CIRCUMCISION (A sensible discussion)

^^ Good for you man.

 

I'm happy too.

Hey, do you think real Sex Therapist would object to someone representing themselves as a Sex Therapist? I'm just wondering about the legal ramification?

 

Where is the info to debunk the theory that circumcision is not a STD preventative ?

I watched a doco' that explains why un-circumcised men are more prone to HIV than circumcised men.

I would like to know either way.

 

GentleBen- I may have seen the same "doco" you did. The one I saw was very compelling. Basically the women used overlay maps of the highest insidences of AIDS and at the same time compared that with the places where circumcision was or was not the custom. The rate among rate among peoples where circumcision was not the practice seemed to have a much high rate of infection.

I turns out the the foreskin has a specalized fat cell unique to this highly specalized tissue that can act like a conduit for the virus.

I happen to agree with budhoney and appriciate people believe int he "genital integrity of all infant males and females". But we have to modify our views in places like Africa where people are dying by the millions.

The fact that the U.S. has such a high incidence may be do to the practices of the homosexal pop. IMO.

 

It should also be noted that another primary cause of the spread of AIDS is not in any way sexual, but by the use of hypodermic drugs - another thing that it prevalent in America.

 

im uncircumsided and been sort of self concious about it my whole life. Even though ive gotten blow jobs from women who later told me they sincerely couldnt notice, when im not hard it just looks unappealing to most women, as im told.
my first blow job, which should have been the best night of my life to date, was akward and embaressing. I feel like several women have been steered away by this fact.
I also think im so sensitive that i cum in litereally a minute, without alcohol or meds(which I take that prolong sex to as long as i want).
On the upside, I can cum many times in a row, almost back to back. when i was a teenager I had sex 6 times in a row, my girlfriend at the time loved it. As i get older, Im more comfortable with myself and think ill be having great sex for longer than i would if i were cut. I do have to shower more thouroghly and i do have problems pissing in a public restroom full of guys. Im being totally honest, hope you appreciate it.
But girls have told me im great in bed, ive given girls orgasims that had probs gettin them in the past, so I dont know if it balances out. I just have to say to parents that are on the fence on this, imagine being a boy getting changed in a locker room full of guys and your dick looks different than everybody elses./ it gave me a lot of anxiety and still does to this day.
In the end, Im as nature intended , AND I do Love sex to the point i might be an addict. Im 28 and can still go 1-4 times a day if its available( id be satisfied with once tho) , I dont know how much that is related. I just need to find a chick who xan keep up with me and ill be set cause im sick of begging from my current girlfriend(fighting over sex is just stupid and shouldnt happen IMO, but what can one do?)....hope this helps

 

I have an ongoing problem which, although I keep putting it off, I know I really much go see my GP about sometime. I'm just hoping against hope that it won't involve any sort of circumcision surgery, although I do accept that this may well be an unavoidable option.

The problem is one similar to phimosis, although unlike phimosis it's not the frenulum that's affected, but the upper regions of the foreskin, where the skin is literally splitting apart. This also has a consequential problem of the scar tissue that it creates tightens the wounded area, which makes the whole condition self perpetuating.

The result is that the foreskin, when pulled back over the glans is visibly tighter than the skin along the rest of the shaft.

I accept that much of the splitting is caused by masturbation which may well be something that I am addicted to, but I don't consider that 1 - 3 times a day can be considered to be in any way excessive.

At present I have tried standard over the counter antiseptic lotions, such as Germolene, which has the advantage of containing a local anaesthetic, but they have the drawback of drying out too easily, so I am now trying Vaseline. I'm only hoping that when I do eventually get to see the doc, he'll be able to prescribe some sort of steroidal cream to encourage skin growth rather than having to resort to surgery.

Although it may be painful for me to retract my forekin at the moment, this is only because of the wounds, otherwise, although it may be a little tight, it is by no menas difficult to fully retract, and I would much rather keep my foreskin intact.

The attached photo was taking on a mobile phone, and the reflection from the flash covered most of the detail, but at least one of the splits in the skin is visible, so you can see what I mean.

 

GentleBen and others - here's some help. This plus the fact that 450,000 or so circumcised men died from AIDS the first goaround in the United States!
http://circumcision.org/

 

It should be remembered that unprotected sex is only one of the 4 main methods of catching AIDS.

Others include:

Sharing needles to take drugs - another thing that America leads the world in.

Use of infected blood - which is an even higher risk in countries, such as America, where the poverty stricken can sell their blood - often so they can buy more drugs.

Being born of an AIDS infected mother - something which is especially high in 3rd world countries.

None of these have anything to do with whether or not anyone is circumcised. Basically, the most effective way of protecting yourself against infection is to always use a condom and/or never share needles for drugs (or preferably not to use drugs at all).

As far as the notion of men getting circumcised so as to lessen the risk of catching AIDS, or any other Studs, it should also be borne in mind that anyone who has decided to go to such extremes to protect himself is probably also more likely to use a condom in the first place, so consider that as being the REAL reason for fewer circumcised men being infected.

 

Just thought I'd throw my 0.02 cents in. It's nice seeing this type of discussion, from what I've read most if not all have been objective. I remember a day when someone like me (uncut) was forced to feel shame and a discussion like this was VERY one sided and it was basically saying that I was a freak with a dirty dick.

Luckily times are changing and we're realizing some traditions are really not needed. I'm not a historian nor am I a medical expert but I'll throw some ideas into the mix. Let's go with the most mainstream of people to have started\practice this act and that is (if I'm right) most people of Jewish belief. I'm sure back in the early day (even BC days) when ppl would shower or bathe MAYBE once or twice a month (maybe once or twice a year lol) that infection might set in if not taken care of. I also think that alot of early traditions did not like sex as a "fun time" but rather an act of business to procreate the species and it was not necessarily meant to be enjoyed. Co-incidence that cutting it off tends to remove alot of sensitivity?

On the infection talk though, like I said bathing was not a big thing back then so I'm sure there were cases of infection. Somehow though as cavemen (I'm sure not hacking our bodies up) managed to suvive just fine for hundreds\thousands of years without this tradition. I realize there must be some evidence of circumcision in early societies but one can assume they did it for the same reasons mentioned.

I'd also argue on the "dirty" or infection point of view that the skin barely holds anything in, it's no more of a "secret compartment for germs" than an eye lid is. I'd also argue that (no offense intended ladies) a vagina is a gaping grand canyon in comparison to foreskin and therefore shouldn't it be even MORE likely to be constantly infected and dirty?

Traditions are hard to break, especially wide spread ones, there are thousands of examples of men like me living every day fine, clean, and loving sex uncut without problem. In fact on a side note I've noticed as well that during sex when pushing in the skin is pulled down and forms a ring around the base of the head which actually rubs directly on the g-spot of the girl. I've been told from girls how they have never had orgasms like that before and it's because of the new sensation on their g-spot itself during intercourse <shrugs>.

These are just personal thoughts and opinions, I don't claim to be a know all on the subject. The only complaint I've ever heard from uncut guys is how they feel embarassed because other guys judge and poke fun and girls as well. Girls are almost worse. They hear rumors from society in general and then laugh about it calling a natural penis gross (especially at a young age) and making guys like me hate their own body. At least by the time my kids come around there will be even more like me out there and eventually the closet-like nature of this issue won't be so bad.:cheers2:

 

I fear that if guys such as cutted get their biased message out, somewhere in Africa the word will spread that circumcision is a way to keep well AND AVOID USING CONDOMS. Some missionary friends of mine reported just that. They spent weeks getting out the word that condoms were the best and required way to avoid HIV. I mentioned this in an earlier discussion with cutted, but of course, he ignored my point and did not answer to the fact.

 

Actually, Guy From The North, that time is now, depending on where you live. I don't think the Europeans mutilate their boys by rote and here in Miami natural is the norm. Almost all the guys I've been with (Hispanic and black Caribbeans) are uncut.

Also, I've been reading in the Masturbation forum and these guys are mentioning matter-of-fact about having lotion while jerking off. That seems strange to me, 'cause I never even considered it. I got skin to slide over my dick, don't need lotion. Which brings us back to the main reason for circumcision in our sexually repressed culture - preventing "self abuse."

 

im a male and i am circumcised, idunno i like vagina mmmmm vagina, yes i would circumcise ma son(s) because i dont really feel like pulling the forskin back and cleaning it when he/they are babies

 

you don't pull back foreskins on infants, ever

they are meant to be attached to the glans during childhood, you don't clean it any different then a mutilated penis, you just clean the outside

 

That is the most stupid reason to have a child cut. If your a parent you do whats best for your child, not whats best for you. Having a piece of skin cut off your child is not whats best, espically if your only reason is because your too lazy to clean your child properly.

 

Thanx for mentioning that. This was apparently not known by many doctors a few generations ago. I am half circumcised and my mother told me it was because as a kid they found my prepuce was attached to the glans. Luckily the doc (probably uncut himself) only removed a little foreskin and left me enuf to have fun stroking without having to mess with lube.

My dick pic is here for those with permissions:
http://www.hipgallery.com/photopost2/showphoto.php/photo/166665/cat/500/ppuser/104950

Which brings me to the comment about cleaning. What is the big deal with sliding that skin back and washing under the skin while taking a shower? It is a lot less trouble than having to run down lotion or some kind of lube so you can jack off.

 

Pine Man - You do have a phimosis problem and should see your GP. The short frenulum problem is a form of phimosis, but yours is the most common form, and it should be fixed. Whether or not a circumcision is necessary, or something less that, your GP, or a urologist, can tell you. The splits in the foreskin could also be an entry point for HIV or other STDs if you do not use a condom.

By the way, I have always identified myself as a LAY sex therapist, unlike what the NOCIRC crazies in this thread have said.

 

phimosis can always be cured without circumcision if the person desires to do the stretching exercises long enough

 

I'm so glad I don't have a penis.

 

Well they are handy when you gotta take a leak in the snow-covered woods.

(And that little cap keeps yer head warm)