Berkeley - it has started - we need to support their decision about banning marines

I don't think these Vietnamese women and children who were among the hundreds killed during the infamous My Lai massacre of 1968, during the Vietnam War, and many other atrocities, we're quite thankful for the U.S. Army, to be honest...

 

I guess, those victims of crimes committed by our returning veterans aren't so lucky after all...



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Yes, actually, the military is full of misfits, including child rapists, and child murderers.


GI gets 100 years for raping Iraqi girl, murders

Army sergeant admitted partaking in gang rape of Iraqi girl, family’s killing

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17247852/



Mohammed al-Janabi, uncle of the girl raped and killed by American soldiers, displays death certificates and IDs on his niece's grave in July 2006 in Mahmoudiya, Iraq.

 

Perhaps, you can tell your holocaust survivor friend, that the military is infiltrated with Neo-Nazis and various hate groups. :jester:

 

Yup, the My Lai masacre was horrible, the marine convicted of raping a girl derserve 100 years in jail. Now, why is it you cannot give the soldiers who ended the Holocaust ANY credit? Why? Why are so so blinded by hatred for them you cannot even give them credit for the many, many good things they have done?? Are you saying that holocaust survivors did not derserve to be liberated? Why do you continue to lable an entire group based on the actions of a very few?

 

Is this just Steve, or me too? Because I did point out that this isn't an argument about whether the military can be used for good or not.

 

Just Steve

 

Ah ok then

 

Just like any other organization, branches of the military have people that are unfit to wear the uniform.

Just because some priest molested some kids, that doesnt make ALL priests child molestors, in the same way that because some sick mother fucker who wears the same uniform as I, does something such as that, makes me just like him.

I know people who smoke crack, work at McDonalds, I dont assume all people that work at McDonalds smoke crack.

There are many a good people who are serving in our military today, and some of the most important people in ANY countries history, served in the Military.

Don't attack the hard working, selfless individuals who get sent to far away places to die a horrible death. Young men and women who joined because they know its the right thing to do, and because many of them, had nothing but a life of poverty, drug abuse or gang banging, before they joined. It is not them who you should be angry at, it is the government who makes their service necessary, by choosing war. And not always by our own (U.S.) governments fault.


I myself intend to get out after my contract expires, and I want to go to school, back at home, and become a High school teacher. So I can help kids who were like me, before they have to go down the same path as I. College is the way to go, for sure, it is deffinatly the easier route. But many people are not ready for college out of high school, and many more would never have the chance to go, would it not be for serving their time.

So are you going to tell them that the decision they made, so they could grow up, get out of poverty and make something of themselves, get a job, a house, and have a family, live the American Dream, as it is, is wrong?

Anyone who wants to tell me that my service in the United States Navy makes me a lesser person than you, is out of touch with reality, and apparently to privledged to realize that not everyone has, or had the opportunity that they them selves have, or had.

I know that joining and serving has made me a better than most. I have taken the road less traveled. The harder, longer route to where I want to go. But I will get there eventually.

Honor, Courage, Commitment. Those are the laurels I live by, that were instilled into me. To some of you, they may just be words. To us, the ones who took a step forward, instead of backwards. It's more than that.

Steve, it IS identified as a problem, and steps ARE being taken to solve the problem. But just like ANYOTHER WORKPLACE stuff happens, that should nto have. That article cited 19 people being discharged. I know of a small group of Sailors who just recently got discharged for having White supremacy tatoos, on their armpits. They had them their because that kind of stuff is looked for, and if found, the offendors WILL be kicked out, with all loss of benefits. Modern day Navy, and Air-Force, I have not been stationed on a Army base, and marines fall under Navy Regulations. But I know that in the Navy, and Airforce, they regard the workplace as a professional enviroment. That kind of behaviour is NOT accepted, that is not to say it does not happen. When it is found to happen, it is harshly punished.


Unrelated, I also long for the day than I will be able to smoke that wonderful green grass again. I fully intend on setting up a small hydroponic grow, for myself.

 

Isn't judging all by the action of a few the basis for bigotry?

 

i read the comments and just get mad.
how people can be such aliens? how the people of America can be against the people who put their life on the line so the citizens of U.S.A (including the citizens of Berkeley) can live their life safely? to sleep well, to work, study, watch tv, get into Hip forums and live their normal life.

people refuse to understand that there are a lot of evil people and groups in the world. they won't calm down untill they get their mission. you think if not the marines there were no war in the world?

Marines protecting every one of you, members of Hip forum. remember that if not the marines you wouldn't be here.

Marins trying to donate their own country and insted of get thanks and being heros they get spit in their face.

(im sorry for my lame english, it's not my mother tongue)

 

Um, no Mr Legend, the soldiers are not 'protecting' us, they are involved in wars of aggression, not defense. It's absurd to think that if the US, UK and Auz weren't in Afghanistan and Iraq then we would have been invaded by Islamists, all they are doing is fueling the fires of fundamentalism.

What we are doing here is protesting the fact that Army recruiters can turn up in schools and pump propaganda at children and young adults to get them to die for no reason other than to put money in the pockets of Exxon's shareholders.

 

you already been invaded by Islamists.
maby you forgot the 9/11.
thousands of inocent people died, leaved a bleeding hole in their loved ones and a huge bleeding hole in the nation.

 

That's the neocon nonsense that's constantly put out there as an excuse for anything. That wasn't an invasion. That was an attack. That's like saying that punching someone in the face means you own them. It was a horrific event, but, last time I checked, the Western governments were still in control. Violence fuels violence, Islamism needs to be calmed with rational thought and peace talks, in the same way that the violence in Northern Ireland was. You seem to have bought up the idea that Saddam was some sorta threat to the world, in fact, him and Osama hated each other, Iraq was a pretty secular society under the Bathists.

 

they're not protecting us from anything, eexcept freedom.

 

why they in control? becouse of the brave men and women who put their life on the line.

you think if we put our weapons down so the Islamic terrorists put it down too?
then think again.
in the moment we put our guns down they will shot us.

Saddam was crazy man. he and his sons hurled terror on the Iraqi people.
maby he wasn't dangerous for U.S.A in dirrect way (becouse he didn't had the resources) but he was part of The Evil Chain. him, Bin Laden, Sheikh Yasin.

in the first Gulf War he shouted on Israel even though Israel didn't take a part of the war.

You can't imagine how much corruption was made by him and his sons.

 

I didn't say he was a good person.

Firstly, no, that is pure and utter bullshit. Do you know why they are still in control? Because that was an act of terrorism, not a military invasion. You need a sustained attack to invade, and even with Saudi and Pakistani funding, Al Qaeda doesn't have the resources or power to launch an invasion of the US. A military should be limited, and only used DEFENSIVELY, neither the invasion of Afghanistan or Iraq were remotely defensive.

Again, look at Northern Ireland, we (the British) tried to solve it by marching in, kicking the shit out of anyone, and promoting a society where Irish = Danger. Did it work, of course it fucking didn't, all you do by trying to use violence to solve terrorism is fuel the terrorists. What did we do to solve the problem? We talked to them, negotiated, made peace talks, guess what? It solved the problem. The wounds'll take time to heal, but the P-IRA stopped their bombing campaign.

I do not support Hamas, Hezbollah ect in any way . but I understand that there is a lot to be learned from Israel's foreign policy, it tends to amount to throwing your weight around and getting rather upset when people fight back.

 

shouldn't we fight bad people?
in other words you saying: Sadam was Iraqi problem, let them deal with him.
but what about doing the right thing?
i give you an example: you see old lady geting robed by some man.
you have two options:
1. to say "it's not my problem".
2. to catch him and put him behing bars.

what will be your choice?

Sometimes by attcking you defending.
What would you do if you were the president of U.S.A after 9/11?
wouldn't you send soldiers to catch the people who responsible for that?

Don't compare IRA with Islamic terror. it's different things.
Islamic terror is global threat.
Islamic terror is radical.

you CAN NOT negotiate with people who declere that they won't stop until all U.S.A be muslims.
you CAN NOT negotiate with people who shot a baby in the head on purpose(Shalhevet Pas murder).
you CAN NOT negotiate with people who execute someone by Decapitation and laughting while he's groan (Daniel Pearl murder). (by British national of Pakistani origin Ahmed Omar Saeed Sheikh).

Islamic terror is another level of terrorism.

 

Firstly, of course we should fight bad people, but there are ways of doing it that don't have to involve countless pointless deaths. Not to mention that there are/were far worse dictators than Saddam that we've happily let murder their people for ages without a second thought, funnily enough those countries tend to have a lack of oil hmmmm...

Secondly, attacking can be defending, but that doesn't mean it always is, neither the Afghanistan war or the Iraqi war were wars of defence.

Think for a second, you march into a country chock full of fundamentalists, with the intent of catching several fundamentalists. The surrounding area is full of fundamentalists who support those your are looking for. Do you really believe there would even be the remotest chance of capturing said people? We've caught the odd one, but at the loss of thousands of lives on both sides and the loss of civil liberties.

Admittedly, they are different things, but just because they were smaller scale, doesn't mean the same doesn't apply.

By your definition, you can't negotiate with American soldiers. The massacre at Hadifa, and the use of torture at Abu Greihb (and eastern european black sites) , by your argument, define every Marine.

In the same way that this is not the case, nor is it with militant Islamism. Not every insurgent is a morally flawed psychopath. Many of them can be talked to, negotiated with, and calmed. This is how the problem must be solved. Not through violence that only makes it easier for extremists to recruit new people. All they need do now, since the Afghan and Iraqi invasions, is to pass someone a couple of propaganda pictures and stories (just as you have done here) and you have another recruit.

 

I guess, you didn't know that Ronald Reagan was, and that Bush & the Neo-Conservatives are themselves, fucking terrorists.

So, the Marines should really be protecting American citizens from the Neo-Con assholes.

You just barely learned to wipe your own ass, let alone have had enough life experiences to understand how the world really works, heck, you can't even spell correctly. LoL. :jester:

Grow up some more, learn to gather outside information and develop your own critical thinking skills as opposed to merely aping and sucking up what your government tells you is their version on any matter.

Governments can and do lie, if you haven't figured that out yet.

Besides, being a citizen of Israel, you really shouldn't be messing with American politics. Learn to fight your own wars too.