Copenhagen, Dk help needed! :)

Discussion in 'Denmark' started by Silbermond, Jun 10, 2006.

  1. wolf_at_door

    wolf_at_door Senior Member

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    Nej, men du må forstå at dansk er et af de aller-sværeste sprog at forstå i hele verden. Især fordi grammatikken er så ulogisk - og jeg kan se, at du forstår kernen i både sproget & de grammatiske bøjninger. For helvede - du har kun levet i Danmark i 1 år... Der findes immigranter her i landet, som har boet her 20 år, som kun kan sige "davs", "mange tak", og "godaften"...
    Men jeg kan selvfølgelig godt se problematikken - det kan være svært at følge et komplet studie på et sprog som man ikke føler sig 100% sikker på. :)

    Da jeg stadig boede hjemme ved min mor & far, kørte vi altid til Grækenland hver sommer. Før 1989 kørte vi gennem Jugoslavien, men da der blev åbnet for de Øst-europæiske lande, efter 1989 tog vi turen gennem Tyskland, Polen, Tjekkiet/Slovakiet, Ungarn, Rumænien, Bulgarien, Grækenland.
    Så jeg har været transit et par gange gennem Budapest, og byen har altid fascineret mig. I 1990 (såvidt jeg husker) brugte vi en hel dag i Budapest, og vi syntes at byen var meget smuk & spændende.
    Kommer du selv fra Budapest?

    btw, Husk - Fortæl mig bare, hvis jeg skal skrive lidt mere på engelsk eller hvis jeg skal skrive lidt mere simpelt dansk. Jeg skriver kun dansk fordi du har skrevet, at du gerne vil trænes sprogligt.

    Please tell me, if you want some of this translated to english... I'm only writing danish because I wanna practicise your danish language, as you asked me to do. But please tell me, if it's too much! ;)

    KH wolf. :)
     
  2. mad_scientist

    mad_scientist Member

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    Jeg, men det kan du ikke reformere - jeg er meget ked at sige at Ungarn er ikke en logisk plads. Det kan normale mennesker aldrig forstår men det kan jeg heller ikke selv om jeg bor der... Både studerenderne og lærerne er sikkert at det er det bedste system som de har nu. Du må ikke have argumenter. Hvis du henviser til de danske (eller til vesteuropaeiske) eksamer du er "doven". Hvis du ville blive jurist, du må lide - det er det fundamentale princip i Ungarn.
     
  3. wolf_at_door

    wolf_at_door Senior Member

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    Jura er jo også en klassisk uddannelse. Jeg tro man kan finde meget af den samme mentalitet indenfor klassiske uddannelser på vesteuropæiske universiteter.
    Hvad jeg derimod pirrer min nysgerrighed, er hvordan mentaliteten så er på de moderne IT-uddannelser og kommunikations-uddannelser, etc. etc. i Ungarn? For sådanne uddannelser er i sagens natur globalt orienterede, hvis du forstår? Disse uddannelser kan ikke være konservative - de er ens overalt i verden.
    Jeg tror at disse uddannelser bliver mere og mere ideal for fremtiden. Til sidst bliver de klassiske, konservative uddannelser (såsom f.eks. jura & økonomi) nødt til at reformere sig - ellers dør de. De bliver dræbt af fremskridtet, hvis de ikke forandrer sig.
    Det er denne forandring som gennem-syrer alle de vest-europæiske lande, og selvom jeg ved at alle de øst-europæiske lande er godt på vej, er der måske stadig et stykke at indhente på den front?
    Jeg tror at de nye IT- og kommunikations-uddannelser, og hele den mentalitet som følger med, vil blive et globalt paradigme - også i Ungarn og andre øst-europæiske lande, og det vil jura-studiet i Ungarn også komme til at indrette sig under.
    Så jeg tror ikke du skal være bange for at de konservative left-overs fra jeres kommunistiske fortid skal vare evigt. Øst-europa er godt på vej til at blive ligeså dynamisk som Vest-europa.
    Jeg håber bare at I finder en alternativ vej end den visions-løse forbruger-mentalitet, som hersker i Vesten.

    KH wolf.
     
  4. mad_scientist

    mad_scientist Member

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    Første gang kunne jeg ikke forstå hvorfor danskerne går til Ungarn, Grækenland eller til Yugoslavien i vores biler. Men senere hørt jeg at de har 6 uger ferier. :)

    Jeg kommer ikke fra Budapest, men jeg studerer der. Min by er 65 km langt fra Budapest og den hedder Székesfehérvár.

    Nej tak, du skal ikke skrive mere på engelsk! Eller jeg vil bede dig om at skrive på engelsk.
     
  5. mad_scientist

    mad_scientist Member

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    I morgen kommer jeg tilbage og svarer til din post, men nu er jeg så træt at jeg må gå til seng.

    Godnat!

    m_s
     
  6. wolf_at_door

    wolf_at_door Senior Member

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    Det er jeg egentlig også. Jeg vil også sove.

    Godnat. :)
     
  7. mad_scientist

    mad_scientist Member

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    Det kan de... Alt kommer fra det ungarske mentalitet. Hvis du vil gerne få et diplom du må lide. Ellers det fortjener du ikke. I Ungarn har de gamle universtiteter en høj prestige med gamle metoder. Det er det grundlæggende princip at du er en "ikke nogen" når du studerer på universitetet. Universtiteterne kunne godt være de bedste pladser hvis eleverne var ikke der for at forstyrre deres spændende lærer. Måske kan du sige at du kan ikke forstå hvorfor eleverne ville ikke forandre dette system. Det er tre furnufte:

    1. Ikke nogen garanterer i Ungarn at du kan faktisk få et diplom hvis du konfronterer med dine lærer.
    2. Mange elever er doven og tænker: jeg har kun 1-2-3-4-5 år til diplomet - jeg vil lave ikke noget.
    3. Andre elever er hovmodig med at studere på disse universiteter!

    Det er det største problem at unge lærere er ikke bedre. Selv om de alle har allerede været i vesteuropa og har allerede studeret der, de ville blive den samme arrogant som de gamle lærer.
    Jeg er ked at sige der er mange konformiste mennesker i Ungarn. Jeg ofte siger at Ungarn kunne stadig væk være et kommunistisk diktatur hvis brendselet og øl blev ikke dyrt i 80erne...
    Selvfølgelig ved jeg at tinge vil skifte men jeg tror virkelig ikke at det sker i mit liv. Og jeg har kun et liv derfor vil jeg gerne flytte til en roliger og mere humanistisk plads hvor mennesker respekterer hinanden bedre.

    Jeg synes at livet er ikke så hårdt i Ungarn nu som det var i mid-90erne. Arbejdslønerne steg med 34 procente medlem 2003 og 2006. Af denne grund, er dette mentalitet desværre blevet temmelig udbredt også i Ungarn. Jeg kan desværre sige at det er fashionabelt. Der er mange ungarske mennesker som køber fx nye biler selv om de svømmer i gælden! Jeg synes at det er virkelig farlig.
     
  8. mad_scientist

    mad_scientist Member

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    farligt. :)
     
  9. mad_scientist

    mad_scientist Member

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    Ja, men det kan du ikke reformere.. Og måske mange andre fejler... Jeg often blander tinge når jeg skriver...
     
  10. mad_scientist

    mad_scientist Member

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  11. wolf_at_door

    wolf_at_door Senior Member

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    Sådan som jeg ser det, er problemet på de ungarske universiteter, og højst sandsynligt også på universiteter i de andre tidligere kommunistiske lande i Øst-Europa, at diktaturet ikke gav jer mulighed for at deltage i det ungdoms-oprør, som den vestlige verden deltog i i 1960'erne. Grunden til at vi rent faktisk har så frie universiteter i Vest-Europa som vi har i dag, skyldes at det rent faktisk lykkedes at gennemføre en kultur-revolution i slutningen af 60'erne. Jeg ved at studerende i især Prague i daværende Tjekkoslovakiet også følte sig meget inspireret af ungdoms-oprøret i vesten, men diktaturet slog hårdt & brutalt ned på enhver form for kritik - oprøret blev kvalt af systemet.
    Så selvom de øst-europæiske lande idag har samme demokratiske status som de vest-europæiske lande, mangler de stadig at indhente dette nødvendige ungdoms-oprør - den kulturelle revolution.
    Derfor er jeres universiteter stadig så elitære. Men vi er nu heller ikke så perfekte, for nu er vores universiteter blevet gjort elitære igen - bare på en anden måde: Nu er det business-people som bestemmer hvad der skal foregå på de vestlige universiteter. Al den demokrati som 60'erne har tilegnet sig på universiteterne er eroderet, og kapitalen har koloniseret de demokratiske institutioner som man har fået bygget op.
     
  12. wolf_at_door

    wolf_at_door Senior Member

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    No problem! Jeg forstår dig ganske fint! ;)
     
  13. wolf_at_door

    wolf_at_door Senior Member

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    Hov, jeg glemte at svare på hvad "sgu" betyder...

    Det er lissom "fandme", "satme", du ved - et bande-ord - a swear, you know... ehm, I swear too much... undskyld! [​IMG]
     
  14. mad_scientist

    mad_scientist Member

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    Sorry for interrupting the conversation, but there is something interesting going on in Hungary!

    Today afternoon, a scandal broke out in connection with the former-new Hungarian government. At half past 11 pm(!) people went to the Parliament to protest against the prime minister in the rain with umbrellas. They are still there, and some other people also went to the palace of the president of Hungary and to the prime minister's villa.

    Now it's 1:41am and even more people are protesting in towns in the countryside.

    This is very very strange in Hungary, I am really surprised!
     
  15. wolf_at_door

    wolf_at_door Senior Member

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    Yeah, I've heard about it. I am chocked!. Ofcourse your prime minister has to go. He has been caught saying that he'd been lying to the people. He obviously haven't got any democratic sense, and you simply can't have a prime minister with such an attitude, signalling a total lacking respect towards the democratic spirit in a democracy.
    What I've heard is, that it's mainly the right-wing protesting, but I don't know if that's true? However, I don't think right-left-issues are important at all in this case. The man was supposed to represent the hungarian people and he's being caught laughing his ass off. It's a big, big insult to the voters, and his attitude seems especielly more insulting & arrogant as he don't even take the consequence and simply say: "ok, I screwed up - I better go". What a jerk...
     
  16. mad_scientist

    mad_scientist Member

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    Yes, I think the same that's why i'll also demonstrate.

    Here are the most disgusting excerpts from his speech after having been re-elected:

    "There is not much choice. There is not, because we have screwed up. Not a little but a lot. No country in Europe has screwed up as much as we have. It can be explained. We have obviously lied throughout the past 18 to 24 months. It was perfectly clear that what we were saying was not true.
    We are beyond the country's possibilities to such an extent that we could not conceive earlier that a joint government of the Socialists and the liberals would ever do. And in the meantime we did not actually do anything for four years. Nothing.
    You cannot mention any significant government measures that we can be proud of, apart from the fact that in the end we managed to get governance out of the shit. Nothing. If we have to give an account to the country of what we have done in four years, what are we going to say?"

    "I almost perished because I had to pretend for 18 months that we were governing. Instead, we lied morning, noon and night."

    "Is the healthcare system amended, my son? I reply: Bullshit, mom!"

    "The divine providence, the abundance of money in the world economy, and hundreds of tricks you obviously don't have to know about helped us to survive this situation."
     
  17. mad_scientist

    mad_scientist Member

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    And I am also shocked when it comes to demonstrations when he said:

    "It's OK to protest in front of the Parliament. Sooner-or-later they will get bored of it and go home."

    Hundreds thousands of people have been protesting calmly in the preceeding days. And then he said he wouldn't give a shit to them, no matter how long they protest in front of the Parliament. Then should I be surprised when I see mad football hooligans occupying the state TV? (Which is otherwise the shame of this country as the whole Hungarian media is everything but objective and balanced.)
     
  18. mad_scientist

    mad_scientist Member

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    I don't know either. Maybe it is rather the right wing than the left, but even so it is the biggest shame of this country that there are no minimal public morals that are accepted by everyone regardless of political opinion. I think this is the biggest disease of this country!

    I have a very bad presumption about the Hungarian society, maybe the communal elections will verify it. That is to say, the postcommunist hungarian left wing party is supported by 3 million constant voters who always support their party no matter what they say or do. (There are two big parties in Hungary, one is the governing party and the other is the conservative right wing.)

    You can't imagine what this jerk is telling now to people! The whole left wing (and of course the liberals too) say that they are proud of having been honest! Because all the politicians have lied in Hungary (and in the world too) but they are the first ones who want to change it!

    The self governmental elections will show whether their voters will eat this demagogic and ridiculous argument or not. If the socialist party won't be demolished at the coming local governmental elections, then my presumption will be verified.
     
  19. wolf_at_door

    wolf_at_door Senior Member

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    I'm still chocked, but after these quotations, I'm even more chocked. It's more absurd than even the most absurd theater. And it's even more absurd if you can point out one single hungarian citizen who can't see why it's absurd.

    Unfortunately democracies are full of assholes. If you were living in a totalitarian state, it would be easy to point out the assholes - cuz that's obviously those in power!
    But in a democracy it all seems a bit more diffuse, you know. Because anybody can call him/herself a democrat, but just a few of them really are...

    The people got the responsibility to control their government - it's not enough to lay back and believe that the parliament will do it. And the hungarians are doing that well right now, I think. :)

    Well, I have just decided to take a trip to my local pot-head bar for a couple a hours, to chat with all the potheads down there. I'll try to hear if they're having an opinion on all this about the situation in Hungary, but propably they'll just start to talk about legalizing cannabis - as usually... ;)

    But - anyway - what's happening in Hungary is interesting, so please inform about any new development at this forum. :)

    love and understanding,
    -wolf-
     
  20. mad_scientist

    mad_scientist Member

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    Here's CNN's interview with the prime minister. It tells everything - it's not only his english that is the shame of this country...

    Part 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d2WVdLeR97Y
    Part 2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9JJWIkzerUg

    If the CNN hadn't come to Hungary we would have never had a tv channel or press who would've dared to ask these questions from the prime minister. Not even the public tv which is almost used as their campaign channel. (Because they simply don't give interviews to right wing medias who would otherwise dare to ask more tough questions.)

    This country is a disaster.

    I am really curious about Your mates opinion although I don't know what "pothead" means. :)
     

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