2 Spineless, Roadblocking Democrats

Discussion in 'Politics' started by erofant, Oct 21, 2021.

  1. Tishomingo

    Tishomingo Senior Member

    They're evil sociopaths. What else could we expect? Problem is, most people haven't been paying attention. They're used to the Republican Party of yesteryear. I still hear people describing them as "conservative". Actually, they've become radical right wingers, many of them a potentially violent mob, devoid of principles other than following their leader, the Donald. Reality is whatever he says it is. and he's transformed the party into an engine for white grievance. Where have we seen that before, and what did we call it then? Fascism? I was talking to my sister just yesterday. She asked me what I thought of Biden, and I replied I thought he was much better than Republican alternatives. I added that I thought the Republicans had gone insane. She was shocked? Really? After I explained at length how I arrived at that conclusion, she seemed to agree--or at least thought it prudent to humor me.
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2021
  2. wooleeheron

    wooleeheron Brain Damaged Lifetime Supporter

    Donald Duck promised to trash the entire executive branch, and did a pretty damned impressive job. What part of "Half the country wants to destroy our government" did you not comprehend? Obama saved our economy, only to be replaced by Donald Duck promising to destroy our government. I seriously doubt if half the damned country gives a crap about democrats producing results.

    What they will care about, is when members of congress and Donald Duck are brought up on charges of sedition.
  3. well, i understand what you mean.

    What I'm saying is, true - he's doing well. But according to what standard?

    My expectation can be unrealistic - I want green new deals rolling out as soon as AOC and Greta think of them...

    The one thing that I feel the strongest about is embracing our knowledge... Is not our leadership college educated?

    I feel that just because a majority wants something more traditional/moderate, we're ignoring the social sciences that inform our politics... Where's the sociology?

    The only time I feel empowered is when an AOC or an Ilhan Omar says something that rings true to the knowledge I have become familiar with.

    It's not that I dislike President Biden. It's that I'm concerned his policy is lacking integrity. It's backed by tradition, but if you ask me it's time to truly change. I'm for bigger change.
  4. Tishomingo

    Tishomingo Senior Member

    In the immortal words of Mick Jagger and the Stones, "you can't always get what you want..." , especially in a democracy. Republicans use green new deals, AOC and Greta to rally folks against them.

    Unfortunately, we live in a notoriously anti-intellectual society, and Trump is a master of using that to his advantage.
    Hofstader, Anti-Intellectualism in American Life
    The Rise of Anti-Intellectualism
    Anti-Intellectualism and the War Against Experts in America - Ray Williams
    Anti-Intellectualism Is Killing America

    I'm not sure that it would be better if "experts" or intellectuals were running things. Plato thought it would, as he argued at length in Republic, but critics said it would lead to an authoritarian tyranny. His great uncle headed the pro-Spartan antidemocratic faction known as the "Thirty Tyrants" who controlled Athens early in the 5th century B.C.E. Traditional China was run by a scholarly bureaucracy guided by Confucianism, which provided relief from the disorder of previous dynasties and the authoritarian repression of the Legalism school. It worked in China, but would be difficult to export. And of course Marxism-Leninism provided justification for Soviet, Chinese, North Korean, and Cambodian tyranny and democides by giving total power to a party elite supposedly guided by "scientific" principles. Experiences with intellectual elitism indicates that it tends to become a mask for ruthless totalitarianism. As for sociology, anyone who has close knowledge of the personal lives of sociologists and other scholars may justifiably be skeptical of how well they'd do running things. Henry Kissinger remarked that “The reason that university politics is so vicious is because stakes are so small”. Anyhow, most political scientists think any regime needs a semblance of legitimacy to be effective, and in a democracy that means popular support, which academics, at least in this country, don't have. Yes , we have lots of highly educated leaders in our government: men like Republican Senators Sen.Ted Cruz (Princeton, B.A.; Harvard Law, J.D., magna cum laude) and Josh Hawley, B.A., Stanford. J.S. Yale Law School), both unprincipled demagogues of the worst kind. Sociology is a fine discipline, but politicians need grounding in ethics and the art of government, and both go beyond book knowledge.

    That makes you part of a minority. You might be right, but neither of them is noted for the tact and flexibility necessary for effectiveness in the political arena. More people may be turned off than on by them.
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2021
  5. Спасибо
  6. Tishomingo

    Tishomingo Senior Member

    Не за что
    soulcompromise likes this.
  7. Piney

    Piney Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

    Several Senate Republicans voted yes on the $1.5 B Infrastructure bill. Progressives are holding it back in The House.

    The larger Bill concerns Human Infrastructure.
  8. wooleeheron

    wooleeheron Brain Damaged Lifetime Supporter

    They're testing the market for new infrastructure on Wall Street. Anything to keep stock prices going up! Between Donald Duck and Biden, Wall Street has all their bets hedged.

    Democracy in action, a choice between selling out to Wall Street or jumping over a cliff.
  9. erofant

    erofant Members

    For those who in recent posts said REPUBLICANS will block EVERYTHING .......... correct!!!!!!!! There actions stand before them - and they're TELEVISED !!!

    I've posted this FACT before - Obama made a nationally televised speech before both houses of Congress where he said, "We should take some of that money and put it to work here in THIS COUNTRY - putting American workers to work at good-paying jobs." (Obama was speaking about our U.S. infrastructure needs). NOT ONE REPUBLICAN applauded that proposal - the TV cameras documented the REPUBLICAN side of the chamber - unwavering, stone-faced manakins.

    But when T**** was prez, and Paul Ryan was Speaker of the House (sitting right behind T**** as he made HIS address to Congress - T**** used the SAME WORDS as Obama had made in his speech, almost to the letter verbatim - and Ryan jumped up to lead a standing ovation by the entire REPUBLICAN SIDE of the chamber. Apparently THE REPUBLICAN SIDE thought it was a bad idea when Obama proposed it ......... but when T**** opened his copying, plagiarizing yap - it was all of a sudden a big hit.

    This is the book definition of HYPOCRISY. For GOD's sake - look it up if you don't know what hypocrisy is. No one can claim to be FOR something .......... and then actually vote AGAINST that same thing. The "truth" they claim by voice - is proven FALSE by their actions.

    So how many more years of unattended infrastructure were added on by THE REPUBLICAN REFUSAL to back what the U.S. really needed (when Obama made his proposal)?? How many good-paying American jobs were non-existent, when they could have been filled and workers could have been contributing to our U.S. economy??? How does this sort of self-serving behavior help our U.S. economy and our woefully-neglected infrastructure needs??

    How A-N-Y-O-N-E can support a self-serving, LYING, HYPOCRITICAL political party such as THE REPUBLICAN PARTY has become ......... is totally beyond me. The Republican party of the past is ............ GONE.
    MeAgain, scratcho and Tishomingo like this.
  10. erofant

    erofant Members

    You' are so, so, SO right. When I listen to some of my own friends and acquaintances speak ............ WOW!! And the people of "the base" when they speak on TV ......... OMG!!! They seem to think that just by the act of their saying something - or hearing some bit of verbal drivel by a political hack - it stands as fact!!!

    I listened with amusement ......... and some sadness, when TV reporters asked T**** supporters (on various occasions) what actual PROOF they had that the election was "stolen." Their answers were mostly the same in every instance ........" Well - everybody knows it." That's NOT PROOF ..... it's gossip and hearsay ...... but they don't even realize that fact. Community repetition of a falsehood doesn't transform it into a truthful fact. Refusal to believe a fact doesn't make the fact a falsehood. It's called being stubborn, intransigent.

    The recent uptick in the VERY public displays of poor education is a bad sign for the future of our country and our democracy. How does one make a well thought out case for anything to folks who HATED SCHOOL , studying, and learning - and couldn't wait to get out?? They didn't apply themselves while they were in school. And today, many people who actually have a good degree of intelligence are ridiculed as "know-it-alls" or "Mr. / Mrs. smart guy" by those who were SLACKERS in school. More division and tension.

    Easy pickin's for a slick-talking salesman / huckster / fraud like T**** ............. and many others.

    "Our best tool is an uninformed electorate." - Adolf Hitler
    Last edited: Oct 31, 2021
    MeAgain and scratcho like this.
  11. scratcho

    scratcho Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

    In effect, there's an attack from many sides on this country now. The intentionally evil, fascist leaning , anti American legislators who are riding the wave of half wits who are the useful idiots of the extreme right wing and the right wing media--Fox, The Post, Wall Street Journal ,owned by that Australian bastard and his family that are harvesting the hard earned money of the Trump know nothings. All to the detriment of all the folks who believe that "we are all in this together" in this experiment in self governance instead of those who have used the super rich as their way into government and in turn reward them with laws that are amenable to their continued dominance of the monetary system. It's now obvious that the right wing / republican / conservatives are going to do ABSOLUTELY ANYTHING to win elections to keep and maintain the present inequitable systems in place and in fact I can foresee the day when all politicians will be republicans and to speak out will be as dangerous as it is in Russia--China. It's not that far off with the now emboldened party that has ALMOST --the senate---ALMOST the house and definitely the supreme court under their control.
    Last edited: Nov 2, 2021
    Tishomingo, erofant and MeAgain like this.
  12. erofant

    erofant Members

    ^ ^ ^ So true, Scratcho. And the price - to the whole country and our democracy - of having a very poor education by sooo many, is they're actually unwitting / unknowing pawns in the political unravelling of our country. Add the fact that Russia and China are using social media to add their propaganda to what poorly-educated 'muricans gorge on every day ........ and we see our free society democracy disintegrating without a shot being fired. Curiosity killed the cat??? S-T-U-P-I-D-I-T-Y is killing our U.S. democracy. Autocratic fascism is SLOBBERING to take over. I pity our kids and grandkids. Never in all my life did I think I'd live to see this. WW I, WW II, Korean War, Viet Nam vets must be shaking in their honorable graves.
    Tishomingo and scratcho like this.
  13. scratcho

    scratcho Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

    Correction: Jeff Bezos owns the Washington Post, not Rupert Murdoch as I said in post 31.
  14. Piney

    Piney Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

    Perhaps the naysayers want to keep the fiscal powder dry. They may want to keep Medicaid & Medicare solvent. Keep Social Security solvent. Perhaps they are concerned that America's public pension crisis will need to be dealt with. There may be genuine principals behind where they stand. Are they really super villain's ?
  15. Tishomingo

    Tishomingo Senior Member

    Not to mention inflation. But none of those were much of an issue when Trump passed his tax break for corporations and billionaires at the cost of about couple of trillion $ added to the debt.--threatening Medicare and Social Security down the road. Altogether, Trump added over $4.5 trillion to the debt. Who benefited from that? Where are the Retrumplican fiscal hawks when we really need them?
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2021
  16. scratcho

    scratcho Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

    The republicans are always just outraged at the national debt and use that as one of their excuses to vote down ANYTHING the democrats attempt to do. That is until they see a good reason to give the super rich some tax breaks in one way or another. It's a symbiotic relationship The super rich / corporations give the repubs the money to get elected in exchange for the laws that help their benefactors to avoid taxes. Pretty slick. Unless you're a middle class citizen that gets stuck making up for the non paying elite. Ho hum-- Another day in paradise.
    erofant and Tishomingo like this.
  17. Piney

    Piney Lifetime Supporter Lifetime Supporter

    Well I'm glad that our President finally got his infrastructure bill passed. The $1T billion bill passed the Senate back in August. Only 13 Republican house members voted for it. Looks like six member: The Squad, voted Nay.

    Build Back Better is still out there, under negotiation. Some legislators want to increase the SALT cap for local taxes; Those "super rich" people are Blue State Democrats who want a full exemption for real estate taxes. Like here in Jersey.

    Meanwhile those who expect a pension for a career in public service are under a threat of underfunded state pension plans.
    Tishomingo likes this.
  18. Tishomingo

    Tishomingo Senior Member

    Yeah, Biden accomplished what his predecessor, The Donald, wasn't able to get started, despite his innumerable infrastructure weeks. The new law would be the biggest federal attempt to confront climate change in U.S. history--not to mention the roads and bridges. And it passed with the support of 13 Republicans. (6 Dems opposing). Biden has presided over creation of nearly ten times as many jobs as Trump.Biden Has Now Created Nearly Ten Times More Jobs Than Trump And the stock market is at record highs. Not only that but he's given the Dems a shot at another term. But the "glass half empty" folks will complain about what he hasn't done. Underfunded State pension plans. Isn't that something the states should be working on? These States Have The Most Unfunded Public Pension Liabilities - ValueWalk West Virginia seems to be at the bottom. That's Maserati Manchin's constituency, isn't it? Maybe if he'd be more cooperative, his Progressive colleagues might add something to the Build Back Better bill.
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2021
    erofant, MeAgain and scratcho like this.
  19. hotwater

    hotwater Senior Member

  20. Dulci Daily

    Dulci Daily Members

    Oh, dear, there are so many different kinds of hate in our country and the world today, aren't there? But surely it's a misuse of language to call legislators "spineless" when they stand up for what they believe is right against intense pressure from their own party--whatever that party may be, and whatever they may think is right.
    Tishomingo likes this.

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