Brexit

But the thing is do the people voting for Brexit understand the issues involved and frankly going by this thread I’d have to say that ndoesn't seem the case.

They repeat the slogans, the falsehood and lies of a wealthy elite that owns much of UK media and wealthy elitist right wing politicians but can’t defend anything they repeat from valid criticism

It is a sad indictment of our society that so many voters can be so easily bamboozled by tricksters and charlatans

 

No your wrong but everyone that doesn't see it the same way as you is " I'll informed " what a crock lots of people want our democratically elected government ( whoever's that may be ) running this country rather than some committee that doesn't necessarily have our best interests at heart
Bet you thought about this world government at twelve too !

 

Bring me sunshine, bring me BREXIT: RICHARD LITTLEJOHN calls on voters ahead of the EU elections | Daily Mail Online

I like this.:

Bring me sunshine, bring me BREXIT: RICHARD LITTLEJOHN calls on voters to teach the out-of-touch Westminster rabble a lesson in the EU elections

 

The fact that every EU country has its own government and not planning on getting rid of it, and some countries and their government even going against most of EU wishes should tell you something is off with your argument here.

Is that the best you have?

 

Ok, I'll ask again:

So, is UK currency regarded wrong by the rest of EU? Or by pro stay british folks or something?
And what seems wrong about keeping your own country's identity? How is the UK identity under threat by staying in the EU?

Hope you will clarify!

 

I already did not my fault you don't understand (or are pretending not to )

 

In this thread? Maybe you could direct me to that post?
I'm sincerely wondering how, why and by who the UK currency is regarded wrong.
And how the UK identity (or perhaps any country that's in the EU? Just asking to be clear) is under threat by staying in the EU?

 

Mall

LOL but you seem unable to explain your thinking or views and can’t answer the questions asked of you or address the many outstanding criticisms of the things you’ve said – that would seem to be the very definition of been ill-informed.

 

Mal

To repeat an earlier post in this thread

The supposed ‘democratic deficit’ of the EU was covered many times at the time of referendum and if you had bothered to become informed you would have realised by now that the idea of ‘unelected officials’ is way too simplistic and that the truth is a lot more complex and nuanced.

So to me the slogan is disingenuous at best and to some outright lying.

“It is time to nail another lie: Britain is not ruled by unelected bureaucrats in Brussels.”

Ruled by Brussels Bureaucrats? It's Another Lie

I’m not saying the EU is perfect but I don’t think any system is - yes there is a certain amount of ‘democratic deceit’ in the EU but that is also true for the UK.

The parliamentary, constituency and first past the post electoral system in the UK for example means that political Party’s that get control of the government have power in excess (often far in excess) to their mandate.

For example even though Margret Thatcher’s as leader of the Conservatives won three elections the Tory’s never polled more than 43% of the popular vote. I’ve been told that that the last time a UK government was elected with more than 50% of the popular vote was back in 1931.

This means that we get things like the 2015 election when the Conservatives got only 36.9% of the popular vote but 50.9% of the Parliamentary seats.

 

Mal

I haven't seen it where are these supposed answers/explinations?

 

Mal

Probably from before then from watching Star Trek

 

Asmo

I’d even ask what is an UK ‘identity’?

I saw a poster the other day –

Being British is about driving a German car to an Irish pub for a Belgian beer, then traveling home, grabbing an Indian curry or a Turkish kebab on the way, to sit on Swedish furniture and watch American shows on a Japanese TV.

I mean what things identify a person as being British?

We speak English but which dialect of English and what about Welsh or Irish (I heard there are more Klingon speakers in the UK than Scots Gaelic ones so I’m leaving that out) and then there are Americans, Australians, Cannadians….

Not everyone like football and our top teams don’t seem to have many British people in them.

There is a Church of England but I once left religion blank on a passport application and when handed in the clerk said I had to fill it in and I said I didn’t have one so the person said ‘OK then put down Church of England.

And supposedly our most favourite food is Indian

I love my country but really I’m not really hung up on having a nationalistic ‘identity’ I’d just like to try and be a good person.

 

Are you replying to someone else ?? I never said any of those things

 

Mal

You said – “whats wrong with countries having their own currency and identity?”

Both Asmo and I pointed out that the UK has its own currency and that is OK with the EU so what did you mean and asked you in what way you though the EU was destroying ‘British identity’

You didn’t answer those questions but then when asked again you said

“I already did not my fault you don't understand (or are pretending not to)”

Seeming to imply you had answered when you don’t seem to have so we are asking where do you think you have answered the questions?

 

"I'm sincerely wondering how, why and by who the UK currency is regarded wrong"

I never said This ! Plus all new EU members Have to accept the Euro do you think they will let the uk keep the pound indefinitely ? I have Voted For the Brexit party Because Initially I was not Too concerned about the EU but now I have changed my mind
Balbus has already said he wants a United states of Europe I don't I am not much of a Star trek fan either its childish

 

United States Of Europe?
Sell our country down the river people who want that would.
We fought two world wars when Germany wanted to rule Europe.
Millions died to keep us free.
To allow Germany and others to rule us through the back door would be suicidal!
Anyone who advocates that is nothing but a traitor!

 

Mal

I would hope for one but I don’t think it’s going to happen or at least no time soon.

The think is have you got any rational reasons for not wanting one?

An incredibly large amount of popular entertainment is that doesn’t mean that some messages (for good or ill) cannot be learnt from them, I much prefer Gene Roddenberry’s optimistic vision of a future to the simplistic ramblings of say Ayn Rand.

But to me what seems childish in the extreme is to hold onto ideas that seem fundamentally flawed and which even the holders of can’t defend from criticism.

 

In the First World War the elites (wealthy politicians and newspaper owners) led many to their deaths in the trenches.

In the Second World War a charismatic leader used nationalistic fervour to lead his country to ruin.

Hummmm I wonder if there are lessons in that?

 

Interesting that earlier Booze posted a cartoon of someone asking after an imagined Brexit had happened

‘Who are we going to blame for our problems now?’

Well if history is a guide then the hatred is redirected by the leaders toward the ‘enemy within’ the political opposition, or as some would call them the traitors.

If there is economic hardships or disruption that can get nasty with show trials and which hunts.

It is even possible that immigrant groups might be targeted, I mean if a campaign is focused on ‘stopping immigration’ those immigrants that have already migrated here might be seen differently as people that shouldn’t be here.

In some cases if that behaviour is not checked it can led to the gulag and the concentration camp.

First they came for the remoaners, and I did not speak out—

Because I was not a remoaner

Then they came for the immigrants and I did not speak out—

Because I was not an immigrant.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

 

Booze

Bingo, thank you Booze, this is brilliant.

I had a bet with my wife that you would get to this – she thought it would be ‘Enemy of the people’ seeing as you like parroting right wing newspapers but I thought it would be ‘traitor’ (my daughter jokingly said it would be ‘mudblood’)

Anyway cheers I win the bet.