Anzac Day

Discussion in 'Australia' started by Trickster, Apr 24, 2007.

  1. Trickster

    Trickster Misfit

    Spare a thought today for the courage and sacrifice that our fellow Australians committed on our country's behalf. Their efforts have made it possible for us to have freedom and peace.
    Our nation's identity is filled with memories of the past. Our nation's people, are consumed with pride and awe for what our past servicemen and women gave, and what current day soldiers continue to give.
    On ANZAC day, i can't help but shed a tear for the horrific things that our young men and women faced. But i also am filled with great honour, at being reminded of what true spirit and guts is all about.
    I never feel more proud to be an Australian, when i think about our magnificent Australian servicemen and women. Whether the Army, Navy or Airforce, to stand side by side with mates and fellow soldiers, willing to give their lives to protect their fellow soldiers and country, is the most selfless act in existence.

    So today, on this special day, my thoughts are of the Aussie soldier, whether on land, in the air or on the sea. Whether on Aussie soil or far away, that are in my thoughts and the thoughts of a supportive and honoured nation.




    Age shall not weary them,
    nor the years condemn;
    at the going down of the sun and in the morning
    we will remember them.



    LEST WE FORGET
     
  2. guy

    guy Senior Member

    i feel especially proud when i know that a digger has put a bullet in the brain of some defenceless peasant in a country far away on the orders of another country far far away. god bless them all.

    thank god i have the media to fill me with all this tripe
     
  3. Trickster

    Trickster Misfit

    While there are deaths of innocent people, this is about fighting the Turks and Germans. War was what it was and the soldiers were only doing what they were told.
    What makes it so ridiculous, was that they had sporatic cease fires so both sides could colect injured or dead countrymen. They'd even talk to each other during this intermission. Then, when the battlefields had been clean of bodies etc, the waring would resume. It makes you wonder why we were there at all.
    But whatever your view of war, you can't denegrate and disrespect our soldiers when they are there. They need our support.
     
  4. Bilby

    Bilby Freerangertarian Lifetime Supporter

    I admire the soldiers for what they did, but not royal rivalary that led to WW1.
     
  5. guy

    guy Senior Member

    whatever kudos the australian army had from ww2/ ww1 has been lost by anyone who's had a glance of the history of the last 60 years. i don't support people doing stupid things least of all when people start dying because of it.
     
  6. Trickster

    Trickster Misfit

    It amazes me how people like you, think that the soldiers and the Aussie government are the same thing. People forget, that they are ORDERED to go there because it is there job. If they refuse, there are serious consequenses. The governments of the world are the ones who deserve your wrath, not the men and women fighting under our flag!

    [​IMG]
     
  7. guy

    guy Senior Member

    i never support people who obey stupid orders

    look at stalingrad, that was a stupid german order to stay in the city

    now looking at gallipoli, everyone knew they were coming, when landing they came under heavy sniper fire, the turks eventually running out of ammo and retreating to the hilltops that the allies only ever took briefly and then lost. the garbage of the ideology of gallipoli is that it is being turned into the forging of a nation. undoubtedly there were many heroic acts carried out to try and save the situation but the orders from the top were garbage.

    by supporting the troops to carry on in a stupid situation only strengthens the governments resolve to continue doing stupid things and keeping the troops in a stupid situation.

    it is critical that orders be measured and timely not a matter of blind faith, time after time in history armies have been marched off into the wilderness because some genius thought it was a good idea. time after time it is demonstrated that this came about because no one objected.

    bad orders means that any fighting is done in the name of stupidity

    i encourage you to go to gallipoli, i did, see for yourself and learn the real story instead of the crocodile tears shed at the ceremonies. obviously no one learnt anything from gallipoli if they did maybe the troops wouldn't be asked to something else that is fundamentally stupid.

    didn't you see the end of the film gallipoli? do you think everybody stopped sunbathing under the turkish sun? the film reflected the spirit of the gallipoli operation - futility
     
  8. Trickster

    Trickster Misfit

    Ah to live in a deluded world like you. How old are you out of interest?
    Things aren't so black and white as you so obviously thin they are. Like i said previously, soldiers who disobey orders are subject to severe consequences. It is not a simple case of saying 'no'.
    No one ever said war was justifiable, but there are certain truths to accept. If you can't, it's better to stay out of the debate.
     
  9. guy

    guy Senior Member

    truth is something you can twist to anyway you want it

    so have you ever seen the film gallipoli?

    whatever the soldiers do is up to them , if they choose to obey orders thats up to them.

    if i were you i'd stick to the love and sex posts or threads about air conditioning or private schools

    as a civillian the best i can do is - not supporting the troops, because it is in their best interests that i don't.
     
  10. Trickster

    Trickster Misfit

    I've seen Gallipoli many times. and while soldiers have reservations, it's the duty that they believe in. Whether you believe it or not. Like you said, you are a civillian, you wouldn't understand.

    So, i suggest you stick to threads that you would know more about. Maybe wingeing males or ignorant individuals or something?
     
  11. guy

    guy Senior Member

    duty?

    duty to be mowed down in an act of stupidity? it doesn't require you to be either a civillian or a soldier to know when something very stupid is happening. in the name of duty you would condemn an entire army to death for nothing?

    if you didn't know it civillians send soldiers to war, if civillians don't understand soldiers, don't understand duty then how would they be qualified to send these soldiers to war in the first place?

    by the way trickster do you vote?
     
  12. wot about ww2 when we had no choice to fight the japs. if we hadnt have fought them then you and i would both be speaking japanese and working in a rice field. so spare a thought you inconsiderate *^*%(guy). you dont have a clue what your on about and id love to see you try and argue your point with the diggers and there families. jeez some ungrateful people!!!!
     
  13. Katana

    Katana Member

    As a cynical Australian who trusts government about as far as I can kick my tax bill....I agree with Trickster. She has it nailed in my view.
    Mates of mine went to 'Nam. It was what you did when you were 18 or 19. NOW they regret it, but life was different 35 years ago. And no, I don't agree with the Iraq situation.
     
  14. guy

    guy Senior Member

    nice try

    you are obviously people who read only the newspaper for their understanding of the world and precious little else. you are trying to entwine vietnam and ww2 two different circumstances. vietnam was not a country trying to invade australia, if you read into it you'll find ho chi minh was taken for a ride by the french et al - they promised vietnam independence

    "French colonialism
    Vietnam's independence ended in the mid-1800s, when the country was colonized by the French Empire. The French administration imposed significant political and cultural changes on Vietnamese society. A Western-style system of modern education was developed, and Christianity was introduced into Vietnamese society. Developing a plantation economy to promote the exports of tobacco, indigo, tea and coffee, the French largely ignored increasing calls for self-government and civil rights. A nationalist political movement soon emerged, with leaders such as Phan Boi Chau, Phan Chu Trinh, Emperor Ham Nghi and Ho Chi Minh calling for independence. However, the French maintained dominant control of their colonies until World War II, when the Japanese war in the Pacific triggered the invasion of Indochina. The natural resources of Vietnam were exploited for the purposes of Japan's military campaigns into Burma, the Malay Peninsula and India.

    Main article: First Indochina War
    In the final years of the war, a forceful nationalist insurgency emerged under Ho Chi Minh, committed to independence and communism. Following the defeat of Japan, nationalist forces fought French colonial forces in the First Indochina War that lasted from 1945 to 1954. The French suffered a major defeat at the Battle of Dien Bien Phu and shortly afterwards withdrew from the country. The countries that fought the Vietnam War divided the country at the 17th parallel into North Vietnam and South Vietnam during the Geneva Accords.


    Vietnam War
    Main article: Vietnam War
    The communist-held North Vietnam was opposed by the United States which had sided with the French colonists in the battle of Dien Bien Phu for its close association with the Soviet Union and China. Disagreements soon emerged over the organizing of elections and reunification, and the U.S. began increasing its contribution of military advisors even as Soviet-supplied arms and munitions strengthened communist forces. The Gulf of Tonkin Incident triggered a U.S. military assault on North Vietnamese military installations and the deployment of more than 500,000 troops into South Vietnam. U.S. forces were soon embroiled in a vicious guerrilla war with the Viet Cong, the communist insurgent militia in South Vietnam. North Vietnamese forces unsuccessfully attempted to overrun the South during the 1968 Tet Offensive and the war soon spread into neighboring Laos and Cambodia. With casualties mounting, the U.S. began transferring combat roles to the South Vietnamese military in a process known as Vietnamization. The effort had mixed results. The Paris Peace Accords on January 27, 1973 formally recognized the sovereignty of both sides. Under the terms of the accords all American combat troops were withdrawn by March 29, 1973. Limited fighting continued, but all major fighting ended until the North once again invaded in strength and overpowered the South on April 30, 1975. South Vietnam briefly became the Republic of South Vietnam, a puppet state under military occupation by North Vietnam, before being officially reunified with the North under communist rule as the Socialist Republic of Vietnam on July 2, 1976."

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vietnam check this out. the gulf of tonkin incident came about when the us navy sailed around in circles firing at the waves.

    the japanese on the otherhand were trying to invade australia.

    if australia had never invaded vietnam? well the outcome would have been exactly the same. people who think australia played some great military role have been smoking some serious fumes.

    obviously none of the lessons of history have filtered down into the population GALLIPOLI WAS A FAILURE , turning a failure into some "forging of a nation" as touted by howard and his mates to justify some sickening war against johnny arab in his own country far far away, well that is stupid. rememberance of gallipoli is something everyone should ponder on, the loss, the sacrifice, the stupidity of the original idea. an unpopular but realistic understanding of history, you'll never read this in the newspaper which should make you happy.
     

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