My Grandad was an alcoholic. I was quite young when he died, but I remember it being sad for the family....
I'm incredibly glad to hear you say that Paul, my mum was a junkie/alcoholic then turned to the NA/AA way of life and it ruined her even more than the drugs did(I'm not joking here either)
In AA/NA the addictive personality is turned around so you become addicted to your recovery. It is very important that this is utilised in the early days, becoming addicted to a recovery focuses your attention away from your drugged life. It saved my life so I'm not knocking the principles. In NA they say that the programme is a "bridge to normal living", the problem is that many members stay on that bridge and never cross it, keeping their obsession going forever.
Yeah, I've seen it first hand, it's amazing that a recovery can be as debilitating as an addiction. it's always struck me that there's just as much will power involed in moving away from the recovery as there is moving away from the addiction. I had my own problems with drugs a few years back and came off them without any support (at a great cost) because I'd seen what it can do to people. I suppose I'm glad that I went that way as my life would have been a lot different if I didn't but at the same time some help would have been appreciated.
I just got out of a police cell .. i got arrested and locked up for 5 hours on the strenght of this shit .. arrested for being in the same house .. for doing nothing but sitting here and being accused of ABG .. being used to get at father .. shit why am i telling you this
Did you ever think about what it would look like at a dead show if everyone that had gotten high or drunk in the last week suddenly disappeared?
hmm alcoholics...i know this one all too well. my mom is an alcoholic, an emotional one, and her actions really messed up her life as well as me and my sisters. the things she did when she was drunk are unbelievable. if u have an alcohol problem and are thinking about having kids...this is for you. being an alcoholic with kids forces them to grow up earlier, because chances are they will have to start taking care of you. what happens? i dont know in every case what happens, but i know now that i havent seen my mom in a year and a half (im only 16) and the restraining order is pending. take care of your problems before you have kids. please! give them a chance. i cant even describe all the pain i had to go through to get to where i am. peace love
try on a heroine addict with certified mental disorders as a mother...man was that a 15 year roller coaster. *doing the itttttt's ovvveerrrrrr dance* :-D sendin good vibes your way....
giles, what happened?? if you need to talk give me a call ok? alcoholics....well..... i see it as a weakness, in fac ti see any drug taking as a weakness. its an escape and i don't tend to like being around those who participate in it. therefore a lot of my friends don't or know that id rather they never did it around me.thats not to say none ofmy friends drink-im in a band for christ sake so yes theres a lot of drink around. the last time i drank properly was prolly around 3 years ago and i havent tasted alcohol for about a year now(other than medicinal purposes), its just not for me. my papa is an alcoholic albeit a recovering one, my uncle also, a number of my second cousins and a number of close family friends, so i know what it does to people. i hate the fact people rely on drugs and drink to function in society, it does my head in how seemingly normal intelligent people turn into monsters when they take drugs or drink. i think this was illuminated quite a lot at beautiful days-don't take offense at that comment anyone, i don't mean to judge and my opinions havent changed about anyone, but really...... yeah so thats my tuppence, sorry if its too intense for anyone...ahem... namaste xxx
I see a big distinction between occassional drinking and drugs and being dependant upon them. I've seen what can happen to people when they are constantly in need of drink or drugs. It's awful, it destroys people, changes them, to the extent that you can hardly recognise them any more. The odd bit of harmless fun is completely different. Like Beautiful Days. I don't really think I, or anyone else, turned into a monster (although at times Giles did seem to resemble Lucifer!), just had fun. If people choose not to do that, then that's a choice. It's all about choices. When you become dependant then it's no longer about choices, it's about needs. I haven't done anything like that since, and probably won't for quite a while. There's a time and a place, and all things in moderation....
Yeah....my auntie died this year because she was an alcoholic....her liver and kidneys just packed up. I could describe in detail the effect that had on her body, but it's not very nice..... And working in a pub, I see lots of alcoholics...its very sad.....
sorry to hear that butterfly *hugs* coming your way. sal- i know what you mean about all things in moderation, i ake your point and know that i was not trying to criticise you or anyone else, its not my place to judge. but...... when you HAVE to take drugs at a festival in order to have fun then that is a dependancy too. think of how many festivals you have stayed stone cold sober? i know youll prolly tell me 'i don't need drugs to have a good time' and thats fair enough but prove it! my problem lies with those who are dependant on drugs but won't admit it and i feel that anyone at all who uses drugs more than once is dependent...... i know its an intense stance to take but i can' help the way i feel. i want to reiterate, however that i am by no means judging you or anyone else okies? namaste x x x
In terms of dependancy you can. If you require chemical stimulation in order to be happy, that's not a good thing. Regardless of the drug in question.
Beautiful Days 2003 I was pretty much stone cold sober and I enjoyed it very much. Taking drugs/drinking and finding it fun is completely different to needing them simply to have fun. Physical dependence is the most accute form of dependence, very noticeable. Then there's psychological dependence. But when it comes to social situation, peer pressure aside, I think it comes down to choice. Given the choice I probably would endulge in a few excesses at festivals rather than not, but that is more to do with social situation and occassion than it is dependence. In most situations I would actively choose not to take drugs. But in that place and at that time, I made a choice to enjoy myself in a certain way, very much linked to the freedoms granted by the festival environment. For instance, you didn't need to go topless at Beautiful Days to have fun, and yet you did for whatever reason you chose to. Walking down a busy high street in conservative and reserved Britain you would have found yourself in a completely different situation. There is a time and a place for everything, and certain situations where freedoms allow you more choice. Like I said, it's all about choices. I don't enjoy smoking for the most part, and yet I do it. It's not a choice, so much as it is an addiction. Addiction comes into play when the element of choice is removed I feel....
starfly- i see the fact of needing drugs to 'open your head' up as a dependency. why can't you do it through meditaion or just clear mindedness? lazyness thats why, people want a quick fix even though they are damaging themselves and those around them. thats what frustrates me the most, people think drugs are the only way to feel that way, new flash-it isn't!! sal- fair point about the topless thing in some ways but it was hot and it was a fun thing to do, it wasn't compromising anyone else safety and if someone had asked me to put my top back on then i would have done so- innncedentaly no one did. also how do you know i don't walk around topless through the streets of edinburgh eh? namaste x x x
I'm hoping for the day when you would be free to walk around topless down the streets, but I doubt we're living in that age. I don't believe I compromised anyone's safety. I'm always very sensible when I take drugs, again to do with situation and who I'm with. I'd like you to note that, despite what the little devil on my shoulder (probably Giles) was telling me, I didn't climb that tree! I'm never violent, and usually have quite a high degree of self control. Maybe too much. My ultimate belief is that if you're going to take drugs, it should be a victimless crime. So I'm not going to go out and put other people in danger. I can see how you may feel that way around some people, I've seen it in people before, but different people react to things in different ways. It's impossible to generalise too much. I respect your point of view, and your choice not to take drugs, and I know you're not attacking me for it, but it's good to have an understanding of why people do the things they do, and not to overly generalise....
Two points. 1. I think you're entirely right on one level. If there exists a 'need' for drugs in order to achieve particular state of mind - be that enlightenment or just relaxation - then you have a dependency. People do often use drugs for all the wrong reasons. Certainly, the majority of regular drug users that I've met are not happy and well balanced people - by any stretch of the imagination. 2. Native cultures have used hallucinogenics for thousands of years as an aid to altered levels of awareness, so I don't think drug use can be entirely dismissed in this context. The key word here though is "aid", as opposed to "shortcut". I agree with you that there are no shortcuts.
as long as you understand that when you take drugs it is to enhance an evening or state of mind.. not to create an evening or state of mind then i don't think its a problem.. i take a fair amount of drugs... and i would call myself well balanced.. i dont ever do anything negativly out of character. or submit any1 to the fact i do drugs because i dont get myself into a state where it becomes a problem, although i do get very messy.. i think you have to be psycologically unsound for drugs to affect you in a bad way... as long as you are grounded with some sort of sense of reality.. i dont think it becomes a problem.
