that article is full of crap michelle "Agricultural animals have always made a major contribution to the welfare of human societies by providing food, shelter, fuel, fertilizer and other products and services. " Would that "fertilizer" be the pig crap that polutes our rivers in north carolina so bad that we all drink bottled water in a regeion where it rains every week? Would that food be the fatty meats that gave my uncle and grandfater heart attacks one at age 65 and the other at only 55? And does that "fuel" which is minute and rarely used somehow make up for the petrol used farming grain to feed animals, transporting it to them, managing the animals, and transporting them to slaughter? As for shelter, what shelter do animals provide us? There are lots of people that despritly argue that vegitarianism is bad, and that the reason for it are lies. But did you ever notice how vegitarians arguments can show you results, and reason, and logic, but the anit-veg arguments are just, thats not true, this is true, with no proof, just rumors and statements they cant support. It is true some of the land, like ranches, we use for cows and sheep would be hard to grow high water plants on, but even on my parents ranch in new mexico where people say you cant grow anything but animals, we brought up pumpkins, barley, tomatoes, corn, and peanuts. And besideds that, who says if we cant get food out of land without harming animals that thats what we need to do, there are other uses for land than food, and other specis that need land than people, why not just leave some for the wild?
"Of all the myths, this is perhaps the most dangerous. While lacto and lacto-ovo vegetarians have sources of vitamin B12 in their diets (from dairy products and eggs), vegans (total vegetarians) do not. Vegans who do not supplement their diet with vitamin B12 will eventually get anemia (a fatal condition) as well as severe nervous and digestive system damage" OH we have to take supliments? too much trouble, id better kill a cow and get a bunch of cholestorol in my arteries. If we cant produce B12 in our bodies where do you think cows get it, notice though the report said that lack b12 can cause anemia and damage, and it said that vegans groups tested had low b12 levels, it did not say that they had a lot of anemia and digestive system damage! why? because low means lower than meat eaters, not, too low, meat eaters do have more, but no one can prove that they need more, one of the oldest men on record, if not THE oldest, was a raw vegan, he looked happy bright and chipper at age 126, and he never took a b12 supliment in his life.
actually Pablo. here are the oldest people on record..and please note..that none of them are raw vegans. as for that 126 year old man? there are no official records claiming him to really be that age.and he has no birth certificate.and also..outside of raw food sites..i saw nowhere where it said that this guy was a raw vegan. http://edition.cnn.com/2002/WORLD/europe/01/04/oldest.man/ http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/05/31/oldest.person.ap/ http://www.guinnessworldrecords.com/index.asp?id=48373
I said maybe the oldest, cause i wasnt sure who the oldest was, but if your going to say the really old raw vegan was leing about his age then thats a whole other argument. But thats not the point, my point was that if b12 was vital and only in meat, thousands of people who do not eat meat for religeous reasons, for their entire lives, and dont tend to take b12 supliments, would be sick and insane or whatever you saying it causes.
You are wrong.Hindus in India get their B12 from the remains of dead insects, larvae and faeces from eating unwashed fruit and vegetables.Not exactly my cup of tea. [Yuk]
Okay Didge, why is it that in the 1970's when Hindus from India started living in the UK, they strarted suffering from anaemia?
Pablo I am sorry to hear of the early death of your grandfather and uncle. Could I ask if they were consummers of margarine (it is really not good for this being the reason it tastes so awful) or other foods made from hydronated fats and oils? Actually there have been people with low cholesterol levels who have died from heart attacks as well as people who have died from heart attacks who have had high cholesterol levels.See my other posts in this thread.
no uncle mike was more a old time, whole milk and real butter type of guy, and i dont know what my grandpa ate all the specifically, just that he was a sheep rancher who primarily ate meat, my grandma told me that, she didnt go into the table dressings, cause that wasnt what she was really talking about.
My great uncle Pat died at the age of 90....he ate meat,smoked,and drank until the day he died. I think....that living long has more to do with luck these days. I have seen plenty of health nuts drop dead from cancer,leukemia,strokes..ect. My grandmother smoked,ate meat,junkfood..ect..she survived lung cancer,emphisema,asthma....only to die from a stroke at the age of 79. The reality is...is if you are gonna get cancer or have a stroke...it's gonna happen whether you are vegan,raw foodist,or eat meat 3 meals a day. it's called life.and all humans die from something eventually.
well if your just going to dismiss all logic as an excuse to be weak willed and just do what you please then why are you talking about it.
What's up with you and margarine? Do you have something against it? I mean, please elaborate... since you don't miss a chance to criticise it, lol, I'd love to hear your theory, is it made by little green men with the intention of killing mankind, or something?
Margarine is not food but plastic.That is why it never goes bad or eaten by mice or rats if they get the chance.I have met very few hippies in Australia who eat margarine, even most vegans that are hippies don't touch it.
I am still waiting for someone to give me the experiment that suggests that LDL cholesterol is detrimental to human health.Maybe some people have too much of it.The idea of dosage of nutrients is a bit difficult for some people to come to terms with.I am sure many people could do with more omega-3 in their diet.
What is quite obvious to me is that the whole cholesterol thing is a great big hoax.If ALL the people who died from CHD had high levels of cholesterol and there were a significant number of people who had low levels of cholesterol who never died from CHD then the idea would have some crediblity.However the facts of the matter are that people who have died from CHD, some have had high levels of cholesterol and some have had low levels of cholesterol.To suggest that cholesterol is responsable for CHD is merely inductive reasoning.It would be like suggesting that short hair is responsable for CHD as some people who died from CHD had short hair.
Cheese, Milk, Butter...Basically all animal products contain cholesterol, so unless your a vegan, your gonna get it. Alo, thinks like oils, and things with lots of fat RASIE cholesterol, but don't actually HAVE cholesterol in them. Peace and Love, Dan
not basically. the only food that contains cholesterol is made with an imal products becuase the liver produces cholesterol. yes your body makes its own cholesterol and you dont need outside sources.
If the original question was asking if being a vegetarian lowers the chances of getting atherosclerosis the answer is no.
