my friend.

I thus refute your view.

Regards
DL

 

"70%" "about the same"

lol, nice math.

 

Truth is all I care about.

If push came to shove, we would see most of the 30% use damn near the same moral tenets.

We are one species and share one psychology that is hard wired into our DNA.

Regards
DL

 

If the general consensus on this forum alone agreed with you, you might have a point, but you only really serve to prove my own point. So thanks.

 

Thanks, but both of you are only proving my point.

 

If I wanted the majority view and respected their view, I would take it.

It is mostly an immoral view and I thus reject it.

I prefer thinking correctly and do not care what the majority thinks as you seem to.

Regards
DL

 

Okay, well have fun not caring while you care and argue.

 

you said "most religions'"

 

Really??

Regards
DL

 

This is just another attack Chritianty thread. Get bored with the whole thing after a time.

 

Really??

When all there is to chat about is wording -----

Regards
DL

 

I think it's obvious, you're just talken shit now.

 

You raise an interesting point.
I always took it to mean that god was there to save you from your sins.

While many people who live a christian life (I do not mean simply attending church) do not consider themselves as sinners, It should further encourage them to treat others as they expect others to treat them.

To me, the downside is when people interpret it to mean that they can do whatever they like and a visit to church every Sunday will forgive them and then they can start all over again on Monday morning.
I think that the confessional in the Roman Catholic church tends to allow this attitude.