Can America Afford Bernie Sanders?

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Motion, Feb 10, 2016.

  1. Motion

    Motion Senior Member

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  2. Motion

    Motion Senior Member

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    I generally support applying the free market to various areas but I recognize that applying the free market to healthcare has its limits. I believe in applying the free market to healthcare where it's useful. This is why I see the usefulness of things like Health Savings Accounts for certain people and the use of Walk-In clinics that are becoming popular in America.

    Like I said applying the free market to healthcare can get complicated for certain things. Like if a person is injured in a car wreck. This person won't be able to "shop around" for the best deal on healing their injuries. This person may also need a Public Option if the cost of treating their injuries are very expensive. So it's things like this that make applying the free market to healthcare more complicated in comparison to applying the free market to other areas.
     
  3. MeAgain

    MeAgain Dazed & Confused Lifetime Supporter Super Moderator

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    Profit is not operating expense, nor is it research, health maintenance, treatments or coverage of medications; it is profit. It's the money made after all expenses have been paid. Profits go to private individuals and shareholders, none of it is reinvested in the enterprise...because it's the profit, financial gain, once awarded to the private individuals or shareholders it's gone.

    A non profit operation such as Medicare reinvests all money taken in above its operating expenses back into the operation by investing it for the future or by improving the services it offers to its clients.

    Non profits can still have top notch research and services as part of their operating expenses, in fact they will have more money for that research and services as they don't need to show a profit...none of the money is "wasted".
     
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  4. I'minmyunderwear

    I'minmyunderwear Newbie

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    i'm not a history fan, so i say just eliminate that department from colleges.
     
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  5. themnax

    themnax Senior Member

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    america can even less afford any of the better known alternatives to him. least of all trump the chump.
     
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  6. Balbus

    Balbus Senior Member

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    motion



    Well you know me the first thing I’m going to remind you is that there never has been and never could be a ‘free market’ in any area, it’s the fundamental flaw in ‘free market’ models.

    As to public service institutions like the NHS and state education in the UK they seem to be more disrupted by the introduction of ‘market’ based ideas rather than helped, because they are at heart co-operative organisations should be focused on the public good, that ethos falls apart when imposed ‘market’ ideas brings in competition, pitting school against school and hospital against hospital.

    For example in the competition for short term funding nurse numbers where lowered this brought about a longer term problem of a shortage of nurses which actually increased the costs because they had to use more expensive agency staff.

    The government is now trying to force the private agencies not to charge so much saying the ‘market is not working’ but actually that is how markets work.
     
  7. Balbus

    Balbus Senior Member

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    Motion



    This didn’t seem to back up what you seemed to be saying, the big things mentioned were million dollar student union buildings and huge sports stadiums, what have they to do with most students extracurricular activities?
     
  8. 6-eyed shaman

    6-eyed shaman Sock-eye salmon

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    What about the black market? What regulations exist there?
     
  9. Asmodean

    Asmodean Slo motion rider

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    Ideally all these organisations would be non profit (to us i guess). But I was expanding on what Karen said about paying insurance companies and I guess what she said earlier about how any european can explain how a single payer health plan works. First of all many europeans don't know shit about their health plan, they just go with the flow :p ;) I'm not an expert by any means either, and certainly not about how it works in other european countries than my own. But here in the Netherlands we still have insurance companies that are non profit (mine's one of them). Insurance companies still have a market. There's a lot of choice (although if you look real good, not all choices differ a lot :p). But I guess the Netherlands doesn't exactly have a single payer health insurance:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_health_insurance

    The government 'only' pays about 70% of my health care costs (which makes it very bearable), they may compensate some poorer people's health costs even more and rich people nothing at all.
     
  10. Balbus

    Balbus Senior Member

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    Well you know me the first thing I’m going to remind you is that there never has been and never could be a ‘free market’ in any area, it’s the fundamental flaw in ‘free market’ models.


    6

    Really not sure what you mean?

    The very fact it is a black market is due to regulations and prohibitions that have then stopped been prohibited then become regulated.
     
  11. Karen_J

    Karen_J Visitor

    I said they know that it does work. Too many Americans talk about the concept as if it's an unproven theory. It's like they've forgotten that Europe is a real place with intelligent people. I guess they assume you're all liberals, and they don't trust any information that comes from a liberal or progressive.
     
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  12. Flagme15

    Flagme15 Members

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    Isn't the point of going to college is to get an education?
     
  13. Karen_J

    Karen_J Visitor

    Party pooper.
     
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  14. Meliai

    Meliai Members

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    As far as education I don't know if it is realistic for four year colleges to be completely free but I would like to return to the days when a college student could pay for their education at a 4 year state school by working a part time and summer job instead of graduating drowning in debt.

    I do think free 2 year technical college is realistic and would do wonders for the working class. People on a four year track would also have the option of attending a free 2 yr school for the first 2 years to save money.
     
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  15. Bud D

    Bud D Member

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    Legalizing cannabis would be additional taxes.

    Having less people in prison also creates more taxes. People working and not wasting away in jail is taxable.
     
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  16. stormountainman

    stormountainman Soy Un Truckero

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    Colorado has recorded nearly a BILLION dollars in known taxable cannabis sales. The state government collected 250 million dollars in tax revenues. Everyone is content with the legalization, and the way it has worked. Today, one out of every 18 people in Colorado is a millionaire. So America can afford Sanders and jacked up taxes, if people would give new ideas a chance.
     
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  17. Bud D

    Bud D Member

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    There might be so many rich people in Colorado due to the cost of living and the high end real estate market. No doubt legalization helps generate revenue for people and the state.

    Humboldt is said to generate a billion dollars a year in cannabis cultivation. As long as the money stays in the country, it goes back into the economy. Taxes from legalization are just a sure fire way that the Government get's their cut. They don't get much from asset seizure compared to legal taxes. Plus asset seizure just puts the money back into the stupid police funds feeding the bitchy monster on all our backs!

    Colorado isn't even a great place for outdoor. They have a much shorter growing season compared to lower altitude locations. People do outdoor there but they don't grow the monster 20 pound plants that Humboldt does (from what I've seen online).

    I live in Ohio at the same exact latitude as Humboldt. We have 11 less sunny days than Eureka but about 50 more inches of rain annually. I wish there weren't so many bible banging nut jobs around these parts! They are all about the war on drugs. Truth is a lot of the people that use drugs around here do suck major monkey balls. Lot's of low life's, some richer people use, but lot's of all around shit bags. It's a farming community for the most part. We'll see what the future brings or how Bernie will bring it.
     
  18. stormountainman

    stormountainman Soy Un Truckero

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    Colorado gets some amazing sunshine. The herb thrives just as good, if not better than Humbolt county.
     
  19. Bud D

    Bud D Member

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    The extra UV at elevation helps. It's just that the weather, snow into spring and snow early fall. Short growing season but it's gotta be good to use light dep there.
     
  20. stormountainman

    stormountainman Soy Un Truckero

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    I'm no expert. I just lived in Colorado for a long time and know lots of people who grow. I've seen some amazing plants. I know that the group of friends that I have claim it is an ideal growning place. There are commercial growers who do it in doors. Private folks just do it out in the backyard. They no longer have a need to hide it.
     

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