cops in L.A. shooting peaceful demonstrators!

Fox New's account which I am sure you would approve of verified, that the police started to move in before most of the group were ever aware they were supposed to officially disband.

http://www.dailynews.com/ci_5800948?source=most_emailed

 

mbworkrelated, have you been watching the news AT ALL? do you really believe that this you tube video is the ONLY coverage this event has gotten? the cops attacked reporters!

the LA mayor called a trade mission to El Salvador and Mexico short because of this!

they're being investigated by the FBI!

it's been all over CNN! this is at least the third article from CNN's website in as many days: http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/05/05/rally.clash.ap/index.html


if you need to view it from a different perspective, try reading any one of the several articles posted in this thread, or, if the associated press and CNN aren't good enough sources for you, at least google it yourself before you post ignorant judgemental statements!

and as far as children not being hurt, gardner, unfortunately they may have been:

my boy is almost 10, and i take him to rallies. it could have been him. as a parent, citizen, and involved educator, i have a constitutional right to expect shit like this shouldn't be allowed to happen to children or anyone, for that matter!

 

Oh come on gardener don't be so cliched - i do not give a toss were the source of the information is from. I view it all with the same level of scepticism. I thank you for posting the link it was one of the ''best'' i have looked at so far.

I did not have time to get into it - i have now. I was just judging it from what i was looking at earlier - hence only one line and prety much ''knee jerk' reaction at that.

That fox video is is ''better'' if that is the right word.
The video [above] is not very clear on what was going on just ''reaction''.

 

Yes i have but:
I'm in the UK - the ''major news'' here is of a little child being abducted and the local elections - plus a plane crash in cameroon . http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/6627605.stm

I'm sure it will be on the TV news tonight or tommorow -

So i have seen - i'm glad they are being investigated by the FBI.

I don't tend to go to CNN that much - if at all.

I just looked at it on the other thread you posted - i was commenting on the video provided THAT IS ALL.

 

man, i just don't understand not making them citizens.

 

I am glad you are looking into it a little more MB. That's shows you are open to information. I do value your opinions. Many times you temper the conversations with a moderate voice.

 

Absolutely - i love information - can't get enough of it.

Well thanks - maybe not always but i do try.

As i do yours - even if they are very different to mine - just talking to people that agree with me is very very dull. Hence me being here.

 

i have some criticisms of the above video as well, for example, when they first reported shooting, it was not clear that the bullets were rubber and not real - but it might have been unclear to the protesters at the time as well. remember it's a "real time" video made by a participant, not edited by a professional newsteam. however, i don't think it's a bad video, actually, i think the direct, personal accounts are vital in discovering what really happened. at any rate, this event has gotten so much coverage, mainstream and indy, i'm surprised you weren't aware of it.

just a reminder, the protesters themselves were supporters of immigrants rights, not all illegal aliens themselves, they had requested and been granted the necessary permits. one of the groups organizing the protest was a lawyers guild, according to the above articles. (note to any lurking cops, stings, narcs, etc. who may be reading this: if you're going to bust up a legitimate, peaceful protest with excessive force, make sure they're not lawyers first, because they know they can sue you, man! and never, ever hit a TV camera woman with your baton and not expect bad press. i mean, duh!) it has also been noted in all the above articles that the vast majority of the protesters were behaving peacefully. such a disproportionate show of violence, especially with children present, over a rock or two is way over the top!

another protest, including state legislators, was held in the park on friday, denouncing the LAPD's actions. apparently this time, the cops wisely kept their pepper spray to themselves.

 

Rubber bullets or no the Northern Irish can tell you that they can kill an maim as well.

Most or all of the violence I saw took place outside of the park where the legitimate protest was taking place, yet the police entered and continued to fire even within the park.

Never saw any coverage on the protest on Friday...would have liked to.

 

oops, sorry, misread your post, edit:

i do understand the need for making them citizens, but that's because i have immigrant in-laws and know how difficult it is to come to the US legally, even when you're employable and married to a US citizen. many illegals, it should be remembered, are fleeing economic or political oppression or violence, and have come here for safety and opportunity, the very ideals this country was founded on.

Engraved on the statue of liberty:
Give me your tired, your poor,
[size=-1]Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,[/size]
[size=-1]The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.[/size]
[size=-1]Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me[/size]
[size=-1]- Emma Lazarus, "The New Colossus," 1883[/size]

notice it does not read, "give me your doctors, lawyers, executives, research scientists, and university professors with politically convenient ideologies..."

 

I wouldn't have any problems if immigration was truly what was wished for, but Mexico wants more than that. Mexico grants dual/multiple citizenship. Where actually does the loyalty of these individuals lie? Being in California I've heard the rumors that some in power in Mexico wish to regain control....hell they already have.


But I still ask why is such a large country as Mexico so rich in natural resources and with a temperate climate still so reliant on US wealth to support itself? They should be a world power. The only thing that has held them back is greed and corruption.

They send their poor to the US inorder for them to send money home to their families, because in their own country corruption is so pervasive that only the few can ever better themselves.

 

A little bit like eyewitnesses saying ''I heard what sounded like bombs'' [after 9/11]. It does all look like the heat of the moment and if i had seen what was going on at the front - to be fair i'd probably be screaming my head off when I was coming back from it.

I know it was amateur - i do hope the guy who made the video hands it over to the police. He more than likely has already.

Nope i have not seen it - Did you read about our local elections ? - maybe your a little bit more 'on the pulse' than i am - but i just was not aware of it. There is a time lag on some storys 'breaking' here. As i said there have been a few other storys dominating 'our' news.

From what i have looked at now - it looks like it was a peaceful protest on both sides - then something kicked off. I do hope it is a fair and balanced investigation and suitable action is taken *reminds self to look on CNN more often*

 

in response to gardner's question about Mexico, and why their people are coming here:


yes, the Mexican government sould be responsible for its people's well-being. unfortunately, it's not. it exploits them instead.

massive government corruption, in a nutshell.

unfortunately i'm not as educated as i'd like to be on the subject, but I have attended panel discussions on the political situation in Mexico (specifically Oaxaca) with the Rochester Commitee on Latin America. The gap between those in power and the common people (many of whom are indiginous and have been on that land since before the conquistadors), between the haves and have-nots, is enormous and unjust. It is also important to remember, we have a certain political and economic structure here in the states that we take for granted, and tend to assume that every powerful country must have something similar. The distribution of land, resources and wealth in Mexico is very different than the system we have here, and has always been so. There is a terrible amount of exploitation and suffering. Many Mexican immigrants come here to get education for their children. Mexican schools very often don't even have adequate, up-to-date books.

i'd be eternally grateful if someone who is more educated on the situation in latin america and better able to explain and illustrate it than i would shed some light on it, so we would better understand why these people are flocking to us for refuge and why a pathway to citizenship is so crucial.

edited to add, as a matter of fact i have been at least skimming articles about the elections in England, and one of my favorite news sources is the BBC, but like you i've been distracted by events in my own country. i do tend to keep on top of current events - mainly because i'm trying to avoid personal stress in my own life - but i do check CNN, BBC, and other newsites several times a day.

 

We have something in common.

 

I have many Mexican/illegal friends and I've ask them why they leave their families and come here to work and always it's because even though they are exploited here, the exploitation is less here than in their own country. Yet we are allowing our administration and the corrupt administrators of Mexico to form our world for years to come.

Education is a huge factor. In Mexico to send your children to school costs money. They can come here and work and be treated like dirt, but their kids do get an education.

 

They can't find work in most of Mexico, because their wealthy don't invest in their own country they don't provide jobs, they only exploit. I wonder if sometime soon that might hold true for the US as well.

 

i'll post some of the links that i got at the ROCLA meeting, there's more information about the situation in Mexico. unfortunatley at present mommy duty is calling and i have to take my son over to my ex's to get a toy he forgot.

i do know that the situation in Oaxaca is largely about the schools and protesting teachers trying to get books, etc. incidentally, speaking of first-hand-experience Indy journalism, at the ROCLA meeting I attended we viewed a video by an Indy Media journalist who was shot when real bullets were fired on a demonstrating crowd in Oaxaca. The journalist essentially recorded his own murder. I may be able to get a link to the video. If I can, I'll post that too.

 

Since it's Cinqo De Mayo today my prayer for Mexico would be that somehow they could find another Juarez to lead them. I used to talk with my Mexican friends about this, but most of them had no hope that it could ever happen.

 

many people get all huffy about "these illegals sneaking into the country" and "why can't they come here legally?" that is the argument of privelegde. we forget why they come here, what they're leaving, how desperate they are. we have no right to go playing self-declared world "freedom police" while turning a blind eye to the exploitation and injustice right next door, and turning the suffering away.

incidentally, very few Iraqui refugees are admitted to this country, too, according to a newspaper headline i saw the other day. we go over there uninvited, bust up the place, tell them what kind of government to have, but will we let them in to escape from the hell we helped create? Nooooooo...

and if we really don't want them coming here unless they're wealthy doctors or research scientists or something, then we shouldn't set ourselves up as some sort of world-protector-freedom-melting-pot, and we should get rid of that big ol' copper eyesore in NY Harbor, because it doesn't mean anything anymore.

edited to add: Anne Frank's family couldn't even make it here during the holocaust, even with powerful friends:
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=7400998

why are we surprised that so many come here illegally if we make the legal path to citizenship so difficult?

 

Another article from CNN:
http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/05/05/immig.la.police.ap/index.html

it's starting to look like the cops were the ones who instigated the violence, in spite of claiming to be responding to rock-throwers.