Brexit

Chancellor Hammond in talks with DUP is extremely worrying! How far is May prepared to go to clinch a victory? Then again it appears that she will not have a vote if she doesn't think her deal will pass. Democracy my arse!

 

Mal

Because that is often the best way to learn, to question.

If someone is unsure what another’s stance actually is then asking questions is a way of seeking clarification.

Not sure what you are talking about? Can you please explain?

And again I’m not sure what you are saying?

What do you mean by ‘bankrupt’?

A European integrated army has long been a dream of the European project, I mean the European project was about trying to stop the wars that have often plagued Europe through greater union and what better way than having one European army.

Also been part of NATO does not preclude there been a European army why should it?

 

Ethereal

The May plan seems to be to try and rule out all other options and keep putting forward her own deal up for vote until it gets passed

She tells the leavers that if they don’t vote for it there will be no Brexit at all and she tells the remainers that if they don’t vote for it there will be a crash out with no deal.

Its project fear on steroids.

PS: It also seems ironic that she is telling the countries they cannot vote again on Brexit (we voted once and that decision has to stand) but she will not accept the vote of Parliament and keeps putting forward the same defeated deal over and over.

 

I believe the speaker has just announced that Mrs May cannot bring forward her deal to be voted on unless there are substantial changes. He is using an old piece of legislation that is in place to stop a PM from bullying members!

 

Despite years of attempted austerity and economic reforms, the European Union is still facing a crisis due to the debt that Greece has accumulated - which stood at 177.4 per cent of GDP in 2015.

Although many are concerned about levels of debt in Greece, there are several other countries in the EU that have debts to rival the struggling nation, according to figures released by Eurostat.

So you want to Spend Billions on an EU army when Half of europe is ( you dont understand bankrupt ) Heavily in debt and cant afford one !

The 80 Billion is the so called Divorce bill originally asked for

You dont have to keep ( not understanding ) every time I try to make a point ? I am clear enough

 

Mal

Many places are still facing the problems raised by the financial crash of 2008 including the UK and US (as pointed out above). So still not sure what your point is? And many of the problems individual state within the Union are suffering are actually not the fault of the EU but are about the financial policies (mainly neoliberal) that those states followed, that meant they were not in a good position when the financial collapse hit in 2008.

In fact in this one of the criticisms you could level at the EU was that it didn’t have enough control of its members.

This isn’t a new army it’s about integrating the existing armies of Europe into more of a whole, the thing is that European countries already pay for the armies they have.

And as I’ve said the UK is opposed to the idea and would veto it, so pulling out of the EU means that opposition and veto is removed but anyway it is something that has been talked about for years and isn’t that much closer to happening.

So again I’m still not sure what point you are trying to make?

You might think you are but often people write assuming that others think the way they do and that is not always the case.[/quote][/quote]

 

God forbid if this lot were around during the war it would not be the the EU flag waving it would be the swastika

 

^ During the war we had Churchill, a pro-European PM. If we still had people like him, this whole brexit nonsense would never have arisen.

 

Providing his government could govern the country and not told by a load unelected buerocrats giving us laws we did not vote for

 

Bill

But it was a close run thing, I mean we had a hell of a lot of appeasers in politics at the time and Lord Halifax was all for trying to negotiate a peace deal with Hitler.

The Daily Mail of the time liked Hitler its owner Lord Rothermere was a friend of both Benito Mussolini and Adolf Hitler and favoured Oswald Mosley, even going so far as to personally write an article titled "Hurrah for the Blackshirts".

*

Thing is that these politicians are your average politicians - the BIG problem is that this is an impossible situation – there is simply is no good outcome if you leave the EU.

And I think a majority of politicians know it

BUT it seems that half the population and 80% of the media want a Brexit, and although they can’t even agree what that means, they are adamant about wanting it.

At this point if the ghosts of Churchill, Boudicca and Thatcher all appeared and told the leavers the truth they’d be shouted down as traitors trying to hold back the ‘will of the people’.

Its madness.

 

Art

The ‘unelected bureaucrats’ thing has already been covered in posts 468 and 469 it’s mainly based on a misunderstanding of how the EU works.

 

Should have listened to Tony Benn all those years ago, thankfully I did. I was the one percent like him who never believed in the EU

 

As i've said before

There are those on the right that think the EU is too socialist and want to leave whatever the cost so they can set up a neoliberal utopiaand there are those on the left that think the EU is too neoliberal and want to leave whatever the cost so they can set up a socialist utopia.

 

And now we have Mrs May playing the blame game with her being the innocent party. I really hope that parliament sees it for what it is - yet another cynical move in her efforts to win at all costs! This is not a game darling and you should be totally totally ashamed of you tactics!

 

Incredible arrogance. This is a new low even for May.

 

I think she is just getting her recriminations in first before the shit storm of blaming really begins – I mean there is no good outcome from all of this not even if we rescinded article 50 and burn the letter the damage that has already been done and will generate a Kiloton blast of blame but if we go through with leaving with a deal it goes to up to the 15 megaton blast of Castle Brava BUT crashing out will produce the biggest bastard ever the 50 megaton blast of the Tsar bomba.

Fun facts

 

Waiting with baited breath on news of the summit

 

Petition to revoke Article 50 and remain in the EU

The UK Government and Parliament website

Petition: Revoke Article 50 and remain in the EU.

Popular issues usually get around 200,000 it was at 1m by 5pm yesterday then 2m at around 10pm and this morning it’s at 2.6

Of course it is been dismissed by the leavers but the higher it goes the better ammunition for the remainers.

 

As many said at the time why trigger Article 50 at the very beginning why not wait until you had something that had a consensus then you would have the time to work out the details of that consensus

But again it seems to have been triggered to placate the bolshie Eurosceptic faction in the Tory party and grab some UKIP votes meaning May and the Tory leaders only realised that there was NO consensus possible after it was triggered.

So we now get the extension(s)

OK

As I understand this –

If Meaningful Vote 3 passes the May deal we get an extension to May 22 to work out the details and pass the legislation needed.

If MV3 doesn’t pass the EU will give us extension to April 12 at which point we have to join in the EU elections and stay in for some time after or we crash out (I think we can’t be a legal member of the EU if we have no EU representative in the European parliament).

Thing is there still is no consensus

 

Going to the Peoples Vote march in London on Saturday

Put it to the People

Anyone got any good ideas for placard slogans?

READER GALLERY: The best placards from the People’s Vote march