barefootin' & school

i love it when people call guns weapons, only furthering the view that guns are bad(guns can't load themselves, sit up off a surface, point at and shoot someone). BTW people get injured/killed more often by cars, but do people say "hey you got a v6 or a v8 under the hood of that weapon."

 

I think it was more complicated than that. I beleive she was running around in the class throwing a tantrum and breaking things and just making a mess and causing a scene and the teachers could not control her so they took the other students out of the room and called the police. When the police got there, the 3 who were trying to arrest her were even having trouble doing so because she was putting up such a fuss. I think she actually calmed down before they tried to arrest her but she started back in when they put the handcuffs on her. Basically this is just a case where the mother lost control of her little girl a long time ago and the kid turned into a little brat and knew she could cause a big tantrum to get away with things and get what she wanted. The only reason the news channels even covered this is because she was a black girl and they want people to think that the big bad white cops are preying on the little innocent black children, if she was white im sure they wouldnt even have bothered or at least they wouldnt have made such a big deal about it.

 

Cars CAN kill people but that is not what they were built or designed for, but guns were soley built to kill and destroy things and they really have no other use. Thats why people call guns weapons and they dont call cars weapons because cars are not weapons unless used for that purpose.

 

Just so y'all know, May 2nd is barefoot for peace day: don't wear shoes to school.
The idea is that if we're gonna go around bombing the hell out of third world countries, I'm gonna know sort of what it feels like to be in one of those countries.
I am also fasting on may 2nd but the day is officially barefoot for peace day.
Spread it around, let's make it national!

 

I knew you would come up with a list of excuses for the police. You're sick, Mike. If you ever have kids, you'll think differently. It's amusing how you call for students to protest but have no concern about them getting arrested for not conforming to the dress code. Nice too how you reverted to playing the dumb race card with that little girl.

 

This situation is different than most and when a kid gets out of control and the teachers cannot maintain order then they have to call the cops. The cops just handcuffed her, they didnt arrest her because they cant arrest a 5 year old. They only handcuffed her to keep her from hurting anyone. Normally I dont think the cops should be called in unless absoulutely necessary but I think in this case they had no choice.

If it was a simple dress code issue then of course I dont think they should get arrested for that. Im talking about this other situation with this out of control 5 year old that the police had to come to the school to get under control. In reality the parents shouldve taught the little brat better manners so that she wouldnt go nuts at school the way she did but like I said her mother lost control of her a long time ago. This is something the parents shouldve dealt with along time ago and didnt and unfortunately now its something the teachers and police had to sort out.

White girl, black girl, makes no difference to me, they wouldve handled the situation right no matter what her race was. race had nothing to do with why the police came, it was because she was being a brat that they had to come and get the girl under control.

 

First of all, she's only five so she didn't really hurt anyone -she was throwing some stuff on the floor and seems to have broken a ceramic apple. She's too small to seriously hurt anyone. Second, did you watch the tape? Just before the cops handcuffed her you can see her finally sitting down at the table as she had been asked. She'd *stopped* walking around and throwing stuff on the floor.

 

She couldve just as easily thrown that apple at another kid or a teacher and seriously hurt someone, probably wouldnt happen like you said but i dont think they were willing to take that chance and i dont necessarily blame them. I wouldve hoped the teachers couldve gotten her under control but if they couldnt then they did what was right by calling the police.

Maybe not a teacher but she couldve easily hurt a fellow student.

Until they handcuffed her and then she exploded again......they just didnt wanna take any chances. If the girl had been good and simply been taught better by her mother then this wouldve never happened. Its the mother's fault for being such a bad parent and not instilling good behavior routines on this child when she was younger like a good parent would.

 

She was already separated from the other students. Even when the apple was broken, and most definitely when she sat down in the office. I wasn't suggesting sending her back into the classroom.

I do agree it's probably a serious problem in how she's raised (although there *are* kids whose behavioral problems are caused by all kinds of other causes, I believe most of them are still the parents' fault, who just don't raise their kids right and are only too happy to blame some disease or disorder). I just don't agree how it was handled.

 

Part of the problem may be that the school officials themselves don't want to physically handle a child that is mishaving out of fear of themselves being sued. It looked from the video like the school officials were trying to block her path but didn't actually manhandle her. Calling the police seems like a way of getting off the hook but the school will end up getting sued anyway because of this.

Many of these arrests are for disorderly conduct. Going barefoot at school could easily be construed as disorderly conduct and can lead to an arrest if school officials are that crazy about it.

http://mitglied.lycos.de/FrankGemkow/konkret/lessons/20040105monday.html

"In cities and suburbs around the country, schools are increasingly sending students into the juvenile justice system for the sort of adolescent misbehavior that used to be handled by school administrators. In Toledo and many other places, the juvenile detention center has become an extension of the principal's office.

School officials say they have little choice. "The goal is not to put kids out, but to maintain classrooms free of disruptions that make it impossible for teachers to teach and kids to learn," said Jane Bruss, the spokeswoman for the Toledo public schools. "Would we like more alternatives? Yes, but everything has a cost associated with it."

Others, however, say the trend has gone too far.

"We're demonizing children," said James Ray, the administrative judge for the Lucas County juvenile court, who is concerned about the rise in school-related cases. There were 1,727 such cases in Lucas County in 2002, up from 1,237 in 2000.

Fred Whitman, the court's intake officer, said that only a handful of cases — perhaps 2 percent — were for serious incidents like assaulting a teacher or taking a gun to school. The vast majority, he said, involved unruly students.

In Ohio, Virginia, Kentucky and Florida, juvenile court judges are complaining that their courtrooms are at risk of being overwhelmed by student misconduct cases that should be handled in the schools.

Although few statistics are available, anecdotal evidence suggests that such cases are on the rise.

"Everybody agreed — no matter what side of the system they're from — that they are seeing increasing numbers of kids coming to court for school-based offenses," said Andy Block, who assisted in a 2001 study of Virginia's juvenile justice system by the American Bar Association's Juvenile Defender Center. "All the professionals in the court system were very resentful of this. They felt they were being handed problems and students that the schools were better equipped to address."

According to an analysis of school arrest data by the Advancement Project, a civil rights advocacy group in Washington, there were 2,345 juvenile arrests in 2001 in public schools in Miami-Dade County, Fla., nearly three times as many as in 1999. Sixty percent, the project said, were for "simple assaults" — fights that did not involve weapons —and "miscellaneous" charges, including disorderly conduct."

 

Yes, they can arrest her. However, the police didn't press charges. Wow We should be proud they only cuffed her hands and feet and didn't use the tear gas or tasers.


Second and third graders arrested.

http://www.infowars.com/print/ps/8-yr-oldarrest.htm


Third graders arrested for making violent stick figure drawings.

http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/Disturbing Truths/america_has_gone_insane.htm


MONTICELLO, FL-September 29, 2004 — The mother of a seven-year-old Florida boy says he's too young to have been arrested, booked and taken to a juvenile facility.

Sheriff's officials in Monticello say they didn't have a choice because a warrant for battery charges had been issued for the child. He's four-foot-six and weights 60 pounds.

He's accused of hitting a classmate, a teacher and a principal, and scratching a school resource officer. But the boy's family has retained a lawyer and disputes the official account of what happened. The lawyer says the boy has an attention deficit disorder

The mother of Johnnie Lee Morris – whose name was released by the attorney – says he was held in detention for several hours.

The boy is under house arrest.

(Copyright 2004 by the Associated Press. All rights reserved.)

 

I think you can arrest third graders but from what I heard this was a 5yr old girl and it was in Kindergarten and I dont think you can arrest children that young, I think they gotta be a lil bit older. Besides the police DIDNT arrest her they simply put handcuffs on her to keep her under control so that she would not hurt anyone else or herself. It was for her own saftey and I know you dont like to hear that but it was and it kept everybody else safe too. This kinda stuff happens rarely and wouldnt happen if parents were more on the ball and had control of their children and taught them proper behavior at school.

 

I know she was however I beleive that the police wanted to put handcuffs on her simply to ensure beyond a doubt that she would not get loose and hurt anyone else or herself. Putting handcuffs on someone doesnt hurt them and while she might not have liked it im sure it wouldnt cause her any emotional damage more than she probably already has from not being brought up right. I think she just needs to be taught what is appropriate in the classroom and what isnt so this does not happen again.

Well its obvious here that she was not brought up right by her parents and if she had been brought up right then of course the issue of other reasons for the problem could be brought up but this was a simple case of a child who was not taught proper behavior. I dont necessarily like how they treated the situation either but I think it became necessary to do what they did but thats extremely rare and no harm was done to her. I know you guys dont like cops and I know you think this is some race issue but I think the cops just did what they felt was best and they wouldve done the exact same thing to some white girl so race really had nothing to do with this.

 

I think with this situation it wouldve been a no win scenario no matter what the school officials did. If they hadnt taken any action then the parent would blame them for not stopping the child from doing what she did and had they taken action then the parent wouldve blamed them for abusing their child. The school officials shouldve done whatever was necessary within reason to stop the child from doing what she was doing to ensure that she didnt hurt anyone else or herself and then they shouldve told the parent they didnt want them bringing this child back to this school until they could get it under control and teach it proper behavior in a classroom because what that child did was unacceptable and the blame is soley on the parent because of their lack of educating the child properly before putting it in a public school. I can understand how they felt though and why they called the cops.

I think they were just trying to do what little they had to do that would be enough to stop her without going overboard but I think they needed to have taken more action.

Yeah so it really would not have mattered if they had just taken action into their own hands to stop the child but under the circumstances I can understand them asking for help from the police.

I think that there would actually need to be some sort of violence or outburst on part of the student that actually posed a significant risk to the staff or other students at the school for the police to actually make an arrest. They wouldnt just do it simply because the student was barefoot and the teachers didnt like it. Thats a dumb thing to call the police for anyways, thats something the teachers and students need to deal with and let the police deal with more serious and important issues. Thats why people get shot on freeways because the police are too busy taking crap calls from idiots at schools who are upset about barefeet.

 

Some people in the U.S. need to re-evaluate their ideological stance. We have a group of people who support this growing atmosphere of conservative, authoritarian, zero tolerance, call-the-police approach and who at the same time seem to think that this system they support is somehow going to warmly embrace children protesting how they want to dress at school. Yeah, right. Then, not willing to admit they are supporting the wrong polticians and the wrong system, they come up with confused arguments, such as: the students got arrested at school for wearing the wrong shirt or going barefoot because of gun control. Or, the arrests had nothing to do with dress code but were the result of some sort of fictitious thing behind the scenes that we will never know about. Therefore, the arrests are all justified, and yet this same system will somehow magically embrace the rights of students to protest at school. Yeah, ok.

 

Basically the teachers need to get off their asses and do their job and the parents need to take some responsibility for how their kids act and actually raise them better than they do. That'll solve alot of problems right there.

I think it really depends on just what kind of "protesting" these kids are doing. Im sure the school would only call the police if they felt that what the kids were doing or saying was somehow harmful or endangering other students or teachers or themselves. In most situations I beleive the schools just handle things themselves unless it gets out of hand and then they call the cops.

I actually think more goes on in some of these arrest situations than the media would like you to know because they dont care about giving you the facts they just want a good story and if what happened was reasonable then it wouldnt be a good story so they only give you the little tidbits of what happened that make you come to the conclusion about the situation that they want you to come to. Alot of these news guys dont like police and they dont like people infringing on personal rights so of course theyre going to make something simple into a big fat hairy situation that its not. I just beleive that most situations you hear about at schools with arrests have more serious things going on than is generally known.

Most of the time im sure the arrests are justified and very rarely are they not. Usually when they areint justified people find out about it and such things quickly stop happening.

 

There sure seems to be a lot of student arrests lately. There were a few thousand in Miami last year and about 1700 in Lucas County, Ohio, which is a rural area. Lucas has laws which provide the basis for arresting students. I have to wonder what the 1700 arrests were for in Lucas. The police and judicial system are clogged as it is, and the trend is toward more student arrests each year. Even for those who believe all the arrests are justified, they aren't going to solve anything and are already overloading the legal system. A few years from now there might be 6000 student arrests in Lucas and people will still claim they are all justified.

We're all nieve if we think the school systems are going to allow student protesting on a selective basis. It just isn't going to happen in the atmosphere that's enveloping the U.S. It's unfortunate that people who grew up in the 80's and later will never know the openness and freedom that existed in the decades before them.

 

Aech is an anti-gun, anti-individual liberty, pro-statism troll. I've never seen worse tripe come out of someone intent on proving that the general populace is unworthy of the freedom to have guns for their own defense.


Yeah, that's right, Aech, every human being in the world -- with the obvious exception, right, of people in government, police and military forces -- are too stupid or dangerous to own guns. But it's okay when large military forces are able to do so -- after all, what would the world be if it weren't for such forces throwing their weight around.

You are wrong about Switzerland. I have an article in a magazine (missing at this time, but I'll be looking for it now) that details the HUGE popularity of the shooting sports in Switzerland. They may not use the actual military rifles that they are issued to keep at home, but they shoot like crazy at town competitions all the time, and being a lousy shot is cause for shame!

Like TrippinBTM pointed out, your alternative -- that of a government with a monopoly on force -- has proved radically dangerous time and time again throughout history. No one is saying that if the People had to rise up against a government run amok, that it would be a pretty, easily won conflict and freedom would blossom directly. But if the people didn't have any means of fighting, it would be over before it began, with NO HOPE WHATSOEVER of freedom ever being wrested back from the government.

Your attitude reeks like the fecal stench of Statism -- the government, the state, is superior in all respects to the People who are governed. That's your ideology. Most of us here won't tolerate it.

-Jeffrey

 

LMAO!

Okay, if I can stop laughing long enough...

You're saying that when a totalitarian, violent government regime, like in Rwanda, Somalia, Nigeria, Haiti... goes about its evil business oppressing the people and killing dissidents, it's the soft-spoken pacifists who are going to talk them out of being a totalitarian, violent regime? What the fuck are you smokin'?! What on earth makes you think that REASON can be used against GREEDY, CORRUPT PSYCHOTICS?!

Do you realize that you rob yourself of all credibility when you wish for people you don't agree with to shoot themselves or otherwise get themselves killed? Also, you do the same when you suggest that psychotic dictators will listen kindly to soft-spoken dissidents but cannot be uprooted by force, by an armed and determined populace.

You're laughable, dude.

-Jeffrey