Are the Democrats back on track?

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Balbus, Jun 27, 2018.

  1. GeorgeJetStoned

    GeorgeJetStoned Odd Member

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    What Trump should do is allow the democrats to get fully invested into the demand for marijuana legalization. Then run the table and get it legalized from his end. It wins public opinion and the democrats can still mine the results. It's very similar to what the NFL pulled over on Trump and the USFL, so Trump should remember how it works.
     
  2. Piney

    Piney Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

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    For The State of New York, the most interesting race is Govenor where Liberal challenger: Cynthia Nixon is running against Gov. Andrew Cuomo.
    .
     
  3. GeorgeJetStoned

    GeorgeJetStoned Odd Member

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    It will be interesting to see if the Cortez magic can be carried to the top office in a state. But I have my doubts. It skips over important positions like mayor, state attorney, lt. governor etc. Nixon has less of this mojo than Cortez and her pedigree includes being one of the few to show her boobs on Sex and the City.

    Cortez pulled off a well-calculated localized coup with national implications. A version of the American Dream. Nixon lives in a wealth bubble, hoping to capitalize on stardom. After all, Reagan did, right?

    Actually, Reagan was a democrat until he was polluted by the unions in Hollywood. Then he went for the dark side, cash. Reagan took the traditional route and even after being blackballed was able to garner respect in California. The California economy was good and the world looked toward Silicon valley for guidance.

    I don't see Nixon as a viable vote against Cuomo. A lot of democrats think it's bad form to challenge a long-held (or high profile) seat. It's why Hillary didn't challenge Obama in 2012. What Cynthia could be though is a vote siphon. I don't know how it works in New York, but a New York republican (an endangered species I think) could potentially take great advantage of a divided democrat party.

    Food for thought (as I lean toward another toke)
     
  4. Balbus

    Balbus Senior Member

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    It seems to me that the Democratic Socialists of America are trying deal with the realities of 21st century America as a counterpoint to the rhetoric of the right which seems all about myths of the past (like the ‘American Dream’)

    In a post on immigration to the US I pointed out that - If anything ‘socialism’ came about as a reaction against many of the things that were fuelling the migrations to the US the inequality of wealth dominated societies that left many Europeans in poverty (the Communist Manifesto came out in 1848)…And that…by the 1940’s the land and recourses [of the US} where locked in as they had been in the Europe of the 19th century and the US has become like the Europe of the time, a wealth dominated society with the accompanying inequality.

    Interesting enough socialism had grown as a movement in the US, but a concerted effort had been made to purge its idea from society made by the established political and economic powers of the time, one of the major purges beginning in the 1940’s (McCarthy, the Un-American Activities Committee)

    The 30 odd years of the neo-liberal experiment in the US has had a great impact on social and economic inequality in the US and the accompanying economic globalisation (which is an integral part of free market neo-liberal ideology) has or is drastically realigning the US economy in favour of the wealthy few.

    This is very similar to other industrial and economic disruptions in the past the industrial revolution caused a lot of unrest across Europe (e.g. the revolutions of 1848) and as said brought about the rise of socialist ideas along with social and economic changes (the rise of liberal ideas in the UK and the Bismarck social contract). Then there was the period following the great depression which again saw a peek in an interest with socialism across Europe but also the rise of Fascism.

    So far in the US we have seen the rise of Trumpism on the right, I’m hoping a democratic socialist response from the left can counter it.
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2018
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  5. ~Zen~

    ~Zen~ Ancient Mariner Administrator

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    I sure hope so, there needs to be a balance in this world. Swinging one way or the other leads to wars, starvation and chaos.
     
  6. GeorgeJetStoned

    GeorgeJetStoned Odd Member

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    Perhaps that is the actual balance. Maybe we're lucky it's not a more profound division. It's pretty obvious that "just be nice" isn't working. I admit though, sometimes it does stay in the middle for a time. Maybe we're in some kind of harmonic event. I wonder what sustained middle ground would be like.
     
  7. Okiefreak

    Okiefreak Senior Member

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    Are the Democrats back on track? When did they leave the rails? I'd say in 1972, when the Demos put up McGovern, the Solid South became solid Republican. But a case could also be made for 1980, when blue collar workers ditched the Democrats for Reagan, who then screwed them by methodically undermining labor unions. Or was it 1992, with the Clinton ascendancy and his strategic alliance with Wall Street and the "wealth creators"? (He called it "triangulation" which meant positioning himself to right, left and center as the lesser of evils). I'm not sure, but the former Democrat base is now the Republican base. Democrats have since made gains mainly by standing back and watching the Republicans self-destruct, which they did so well under G.W. and hopefully are on their way to doing again under the Donald. To do better than that, they need a leader who can unite the lunch pail voters with the minorities and women. Who is that person? I think Biden and Bernie are too long in the tooth, as are their messages, and young starlet Cortez, while appealing to millenial idealists, is still a fledgling and too far left to appeal to middle American working class voters. Maybe a new face will emerge from the rubble left behind by the Mueller probe or some economic downturn. I'm not holding my breath. Pragmatism is what we need.
     
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  8. Piney

    Piney Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

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    Ms. Ocasio Cortez may have won the Democratic Party primary, defeating incumbent congressman Joe Crowley, however Crowley does remain on the November ballot under the ticket of the New York Working Famlies Party. Mr Crowley is the chairman of the Queens, NY Democratic Party a machine politician par excellence. He may yet win the election.

    People keep discussing : Republicans; but it is the Democratic machine that must be overcome first by the Democratic Socialists.

    The Working Famlies Party typically runs candidates to the Left of mainline Democrats. In a deep Blue state like New York, they act to pressure Democrats leftward on the issues.
    This is a bit of a reversal with Joe Crowley as their candidate.

    A big part of the drama of the NY. Govenor's race is to see who gets the nod from Working Famlies, they have endorsed Cynthia Nixon.
    Cynthia Nixon can run in the general election without the Democratic line, potentialy siphoning off votes from Democratic Candidate Andrew Cuomo.
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2018
  9. Piney

    Piney Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

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    Noting That Senator Dianne Feinstien is having trouble securing the California Democratic Party endorsement. She is a four term incumbent.

    Sometimes it not about the Republicans.

    How loudly doeth your dogma reside in you?

    Feinstein gets progressive smackdown
     
  10. Piney

    Piney Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

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    Remembering when sitting President Jimmy Carter was challenged from the Left as a an incumbent for re-nomination.
    The challenge may have left him damaged for the general election against Regan in 1980.

    Bernie tried not to damage Hillary, it was obvious.
     
  11. GeorgeJetStoned

    GeorgeJetStoned Odd Member

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    Bernie was sandbagged by the DNC and the Clintons. He wasn't about to kindly step aside. Until they came off with cash and prizes.
     
  12. Monkey Boy

    Monkey Boy Senior Member

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    Just run Hillary again.
     
  13. r0llinstoned

    r0llinstoned Gute Nacht, süßer Prinz

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    lmaaaaooooo
     
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  14. Monkey Boy

    Monkey Boy Senior Member

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  15. pineapple08

    pineapple08 Members

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    What do you mean by pragmatism?
     
  16. Okiefreak

    Okiefreak Senior Member

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    What I mean is "practical", as opposed to purist: striking a balance between principles, on the one hand, and the reality of getting something done on the other, which takes compromise. More concretely, this means mobilizing effective resources without selling out to the donors. More specifically, it means finding an effective middle ground between Bernie and Hillary.
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2018
  17. Piney

    Piney Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

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    Hey, Her Server was not hacked by the Ruskies. Maybe she is up on things.
     
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  18. Piney

    Piney Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

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  19. Monkey Boy

    Monkey Boy Senior Member

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    "Centrist" politicians want people to believe that issues like universal healthcare are very far from the mainstream even though every other developed nation has it at half the cost. The truth is pretty much every politician is bought off by big pharma and other healthcare racketeers and universal healthcare would hurt their bottom line. Even Mexico is implementing it. Maybe that's why Trump is building the wall.
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2018
  20. Okiefreak

    Okiefreak Senior Member

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    Fact is the Tea Party types, with money from those "health care racketeers" have been able to exploit fears of (gasp) "socialism" to their advantage every time the Demos bring up universal health care. I think universal health care would be great for the American people. I see no evidence that it's a popular issue, and that raising it to the forefront would be any more immune from demagogic attack than it's been in the past. A party that's been shut out of power at every level should be careful what issues it picks to try to rally support.
     
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