Climate Change Still Denied?

From an article today in Forbes;

The Center for Naval Analysis has had its Military Advisory Board examining the national security implications of climate change for many years. Lead by Army General Paul Kern, the Military Advisory Board is a group of 16 retired flag-level officers from all branches of the Service.
This is not a group normally considered to be liberal activists and fear-mongers.
This year, the Military Advisory Board came out with a new report, calledNational Security and the Accelerating Risks of Climate Change, that is a serious discussion about what the military sees as the threats and the actions to be taken to mitigate them
“The potential security ramifications of global climate change should be serving as catalysts for cooperation and change. Instead, climate change impacts are already accelerating instability in vulnerable areas of the world and are serving as catalysts for conflict.”

 

I could show your thousands of peer reviewed studies. Would you be willing to read them?

The Earth's climate has changed many times over it's 4 billion year history. From a snowball earth period where ice extended to the tropics causing the Cambrian extinction, to a hundred thousand year period of severe warming and acid rain caused by the volcanic eruptions of the basalt plains in Siberia causing the Permian extinction.

Carbon Dioxide is a greenhouse gas. It's an important one. Without it the earth would be a barren snow filled wasteland. But it's not. Too much Carbon Dioxide is responsible for the temperature of the planet Venus. Hot enough to melt lead, day and night.

We know the global concentration of carbon dioxide for the past million years from ice core samples. And in that time, the concentration of CO2 has never exceeded 300ppm. In the past 120 years, it has increased to 400ppm, coinciding with the industrial revolution.

The earth has gotten warmer since 1995. 2010 was the hottest year in recorded history.

Highest Global Temperature Variation in centigrade 1900-2014
Year Global Land Ocean
2010 0.66 1.06 0.5
2005 0.65 1.05 0.5
1998 0.64 0.94 0.52
2013 0.62 0.99 0.48
2003 0.62 0.88 0.52
2002 0.61 0.93 0.49
2006 0.6 0.9 0.48
2009 0.59 0.85 0.5
2007 0.59 1.09 0.41
2004 0.58 0.81 0.49
Data Set taken from
http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/cag/time-series/global
.

Here's Neil DeGras Tyson putting things into perspective walking his dog along the beach.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cBdxDFpDp_k

Increased solar activity is not the cause of this warming. If that were the case the planet would be warming more in the day. The opposite is happening. Increased volcanic activity can't account for the sudden rise. We can measure pretty exactly the amount that carbon dioxide is increasing in the atmosphere. It's accelerating.

You can deny this, but now based upon logic. Nor by research that is funded by Exxon-mobile. There is no legitimate scientific debate on the cause or it's acceleration. Only small variations in models, all of which say things are going to get worse. Those models are powered by 150 years of weather monitoring, super computers that are now distributed allowing them to account for very small variables, and the very concrete measurable amount of carbon dioxide which we know that coal, fracking, gasoline and agriculture produce.

It's good to question consensus. You should look at the data and form you own conclusions. And if you looked at the scientific data on the subject, you would be able to reach the same conclusion that every single scientific body in the world has.

Global warming is happening, accelerating, and human carbon emissions are the primary driving factor.

 

Yeah, totally, science shouldn't be a democratic process, we should just listen to the tiny minority who agree with your entirely unsupportable positions.

Asking questions is great - asking the same questions over and over because you don't like the answer is a totally different matter.

 

Rather than look at time spans that involve decades, why not realize that we are talking about geological time and that timespans involve tens or hundreds of thousands of years, or even millions.

Eventually, the ice caps of Greenland and Antarctica WILL melt. As will all the mountain glaciers.

And the sea levels will rise and many of our cities will be under water.

When will this happen? Who knows.

 

*sigh*

you really aren't very bright, are you?

the time spans that have been studied to ascertain how outside of the norm the current changes are go back millions of years, but you should know that if you are the expert on all things as you claim.


what a tool......

 

There is no point in studying the current year to year thing....

To use an analogy of the stock market..... some people try to make money by day trading....

Whereas others will just put stuff in a fund and realize that the market always goes up given enough time, even if it has periodic recessions.....

Look at the geological history of Earth. Do you think those thin little layers of ice are going to last? Only a fool would think so.

They are very recent formations.

 

Yup, you are not very bright.

 

They will melt. There is no way to stop it.

Try this one:

Essentials of Geology - Stephen Marshak

 

You're making enemies fast.

Welcome to my Ignore List.

 

Okay well read up on your geology.

There was a time when the Earth was a ball of liquid rock. There were times when more ice existed than today.

It's entirely possible the Earth will get COLDER before getting warmer.

But the FACT is that at some point, those ice caps will melt.

And maybe after that, the entire Earth will freeze over, then remelt, then freeze again.

Who knows? But they will melt.

Probably not in our life time. But they will melt.

 

"they will melt" doesn't mean anything, do you have some sort of point? Ice melts, water freezes, there are cycles, yada yada yada - that's got nothing to do with global warming as we're facing it.

For mr. science, you're sounding awfully like the "well I have to accept that global warming is real to not make a fool of myself, but I don't believe man caused it or we can do anything" republicans.

We're decades past the whole "earth warms and cools on it's own" thing - the discussion is much more advanced than that, stop bringing it up like it's some sort of point against global warming or against doing anything about it - it's not, it just shows how little you understand this discussion.

"I know you're trying to build a roof to keep the rain out, but the basemest is below ground level, one day there will be water in it"

How fucking insightful.

 

I realize we are causing it to speed up, but the point is... it's going to melt anyway. Even if we try our best to not burn any fossil fuels, etc.

There is NO WAY to prevent those ice caps from melting.

New York City, Washington D.C., Miami, and large parts of India and China will be underwater.

The amount of time that human beings have been on the Earth is negligible compared to geologic time, and especially the amount of time that civilization has existed, let alone densely populated civilizations with skyscrapers and all that.

There is no way to stop it.

Does anyone on here think that there is any way to stop those ice caps form melting, even if that's 10,000 years from now? So all we did was delay it for a few thousand years?

And does anyone really think we are not going to burn all the fossil fuels we have? They are about to run out anyway and energy is getting cleaner even if people aren't doing it for the purpose of stopping global warming.

 

So what we need to do is.... build some really large dams to catch all that water that melts and to divert the new high sea levels....

Or pack up our coastal cities and move them to higher ground.

I haven't heard anyone say that.

 

We have already altered the rotational speed of the planet by diverting waterways and stockpiling it, so in the long run that may not be the wisest thing, nor is it feasible,
....as a matter of fact it sounds like the sort of fantasy crap a 10 year old would think up, certainly not someone who "knows all science facts".

 

Well then don't!

Let them melt. There's no way to stop it.

But I would have to assume it would happen at a slow enough pace that people could evacuate. It's not like one day it's dry land, and the next day it's 20 feet under water.

I am in Florida where the water table is about 10 feet down. So when the ground starts turning to mud, I will know to head north.

And all the properties I own will go WAY DOWN in value.

 

I think I addressed most of that in my inital post, but yes, of course The Ice caps will melt as some point in the earths geological future. The sun will turn into a red giant in another 3 billion years or so and possibly enguf the earth. So long penguins. And life on earth.

What's the point of addressing the drasitc change on the climate we're having right now? Because we and our children's generations live right now. And it is a drastic and unprecedented change in the ecosystem we depend on.

Do you know of Babylon? Among the first civilizations in the world. It so well particularly because of it's location between the Tigris and Euphrates river. It was an agricultural paradise, and among the first time in history that a socity had excess food. Because of this the Babylonian empire expandanded very rapidly. Too much so. Their agriarian practices of canals around the rivers, had the unexpected (at the time) consequence of oversalinating their soil. Soon nothing would grow. Iraq became a manmade desert, and the Babylonians are a footnote in history.

A similar situation is happening on a global scale with the release of hundreds of millions of years of carbon the earth had sequestered, over a very short time frame.

To say that this isn't a problem, because similar things have happened in the past, is like being a T-Rex with the power to shoot comets out of the sky like Bruce Willis, looking at a Stegosaurus as that comet comes barreling down and saying, "you know, we've had a good run".

The pragmantic solution to knowing you're drastically changing the ecosystem which you depend on because you live in a society whose chief byproduct is the primary global temperature regulating gas, is to seek out alternatives.

Not doing so is selfish at the expense of our childrens generation. If you think these things don't happen over night, take a look at the Maldives. Can that country crash on your couch while theirs sinks into the ocean?

 

Nobody said they believe any of that (though with some caveats and explanation, any of it is actually believable) - stop setting up such transparent full-frontal strawmen, have some self respect.

 

What it will amount to is....

One day the ground will get soggy and people will go "oh sh**" and walk to higher ground.

And hopefully there will be not too much trampling and stampeding and food riots.

 

Riiight...probably more like this