christian mystics

Eckhart, a true follower of naykidness;

"It is a fair trade and an equal exchange: to the extent that you depart from things, thus far, no more and no less, God enters into you with all that is his, as far as you have stripped yourself of yourself in all things. It is here that you should begin, whatever the cost, for it is here that you will find true peace, and nowhere else." Talks of Instruction

Also condemed posthumously as a heretic.

Ironic huh? Yesuah preaches about a giving up the things of this world in order to have a personal relationship with God and the orthodox religious leaders condem him for heresay.

300 odd years later the orthodox church starts condeming people for the same reasons in his name.

 

The bullshit in your mind. Eventually it will fruit and we will shroom together.

 

I think this would be a better world if there were fewer signs and more shovels.

 

Of course, road construction is part of the office space.

 

Christianity has, and typicallly continues to, usurp anything and everything that might add some kind of credibility to it's outrageous claims to authenticity.
It is true as you say that the catholic church has seized the remnant ancient knowledge that it not only declared heretical but slaughtered millions trying to discredit, dispel, and destroy. But has christianity subsequently acknowledged it's own madness? Not on your Nellie! There are even galoots in this forum who still claim that destroying so-called "heretical" literature was jusified and right, and then go on to cite it as evidence of biblical authenticity!! Never a mention of the inhuman and evil slaughters by christians, though. One example of "good christianity" ~ "Nearly 20,000 of ther citizens (of Beziers, France) were put to the sword, regardless of age or sex. The workings of divine vengeance have been wondrous." ~ Quote Innocent III [Oxford Dictionary of the Christian Church]
The point here (other than the sheer mass of numbers that indicate a popular mysticism) is that when close to 20,000 people are butcherd by sword, streets would be flowing with blood. 20,000 multiplied by 4 litres blood per person = 80,000 litres of blood flowing (21,134 gallons), so the christian "god" sounds much more like satan than anything I can imagine, and that was only one of the many cities razed during the inquisition!
The questions that still hang over christianity that are yet to be answered are ~ why was ancient knowledge heretical then and not now? Why were innocents slaughtered because of it? Does the christian "god" condone such slaughter? In whose name were the slaughters conducted? Are you certain that such acts are not satanic?

 

Is this another 'crusades' discussion?

I don't know much about saints, so neither about mystics that were canonized...can any give me some examples? naykidape, could you give me some quote on that Justin martyr said that a real jew is a real christian is a real hindu? Justin martyr was a church father if I remember it right?

"There's a real unifieing principle in mytiscim; the idea that you can know God directly and that anyone who does is communing with the same entity regardless of what you call Him/Her/It."
I must say that my knowledge about christian mysitcs is limited, but weren't there those that did believe that Jesus is the only way? That's the impression I had when reading imitation of Christ by Thomas A Khempis...and he was really into the giving up for God thing...

 

St. John of the Cross
St. Teresa of Avila - both mystics who were cannonized.

 

Hmmm - I wouldn't be so quick to pin down what mysticism is. Look in the "metaphysics and mysticism" forum and there's a definition there that I would be more inclined to agree with.

A paraphrased quote from it: "mystics strive to know the ultimate reality".

This ultimate reality may not include God and it is not at all uncommon for mystics to be skeptical about the existance of god and many more who simply just don't care if God exists or not - they just get on with it. For example you get many Chaos Magicians who are atheistic or agnostic. I have found Taoism works from an atheistic point of view and Taoism encompasses many Hermetic princibles.

What you are discribing "they strive to have a direct communion with god/whatever" describes not neccesarily mysticism (although this IS true for many mystics) but Gnosticism, one specific part of mysticisim (let's seperate Gnostics, the group, from Gnosticism the princible, just for a second).

Blessings

Sebbi

 

Didn't they hang out back in the day? Maybe before John was locked up and wrote Ascent?

 

If someone's difined as a Christian mystic ...
exp:
Justin Martyr
Francis of Assisi
Thomas Aquinas
Augusitne
Duns Scott
Bonaveture

NaykidApe

what about nostradamus, or joan d'arc? are they?

 

Nostradamus was too scared of the Spanish Inquisition to come right out and proclaim himself as a mystic. That's why he veiled all his sayings. As a water or crystal ball gazer he probably would have been persecuted.

 

Yes. St. Teresa probably had a big influence of John. Her most accessible and IMHO best work is 'Interior Castle or the Mansions'.
Between them, they reformed the Carmelite order, which has been one of the more mystically inclined christian religious orders.

 

I think that Joan of Arc was not a mystic, at least not in the way of those contemplative people who gave up the world to get together with God...I think she was more about obeying God and fighting injustice.

 

Yeah, they gave the order osteoporosis which is why they are called Discalced Carmelites...

 

Fishy business.
Are you saying that they got osteoporosis because they had cold feet?

 

Yesh. And they had cold feet due to their tendency to wear sandals in all weather.

 

Beats me. I've read some of Nostradamuses prophisies but I've never checked out his bio.
As far as Joan of arc goes, there's so much folklore and theory surrounding her story it would be kind of hard to form an opinion. Some people think she was schitzophrenic (which doesn't necassarily mean she wasn't a mystic).
Other people consider her "chosen by God" (which doesn't necassarily mean she was a mystic).

Most of the time the term mystic refers to someone who intentionally trys to form a one on one relationship with God/the Universe/ Truth, (again) Whatever.
I'm not sure if someone who's born with the connection-- or who's suddenly struck by it--would qualify as a mystic (although personally I don't think it matters. Mystic is just a word and the heart of mystisicm is about connecting with a Truth that transcends words).

 

Aside from the 2 Bill mentioned;

St. Francis of Assisi
St. Benedict
St. Catherine of Seiena
St. Augustine
St. Thomas Aquinas
St. Bonaventure.....

....it would be a really long list. I think it's interesting to note that almost all the catholic saints came from the monastic (contemplative) orders (or formed their own) rather than the clergy.
I think you could take that as an example of the difference between faith and religion.

 

You should check out Hildegard von Bingen. She had mystical experiences in the middle ages.

 

And she wrote some very nice music.