Brexit

Booze

Can you explain how that works and how it would makes things better than they are now?

 

Morrow and Booze

Sorry If you are afraid to say something because you fear been called racist then there is an old adage that what you want to say is probably racist.

Thing is if you believe something why not say it?

For a start tell me which people coming to this country you think are the problem?

I mean you mention race, and I’ve heard some arguments along that line.

Well just to mention the majority of people coming in from Europe are white and by the way of a Christian background, the Polish and Irish topping the list.

We do have migration from other countries usually linked to the UK by the historical ties of Empire, the biggest groups are Indian and Pakistani, (Hindi and Muslim) this migration is unaffected by EU entry.

Many analysists believe that if the number of immigrants coming from EU countries drop then the numbers from outside the EU are likely to rise.

 

Morrow and Booze

What information are you basing your views on?

Why do you think the benefit system is in such a bad way – is it the fault of immigrants or due to the neoliberal policies that have been followed over the last 30 years, that were calling for benefit cuts to ‘scroungers’ even before the unnecessary policies of austerity?

Again is that the fault of migrants or right wing neoliberal government policy.

Again is that the fault of migrants or right wing neoliberal government policy.

[edit]But migrants from the EU pay in more than they take out, they are not the reason for poverty and benefit cuts, but the neoliberal newspapers and right wing politicians who support those cuts would rather you blame migrants for those thing rather than the real culprits, them.

So you admire a right wing pundit that amongst other right wingers likes to misdirect people’s anger away from the neoliberal policies that cause so much hardship toward other things including migrants.

Why is that going to help?

And the major ‘strain’ on the system seems to be coming from neoliberalism not immigration.

 

Morrow and booze

Most of the problems racing Britain at the moment can me traced back to right leaning neoliberalist polices the country has been following for the last 30 odd years

Housing

Benefits

NHS

Education

Food banks

Homelessness

Mental Heath

Social Services

All these things have been badly effected by neoliberalism

SO is not surprising that the supporters of neoliberalism, right wing politicians and right leaning newspapers and many of the wealthy spend and lot of time and energy trying to convince people it is not neoliberalism that is the problem

So they blame migrants.

Is a con game.

 

I have given up on trying to humour and educate you Balbus, as you are just boring and irritating me now.
I have no intention in spending hours of my valuable time on your constant pathetic questions which go on and on and on and on and........

Please allow me to have just one last go at explaining to you why my Wife and I want to leave the EU.
And I will NOT have either the inclination or the time to keep trying to justify myself to remoaners who are sore losers, and who would not know what democracy was if it slapped them in the gob!

Brexit wasn’t complicated until May and her mostly remain MPs got their grubby little hands on it.

No deal is better than a bad deal she said.
Well her deal is a bucket of crap.

This issue was simple for me.

1. I want to leave the EU and take back control of our country.
2. I want our country to make our own laws and rules and govern ourselves completely.
This without the EU tail wagging the dog.
3. I did not want to stay in the EU and be part of a superstate.
4. I want this country of ours to have total control of our borders and control immigration.
Afer all.
It is my opinion that our country has gone to the dogs because of far too many foreigners coming in, and our culture has been sunk in a sea of immigrants.
5. Our NHS cannot cope.
6. Our housing cannot cope.
7. Our police cannot cope with crime and terrorism mostly imported from far eastern countries.
8. I was fed up with us giving billions of pounds in order to help feed the useless undemocratic eurocrats and overall, there are 46,356 people employed across all EU institutions, agencies and bodies, and breeding more as we speak.

I could go on for hours typing here trying to educate you further on this matter, but I have a day of better things to do lined up.

Have a nice day.

Cheers.

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As I’ve mentioned a few times the hard-line Brexiteers, see the EU as too socialist and want to leave whatever the cost to set up their neoliberal utopia on English soil.

But these people like Farage, Johnson and Rees-Mogg and Newspaper owners like the Murdochs and the Barclays don’t want to talk about that.

If they actually explained their neoliberal’s ideas-

such as tax cuts for the rich, more ‘austerity’ cutting benefits and social services, not having social housing, dismantling the NHS, the deregulation of working practices (more zero-hour contracts) and environmental policies (allowing more pollution) and so on and so on…

Do you thing people might start wondering why they were given these people their support?

So instead they wave the union jack, talk of floors of migrants and ‘taking back control and so on and so on

It’s called misdirection and I’m afraid it seems to work.

 

Booze

Well that could be your problem its simple to you because you really haven’t looked into it.

But you don’t seem to have a clue what that means

Can you please address the outstanding criticisms of that viewpoint? Thing is that we do make our own laws and govern ourselves and you seem unable to cite one case where this sn’t the case or of a law that you are against.

Why not

Again I’ve asked but you don’t seem able to explain what you mean by this or back it up in any way.

Which seems due to neoliberal policies such as ‘austerity’ than migration

Definitely due to neoliberal policies

What?

As for paying for EU membership well to repeat

I believe it cost somewhere close to 9 billion

But let’s put that in context - we spend:

145 billion on health

45 billion on defence

29 billion on transport

And 13 billion on overseas aid

We also contribute less (per head of population) than some other EU countries such as Germany.

For the 9 billion we get all the advantages of free trade with the EU members and with the EU trade deals with none EU countries along with a say in the regulations and policies set by the EU (unlike say Norway).

Some have put a figure of roughly £31bn-£92bn per year as the best estimate we have in terms of the additional value created to the UK economy through trade as a result of EU membership.

I don’t think you could explain further that is why you are making excuses to run away.

Please go back and look at your posts there is a lot of sound and fury but little or nothing of substance and when your views are questioned or criticised you run away.

Strange isn’t it that I’m happy to go into detail on any of this do the study make the connections look up the information but you are unwilling or unable to do any of that.

If you were going to buy a car and one person has the MOT, the log book and can answer all your questions about it and another seller has none of the paperwork and refuses to answer any of your questions about the car – which car would you most likely buy?

 

Booze

So I went looking -

At first glance, these figures might seem quite high, particularly if we look at the commission. But for an administrative staff covering institutions serving over 500m people it’s a shoestring operation, especially when we compare it to civil services operating at the national, or even local levels. Compare this, for example, to the 33,477 people employed by Birmingham City Council, covering a population of 1.1m in 2015-16.

How many people work for the EU?

[edit] On 31 March 2017, there were 332,800 Civil Service employees in England, 43,220 in Scotland, 32,440 in Wales and 3,760 in Northern Ireland.

 

Balbus

I have nothing further to say to you
Apart from that.
No comment!

 

Booze

My point is that you don’t want to explain or back up your views because you seem to understand that your views cannot be backed up or explained in any rational way.

The big problem is that many on the leaver side seem a lot like you.

The tragedy is that this situation is important and is going to hurt the country and child I love but many that wish to do this hurt, like yourself, don’t seem to care.

 

Disappointing. But maybe if someone else asks you similar questions you would be more willing?

Didn't it got complicated because the referendum was won with a meager majority of which
1) far from everybody wanted/wants a hard brexit
2) a significant amount stated later they felt misled (which they were) and might change their vote if they ever got another chance.

And just because you think a hard brexit suits your country and fellow countrymen (of which it would really be appreciated how a hard brexit doesn't rape your country's international trade, and how it solves stuff the UK doesn't decide all by itself, regardless wether they're out or in the EU) means it's simple for you. But most other british seem to think differently. Which, even if they're all wrong (i doubt it), already makes it far less simple.
But hey, I also think often that if everybody would just go along with me things would be a lot more simple

 

I have a few criticisms about this drama: Brexit (TV Movie 2019) - IMDb
But it was still a very interesting view of the Leave campaign, and how it was run.
Maybe leaving IS the best option, I can entertain that idea, but the campaign was run in a deliberately manipulative way. You gotta ask why that is.

 

Looking over the supposed ‘reasons’ for leavers wanting Brexit that have been posted and they seem less like reasons and more like the parroted headlines from the more fevered Eurosceptic press.

Tragically the neoliberal propagandist seem to have been successful.

The problems these people see or face are blamed not on right wing policies but on immigrants

The benefits are cut because of the migrants not because that’s what right wingers want so the money saved can go toward tax cuts.

The NHS can’t cope because of migrants not because right wingers have been running it down so they can say it needs to be privatised.

People are not getting good jobs with decent wages because of migrants not because that is what a neoliberal free market deregulated system creates.

The right wing propagandist seem to have created a legion of the unquestioning, they have successfully replaced things with a simple answer ‘migrants’ and hidden the truth behind that lie and so what do these people wish to vote for?

Right wing politicians with neoliberal ideas.

 

Why are his questions pathetic?
They wouldn't go on if you answered them.

His analogy about the car was a good one. Did you read it? It was at the end of his post, so I'm guessing you didn't. I don't think you're even reading his posts.

 

Please note.
I am done trying to reason with you or Balbus.
Please don't ask me ever again to try and justify either myself or the Brexit argument to you.
I tried.
I failed.
End of.
I am ignoring you now, and please don't ask me to explain why.

Have a nice day.

Cheers.

 

Booze

LOL oh come on man that is a barefaced lie, and you know it.

You have pumped out a lot of gumpf a lot of flimflam with a large dollop of bull shit but you haven’t even tried to explain you thinking or back up your spurious statements

As to 'reason' I haven’t seen any evidence that points to you even knowing what it is.

You’ve been ignoring me since you first posted here, you’ve been ignoring my inconvenient questions and ignoring the criticisms that seem to fatally undermine your views.

Thing is I’m sad that yet another leaver isn’t up to the task of explaining their views and the question still remains why do they still hold on to them, why do they not seem to care that they are going to cause so much pain and hardship.

 

No, you didn't.
There has literally not been even one attempt.
Not even a bad one.

 

If you don't want questions about brexit or your thoughts on it you shouldn't create a thread about it or post actively in other ones. Questions are free game and only YOUR problem if you can't answer them satisfactory (which seems to be the case)..

It doesn't have to end with you failing

Sigh... Why?? You started so promising

 

One way or another I do believe I have answered all relevant questions in many various posts in both threads by now.

But every now and again one gets the feeling that one is pissing in the wind.

Thank you for the cheeky sticky out tongue though.
At least that shows you have a sense of humour.
As do I!

 

Booze

LOL - And in the other way - that is called reality - you haven’t

Sorry mate but the smell I get off you is 100% pure Bull Shit