Do I choose to believe in something?

Why is there so much fuss going on in this world? Seems like everyone seems to think everyone else is doomed if they don't happen to come to the exact same conclusion about something.
Why can't people just recognize that what I believe in is not my choice. I believe that ill fall when I step off a building because I have experienced stepping off things that aren't so high that ill die when I hit the ground, but they still did hurt and pretty much confirm the fact that when I step off a roof, cliff, or whatever that ill fall. You can hold a gun to my head and force me to say ill fly when I step off a roof. But I still recognize that what im saying is wrong.
And when I don't know something... I simply just don't know, or cannot comprehend it. Why should I ever be punished for it? Ill get a bad grade on my test for not comprehending something sure.... may not get that job I want. But whats the crime in being unable to understand something?
I feel like these are some really important things to consider when discussing religions and beliefs. Especially when your interested in converting someone else to your way of thinking about something. Very simple basic questions, and they are so easily overlooked.

 

The sum of my beliefs being applied: I believe because I am irresponsible and guilty for it. Other than that I don't believe in nothing others have exploited for me.

 

"Do I choose to believe in something? " - No it's a deterministic universe. Everything causes everything else at every point in time and space. Everything is merely a series of interrelated events. "We" don't choose anything - everything chooses.

 

Double post.

 

I know, I know: the consciousness (of material being) is determining of the material conditioning of our, thereby defined, conscious Being.

 

We could debate determinism vs. free will until the cows come home, but quantum physics seems to allow room for indeterminism, at least at the sub-atomic level. Our basic programming seems to be set by genes, upbringing, and personal experiences. Within that framework, we make choices in response to, or anticipation of, life situations. I'm a Christian mainly because I was raised as one and live in a Christian culture. But like most Christians I'm different from lots of other Christians--because of a set of unique personal experiences, including education, belief in rationality, and new knowledge. Religion is more important to me than it is to a lot of Christians, and my particular brand of it is different from that of my family and associates--mainly in emphasizing Jesus as the champion of society's rejects (one of which I perceive myself to be). Many people who were raised Christians are atheists or agnostics, and if we delve deeply we can probably discover what factors influenced that. There are too many variables at work to make reliable predictions. I don't think there's a scientific basis for regarding humans as robots, and it's not useful in trying to find meaning in life--except as a way of trying to avoid personal responsibility.

I agree with the OP, though , that some religions, notably Christianity, place far too much importance on belief and doctrine. I think this is partly a result of misunderstanding Paul's teachings about justification through faith, and the sorry history of doctrinal squabbles over the nature of Christ.

 

Do you mean conscious [B/] or "conscious"? I don't believe in the conventional idea of consciousness (or rather what "I" think the conventional idea is). Our brains change constantly with the influence of other events. Those changes determine the state if the brain at any point in time. The state of the brain at any point in time determines decisions made by the brain. Decisions made by us are only different in complexity from a rock rolling down a hill, deciding to stop when it runs into a tree.

I think a better explanation of these decisions can be found somewhere in Richard Dawkins 1991 christmas lectures I think. It's been a while since I've watched them.

These lectures (along with other material) were of some help in my realization that I wasn't crazy in forming some of the beliefs I formed when I was younger - or rather the beliefs that the universe formed at the point in time where the series of events conventionally known as wcw was located.

What is your view on consciousness?

I can't get my responses out very fast. I'm at work and my phone signal sucks. Then again, I'm not fast anyway.

 

I though that quantum events can be random but those events are causes of eeffects or they would not exist to us.

 

Actually my view of consciousness for this debate on conditioning is concrete consciousness. But I'm not an expert about all of the psychology which instead becomes abstract. Truly we become aware of sub-conscious states.

But there is the other philosophical matter for realizing at new Laws of Nature, which is not against good deduction of the self-consciousness. Per self-consciousness we may also be conditioned directly by the ideal Being consciousness is conscious of. That is abstract Consciousness internalizing responsibly at work.:sunny:

 

Hmmm interesting how this discussion moves onto discussing consciousness. Im not going to say that it is off topic. It does seem to relate to my original post pretty well. Didnt realize it could go there.

 

I did chose my own religion. I just made up some stuff for myself.

tho I dont like to say religion because Im not religious.. Im spiritual...

anyways.. .you should not discuss world views with others in real life.
that will never lead to anything good.
when somebody brings up the subject I always just say whatever they wanna hear. that makes em happy and in return they leave me alone.
like... this person who is my friend thinks I m a Christian because I just nod whenever he says something about god .... yet I grew up in a non religious family and have never really believed in this stuff... and most of the things he says sounds retarded to me. yet I just nod and agree because he is a sensitive person and I don't want to ruin our friendship...
just try to be the smart one I say..

 

Consciousness should be an awareness of knowledge, but is it existential knowledge? Some would say: it isn't really believing which is developing the knowledge of existence. But knowledge itself is remembered for knowledge of our consciousness and supercedes any Existence to Be Known or Understood for fact. We read books or daily information with laws of reading to attach for value. So in a sense we put our trust in existence without existential knowledge.

All that it is is: we chose our religion, but our religion much a-due of our schooling in turn chose our existential knowledge. At least nobody monitors that about the passing Being we were conscious of for the time of our beliefs. It would be fun if we could be indoctrinated like Ayn Rand wrote about it. But it is the beliefs which are knowable, not existence.

 

It seems to me that.. people choose their religion. But what they beleive is not something they choose. They are convinced. And that is not a choice. I know that when I cut my finger ill bleed. I cant just choose not to beleive that I will bleed when I cut my finger.
Im not a self mutilator by the way.... and I never have been. Just using that as an example.

 

That's psychology, but what about the engineer deciding upon a method of structure while building a bridge? Now, I'm happy

 

I dunno what its like to be an engineer. I couldnt do it. My talents lie in mathematical/conceptual things, anytime im asked to do something practical and im crippled. Havent developed my skills in math much, which is a shame. I do pretty non-intellectual menial tasks for a living. Cruel world.
But anyways... I dont know if an engineer decides on the structure of a bridge, im pretty sure he uses his best reasoning and comes to the conclusion that this particular structure or plan works best for these circumstances. He could choose to use a crummy design, just to be arbitrary or as a practical joke. Or if there just isnt certain resources available. New issues just constantly come up. And the engineer makes the best choice possible. A more intellegent or capable engineer's reasoning will create a better quality structure.

 

You're right, you're right; one does not choose the beliefs about the mind in coherence with Matter. Matter is the non-ens, posited in the midst of historical Being nothing, for how it is to believe. Makes us totally irresponsible for faith in science. The mind is for choice of following some belief in the consciousness of law and order.