Animals eat meat.

Yes...but those bugs atleast didn't suffer. And chimpanzeesvdon't need non-born with
tools. They can just squish them. Go ahead and eat bugs! That's the only creature you CAN kill without tools!

 

if you are going to go all psuedo intelligent on us, could you at least present an original argument?

 

The OP says that we as vegetarians act "superior" to other animals. I don't agree with that...seems to me, after reading his threads, he's the one acting "superior" and he's NOT a vegetarian/vegan.

I think as vegetarians/vegans we tend to believe that animals are our equal and that they deserve and demand respect just like us. Dude has it all wrong.

 

Yeah, I'd say that declining meat in our diet for no personal benefit was an act of humility rather than arrogance.

 

Er, chickens eat worms, do they not? Worms have muscle in them. =P

Agreed on the humane treatment part, though. =)

 

*looks around and whistles*

I'd like to see an argument by the original poster, Mad Scientist, about now ... where are you? If you're going to pressure me to make a post, I'm going to do the same right back ...

Also ... I'd like to point out, I don't look down on people because they eat meat. Morality is relative (at least how I see it), and it'd be wrong for me to look down on someone else for having different moral conclusions. However, for someone like Mad Scientist, who claims to have the same conclusions, and then comes here to act the way he does (and to look down on me because he thinks I "don't know what I'm talking about" and have never "challenged my beliefs"), yes, I will look down on someone like that; what goes around, comes around.

But inherently, I don't look down on people for eating meat. I have a close friend who eats meat, and even if he doesn't agree with me, well, knowing him, he'd have a serious problem with me if I thought I was better than him in any way.

 

Aww, I'm pretty sure that I can snap the necks of at least a few species of small mammals.

 

Then eat those.

 

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA. My, aren't we full of ourselves?
::Bows down to the all-mighty-environmentalist-holy-superior-being-who-is-so-much-better-than-i-am-and-cares-more-about-the-enviornment-and-earth-because-they-are-taking-a-plane-to-kenya-and-telling-people-how-to-sift-dirt.::

You obviously *are* saying that you care more about the world. You're just *hinting* at it rather than saying it directly. It is way above overly-obvious that you feel that you are superior to us.

"because that is ridiculous and I don't hold things over peoples heads." hahaha! Mhmm. Really? (psst, i might just go kill myself because I eat grain :H )

 

we are conscious that we are eating animals which are being horribly slaughtered (im not saying other animals dont know when they're killing other animals, but the animals might not see other things as living beings but only food... i dont know) we as humans have many other opions and know we do, wgile other animals only know of killing. not all animals eat other animals, and humans van be one of those animals that don,t also.

 

geez alright sparky, take a breather



i think most of us would agree that the difference between humans eating meat and animals eating meat, the way most meat is raised, is that while animals prey on their meals and take only what they need, and what they dont need is used up entirely by other animals and birds, we herd up animals and put them into cages, injecting them with growth hormones for our own personal satisfaction, i can guarentee you hardly anyone who walks into the store to buy a steak or chicken or whatever it is they're eating is doing it because they're "need" to eat it

 

hmmm...so what of the wolf, the bear, the hawk? What of their so called "immoral" decisions? Why should we reciprocate morality to the brute animal who cannot even grasp the concept?

 

What immoral decisions? They need to eat to survive! If *to survive* I'd have to eat meat ... well ... I'd eat meat. I wouldn't like it, but ... I'm not about to starve to death.

Remember, the immorality is the way we TREAT the animals, and the way we KILL them when we don't NEED to.

Natural predators kill only when necessary to survive, and they don't take their prey and lock them up in cages, give them crappy pesticide-covered food, inject them with hormones that cause them to be super-fat or whatever, and then ... well I could go on forever. My point is, humans treat other animals inhumanely, then kill them for food, when we don't even have to! It's completely our choice (as veg*ns have shown, it's quite possible to live a health(y/ier) life off of only vegetables), but it's a real problem.

Edit: Just an ending thought ... survival comes first. Then, if you have the capability, morality. Because you can't really be a moral person if you're dead.

 

So would you include young children in that logic, who're also not in a position to grasp the concept of morality? Is it ok to eat babies because they don't know the difference between right and wrong? "Hey, rug-rat! Put down that rattle you just stole off your sister and get the fuck onto my plate!".

 

No way dude, infants have the potential capacity to reciprocate moral thought.

 

You're right, animals have no capacity for moral thought, only survival. They would eat us if they had to.

Right uh huh ok. It's not about need for any of us humans you're right. It's about a moral decision. Why should we reciprocate morality to the brute animal who cannot even grasp the concept? "Crappy, pesticide covered foods" - go pETA! Another one joins the ranks of ignorance! And what are we but natural predators anyway?

I emphasized inhumanely for I think pretty obvious reasons. Why is it that you think we should apply human morality to the beast?

 

That would certainly explain why children are so cruel. Prove it. And prove that animals don't.

 

awwww....he's jus a yittle guy, no need to get upset there doctor...

And it would certainly explain why children are so generous....are you really going to tell me you think children aren't capable of developing into moral agents?

 

If you think you can't be active and go without meat you are misinformed.
If you cared enough to stay a vegetarian you would have done some research as to what foods you need to eat and how much to get enough IRON in your diet. Beans, tofu, nuts, seaweed, spinach, wheat germ, etc. and taking suppliments.
But somehow ya don't strike me as the inquisitive type.

It sounds to me that your cravings came from neglecting your vegetarian dietary needs and not being dedicated enough to the cause.

Animals don't know better, we do, we can make a difference, My inner peace comes from my abstinence from meat.

 

Whatever. Answer my questions if you want a conversation.