Christianity: "Over and Done"

Keep waving the white flag...

 

That's it?

Sweet !!!!

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That's what you get babe.

I wonder if sometimes, dialogue with some people is even a possibility. In cases such as this, where the person clearly has an axe to grind, and is closed minded, just reverting to petty jibes etc to seek to irritate, it would appear to be the case.

 

When I use the term "you", I'm not indicating you directly as BlackBillBlake, rather an arbitrary usage to describe or indicate everyone and every living being who has the capacity to exhibit contact with their six senses and their external world.

Dialogue is nothing more than a description of one's own contact between the six senses and their associated objects, i.e., contact between the eyes and visible forms, between the ears and sound, between the nose and odours, between the tongue and tastes (or flavours), between the body and tactile objects, and between the mind and thought.

When we speak, we describe our moment-to-moment experiences and the sensations they produce. We describe our greed for these sensations as feelings. We describe our ill-will for these sensations as feelings. We describe our delusion or confusion for these sensations as feelings.

We crave these descriptions. We crave these feelings. And in doing so we cling to our own notions of the existence of a self. So we posit a self and we say such and such is mine. Such and such belongs to me. I am such and such. When all we are are these momentary appearances of sensations that occur when we come into contact with sight, sound, taste, smell, feeling (tactile), and thought.

We crave these sensations so much we perceive that this is how the world is and everyone should be experiencing them ... the same way we do ... the same way "I" do ... he's "My" God ... saying what is "mine" is the same as saying what is "not" yours.

None of these things are you. One only posits them to be who you are because you are experiencing these moment-to-moment contacts which produce sensations, which you crave and cling to so tightly ... like a flame which consumes. Because of these moment-to-moment contacts we have ideas of existence. The Second Noble Truth of Buddhism is ... Contact arises from the Six Senses, Feelings arise from Contact, Craving arise from Feelings, Clinging arises from Craving, Existence arises from Clinging, Birth arises from Existence, Death arises from Birth ... the same as saying Feelings are a result of contact with the six senses and their associated objects, craving is a result of feelings, clinging is a result of craving, notions of existence are a result of clinging, birth is a result of coming into existence, and death is a result of birth.

Closed mindedness is a result of focusing on the idea that you are all these experiences and seeing nothing else, not seeing that because of craving greed, craving ill-will, and craving delusion one continually creates their existence as being plesant or pleasurable, painful or insufferable, or deluded or confused. Seeing only these things which they use to posit self and using these things to describe their existence in the world in the form of communication.

Axes to grind ... or describing one's own suffering and sorrowful states? It's the same thing.

Petty jibe to seek to irritate ... or not being able to tolerate one's own suffering so needing others to suffer along with so one dosen't feel so alone in ones own suffering? The same thing.

You're so right ... in everything you said, BBB. That would appear to be the case.

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That main thing is that you keep speaking in sentences that make it sound like you are an asian guru from Tibet.
Of at least an Americans impersonation of what it would sound like.

 

Posthumous, rather than play pretending games why dont you tell me again why you think Christianity is 'over and done'.
Im seeing an upward trend in Christianity in my cities circles and its especially interesting in that its not just numbers but enthusiasm.
Im watching what might be nothing short of a 'spiritual revolution' verging in China.. with potential to let lose through the Islamic world via the Eastern Gate.

You seem pretty keen to the idea that Christianity might be 'over and done'?

Do you have some explanation for that position (besides you believe its a fake religion yourself)?

 

Perhaps they had the same teacher ... ???
- or -
Perhaps I had the same teacher ... ???

-- Guru? from Tibet? Shouldn't that be Lama from Tibet? and Guru from India?

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Seriously?

So, does this "spiritual revolution" include torture? killing? In whose name?

The End of Tibet ... As China tortures monks and drives Tibetans into poverty...
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Spiritual revolution ... or ... Violence revolution ... ???

Does spiritual include inserting cattle prods into womens vaginas? Does the spiritual revolution include beating people till they die because they wont' renounce their religion?

I think, and this is just my opinion from what I read, its more a Violence revolution. Theres nothing spiritual about torture and killing.

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You think Christian converts are torturing and murdering Buddhist monks?

Or did you just say that to dupe some hatred against Christianity and garner righteous feelings for yourself (at their expense)?

 

There you go again, projecting your own thoughts and feelings onto me ...

You stated there was a 'religious revolution' going on in China ... I brought in a story in the Rolling Stone that says otherwise. I never said 'Christian converts'. However, you brought it up ...

Righteous feelings? What does that feel like? Never mind, I don't want to know. I'm sure it's not something I want to experience.

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Christianity in China? Now that's a scary thought ... a country whose mainstream governmental attitude is that religion is poison to the mind.

Perhaps this 'resurgence' will shift Christianity from America to China. Perhaps Buddhism will find its 'resurgence' in America. That certainly appears to be the way its progressing. Not that its a bad thing. On the contrary. Perhaps it will be a very good thing. Or just maybe, perhaps, it's just wishful thinking ... on my part ... but then some wishes do come true.

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Ever since you posted the following, I have been forced to conclude that you are so beyond delusional as to render any attempts to engage you in rational debate a complete waste of time.

 

The fact is, often it is only Christians who are there around the globe to help the down and out. And many times it is Christen relief that bails out many of the non believers. People come on these fourms to bash Christians, yet around the world Christians are making efforts to help so many. Schools, hospitals, relief centers, ect are be established in every country, and these institutions have helped so many that it would be hard to estimate the numbers that have received this kind of aid. What would be dangerous is if Christians just walked away from helping all these people. Yet Christians will never do this, because their love for Christ will only encourage countless others to take up the cause of the poor. Millions of people around the world are being helped today because of Jesus Christ.

 

The truth I speak of is the Salvation power that comes from Jesus Christ alone. And His truth is found in the Scriptures. And if there is a rape going on here, it's your denial of Gods truth. And I can tell you, the ones who will burn in the bottom of Hell, will be the religious leaders who have led others away from Gods truth with their double talk. The God of the Bible tells us we are to have no other God's before us, and if you say that statement is untrue, then your calling the God of the Bible a LIAR. And it's not my perspective I'm pushing here, it's the God of the Bible. And it's the God of the Bible your really having a problem with Darrel.

 

Sure it is ...

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Bock bock bock bock!

Seriously though, you are not capable of rational debate so Im very pleased you will stop trying.

Meanwhile...
Whats really most exciting about Chinas surge in Christianity is that its by and large something of its own making, on its own, developing on its own and not yet influenced much by any western christianity.
Now I say this is a good thing because we in the west have too often reached a 'take it for granted' way of life.
There in China - its much more like it was for early Christians in the Roman Empire.
They are not popular, they are a small minority and have been at risk for persecution for it.
You better know what you believe and mean it!
They do.
Its difficult to know exactly how many numbers we are talking about because China doesnt care to share these things so much.
Estimates now have Christianity at about 5% of the population and the fastest growing spiritual practice bar none.

Especially interesting is the very large Muslim populations in Western China. Amazingly, the Muslims on that side of the fence might very well be free to hear the Gospel via Chinese Christians.
Something Muslims on the other side of that line rarely get a chance to look into.
This is an exciting prospect in that many of us are convinced that if Christianity ever can get a fair presentation (just an equal and free podium among the others) then you are going to see it just ignite throughout the Arabian peninsula and Islamic world.

But yes, as DarrelK suggested - we are quite possibly looking at the verge of a new era when China will in fact become the 'most christian nation' and the East will be the rising wave of Christendom.

Im afraid the whole Buddhism fad among American Unis is probably a few years past its due date though.
When did it 'jump the shark'?
I think I can tell you the exact moment actually. For Vancouver it peaked and decline the very minute the Dalai Lama appeared.
(Vancouvers UBC being no better example of the 'University Buddhist' infatuation).
You know it was really fascinating in its own way to see the collection of students and neo-buddhists waiting for this man.
Treated very much like... NOW they were going to get their Pope and show everyone else (those stupid old christian fool types) how real sophisticated spiritualism was gonna win the day.
Eager anticipation and even the hackey-sack pot smoker 'buddhists' making an effort to be reverant and religious-like.
Anyways,
Dalai Lama shows up and quite frankly he disappoints unrealistic expectations by not offering great secrets that outdo the Pope or Jerry Falwell etc.
In fact he doesnt have much interesting to say at all.
Even worse he is actually kinda a wierd little dude, comes off as a goofy gay man who isnt really that wise at all.
Worse all the more... the whole thing has a sort of smell of marketing ploy to it (said a few adherents).

We are seeing a few of those people returning to the Churches around here but what Im excited about is not so much the 'increasing numbers' in our Christian churches (but thats good).
More so Im very excited about who is making up these new swells of people - young people who were not 'churchy' or even raised in Church but coming from the 'world'.
- many more of what Id called 'realistic down-to-earth' type who have already been atheists, agnostics, experimented with other belief systems etc.
-Many more of what Id call 'intellectuals' or that is to say people who are interested in cosmology, philosophy, ID movement and the arts and sciences.

This is happening as we speak.
I know this because I work in these circles all the time and Im sure its a surprise to some of you that this is a hot topic among us all.
I think partly its because we have been so conditioned to hear and read about 'declining attendance' and 'ageing congregations' for the last 30-40 years that we dont even want to talk about it.
Even myself and other Christians 'whisper' excitedly about whats going on but its almost like we dont want to 'jinx it' by actually announcing this to the public heh.

So I really have no idea who are these people who keep talking like Christianity is gonna be 'done and over' but it sounds like you are stuck in the 80s?

 

Darrel this is my perspective, this is what I believe.

1 Timothy 2:5 For (there is) one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.

Darrel, do you believe this verse?

 

No. Why? Should I?

I don't even believe in a god, God, or gods. I do believe that there are realms of existence where quality of being is such that it can be compared to that of our conception of a god, God, or gods.

Having said, why should I believe in a mediator between such?

I do believe that Jesus was a Bodhisattva, an enlightened being whose purpose is to wander around the various realms of existence seeking liberation from greed, ill-will and delusion for all beings before he himself attains full and complete enlightenment.

Not meaning to take this off the subject, but from observation a curiosity has arisen within my mind about something. Which really gives me cause to perhaps possibly think that you and Ik denk het niet may in some form or another be the same person. For some reason, which I can't fully understand, you both misspell my name, while everyone else I have read from on these forums who address me spell it properly.

I mean, it's not above even the most unintelligent person on these forums, or even on the internet to use proxy servers to mask their IP addresses so as to give reason for the Forum Moderators or the Intnernet public to believe one may be two or more.

There's two ell's in my name, yet you and Ik choose to type it as Darrel or DarrelK. Curious I am. Why is that? Are you and Ik the same person? Maybe I should just do a simple TraceRT to allay any concerns on my part.

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Edit: come to think of it, a TraceRT wouldn't even show that as it would stop at the Proxy. Oh well!

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Edit: If I were to believe that any being could be considered a mediator it would have to be the Buddha. While he is just a man, and claimed only to be a man and not a god, or God, or even the son of a god, or God, he has been told to have taught the beings that exist in the higher realms called the Bhrama realms, even the great Bhrama himself ... or is that Brahma ... I am unsure of the spelling since I found it spelled both ways?

But then, seeing as it is only a belief, and the Buddha said never to believe anything he said without direct experience so as to claim it to be truth, I hardly see where your belief can be claimed as truth ... only a belief ... and as such I see it as an un-truth, a fabrication you invented, or a fabrication nonetheless.

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