Causality

Okay... What caused all this?

 

In all seriousness, the big bang. According to relaxxx some random quantum energy or some other silly bull shit.

 

Some people believe quantum mechanics proves that something can come from nothing. Since I'm not a quantum mechanic I'm not sure about the claim.

Can anyone describe the quantum mechanism that proves something can come from nothing?

 

Now, had you not added "silly bull shit" no one would have had the slightest inkling that you had any difference of opinion with relaxxx at all.

 

Yes I can do it in a concise, easily understandable fashion.




But I have to charge lala lala laaaa.

 

I don't know if there's a quantum term for it but the reason something exists from nothingness is IMPERFECTION.

"fortunately, one of the basic rules of the universe is that nothing is perfect"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DECAorZYErk"]Stephen Hawking - An Imperfect Universe - YouTube

I don't 100% agree with everything said in this video but the principle of imperfection on gravity is demonstrated well. In this video they use gas matter as the example but I believe the same thing occurred with the fabric of space itself before any matter or energy at all. The fabric of space itself is not perfect. The imperfections in the fabric of space manifest as tiny spots of gravity. Gravity causes attraction, attraction causes movement, movement causes energy, energy causes matter...

 

hubris

 

I get the basic concept of that statement but in order for that statement to be a scientific fact it must be repeatable.
Imperfection does not always produce something from nothing; therfore it is not a fact.

 

So.... If something totally random produced an object that was view-able, quantifiable, solid, etc. but you could not get it to repeat then the object would in fact not exist according to science? Or science just couldn't explain how it got there... (If you don't like the word "object" in the above, then event would do just as well)

All this does is prove how inept science is...

 

That's why there are scientific THEORIES before there are scientific FACTS. Some theories can never be fully proven but just accepted as the most logical and probable explanation until further information can be ascertained. For others it's all just too much for them to grasp so they react with asinine rejections. Myself, if someone's shovelling shit my way then I've got no problem shovelling it right back at them.

 

So we step a bit further.
-------------------------------------
Hypothesis

Science says the BIG BANG began every thing.
Thus , nothing existed before the bang.

Then how did it happen if nothing existed to be a cause?

I simple question.. one that has stumped science and continues to do so
--
For if some thing existed before the bang. It [the bang] IS NOT ALL OF REALITY. In fact may be very little of it.

Religion now is so far out of its league that it is monkeys looking at a lightning storm.
And that has been so for centuries

Reality. the sum total of everything.. Is now so large it does not fit in the heads of the smartest people on earth.
All we know is that logic says. There can be nothing without a reality.. thus reality is. And will always be and have been.


Prill .. [ ill have an enchilada with extra hot]

 

Sp Relaxxx

Does the big bang have a cause? Im quite serious,, no shovel.
Im interested in talking to people who say they can think.
You seem to have a grip on what science is.


Prill

 

There can never have been nothing. This joint's older than we think.

 

I agree with scratcho. There's never been nothing. There's no such thing as nothing and there no such thing as perfection.

I'm pretty sure Stephen Hawking believes in a cycling universe so I'm not sure why he said time and space began at the big bang. Maybe he means this phase of time/universe. Time is basically a perception of movement. Movement is simply intrinsic to an imperfect universe. Time, Space and movement all existed before the BB.

I made a post a while back in the Science forum about my theories on gravity. Basically I said Space itself is a substance and gravity is the displacement of density of this spatial substance. I've since realized this can also explain the big bang. If nothing is perfect and space is something, then even space alone has some distortions. Distortions are the same thing as displacements or fluctuations. They have and intrinsic attraction to each other so they start to collect. Movement is energy, the ball of spatial distortions builds energy exponentially from collisions and unstable interactions. Perfection doesn't exist so singularity does not happen. Energy builds beyond the force of attraction (gravity) and explodes. The speed of light is related to this concentration of spatial displacement. Very fast and then tapering off as the universe expands outward. Everything we call the universe; matter, gravity, and energy, are all distortions and vibrations in the fabric of space.

 

Causality is a misapprehension based on a linear model of time and a context/grammar which includes duality.

 

With a event measuring stick!

 

Scratcho

Not how i'd say it.. But true.
Thus 'Old' is a misnomer.
Old requires a beginning..

When did everything that happens.. , start

 

Raga.. Yes the linear model is prevalent.. And actually allows through tipplers theories [unprovable at this 'time'] travel into the past.

The question is.. can the event precede the cause.
[ an oxymoron?]

But.. if so , then you and i and all
on earth are not able to understand how this could occur.
There is no safe place of grammar or semantics. There is causality or there is not.

Im a pragmatist. The world is observed follows causality. Its nice to think of other paths.. but such is what True Hard SF is born from, where physicists write fiction..

Reality existed before the bang.. or it could not have happened.

Prill

 

Relaxx i left reply to last.

I agree.. Space is 'a thing in itself'.. what else could it be if it can be warped by mass.
I posited many times that time is simply, the processing of laws relevant to this 'verse
in that space. The rate at which time is pecieved is dependent on our physicallity. A machine intelligence would experience tine subjectively at a different rate.
This is independent of time dilation.. a part of LAW.. in velocity
Just about everyone believes this 'universe' is reality. I believe it to be just a small part of a far greater thing.

None yet have shown me a scrap of proof that my ideas are false.. They usually attack me. [When you dont understand the workings . kick the machine]

Prill