All Religions Are False.

Science is not true, it's just a method.

You're right in the effects of what you're saying, but you seem to be coming from the same place as religion, in terms of how you look at different systems and their interaction.

I know I'm playing semantics games, but semantics are important.

Further, just because the scientific method works, by itself, doesn't say anything about religion. Lots can be said about religion (many of them using science) but science is not one body of people who just believe differently, it's a system of observation and logic, as opposed to blind belief. Science didn't create vaccines and computers, science was used to create these things.

It's system of mental tools, while a religion is a system for mental whitewash and self-delusion.

I know what you're saying, and we see eye-to-eye on it, but it needs to be said properly - you can't argue in a way that lets it be painted as a religion with religious people, they already have a religion that says all other religions are wrong, they don't need your religion - thankfully, science is pretty much the opposite of religion, and it can be argued as such - and even, sometimes, convince some people.

 

If the problem with religion is that they all think the other religions are false theirs being the only true religion and you actually know of a couple of religions that accept other religions then there must not be the problem you describe as you describe it. The problem I see is not the nature of religion but the way some people interpret their scriptures and practice them . I think the way some practice it is in an extension of their own egotistical mindset. Ego being a level of identification and when I say egotistical mindset in this instance i mean that level of identification that identifies itself by how it is different from others or specially endowed itself. Nationalism or racism are a like kind of this egotistical identification. This phenomena has it's secular representatives as well as it's religious ones most simply in the terms I am right and you are wrong.

 

One thing the Op is failing to acknowledge is that just because there is science that would seemingly contradict the most basic, literal and juvenile interpretations of the Biblical creation story, does not in any way or manner negate the existence of "God" or a Creator.
To me natural phenomena just are and it all fits together rather nicely and it works and there is absolutely no reason a creator couldn't use methodologies such as the Big Bang or evolution as the means of creation. to think other wise is a rather narrow consideration of the topic.


So does modern scientific discoveries and evidence cast doubt on the LITERAL, WORD FOR WORD INTERPRETATION of the Bible and other scriptures, sure.
does it disprove the existence of God or a Creator, not in a million years.

Until you understand and discern that difference and recognize your own limitations, bias and prejudices, you will continue to struggle.



also there is absolutely nothing wrong with saying, "I don't know" because as I pointed out in an absent post, all the scientific evidence you are presenting does not preclude the existence of God, only that the most rudimentary pop-culture representation of the Judeao-Christian God and scriptures is asinine.

 

In all scientific reality, the only thing you can be certain of is that you are experiencing sensations, yet you can not be "certain" of anything's existence or properties outside of your own nervous system and sensory apparatus.

in reality what you experience is an illusion stitched together by your nervous system into a cohesive and comprehensible format that best facilitates the survival and reproduction of the species.

 

I'm going to assume my nervous system is interpreting things accurately and that life is not just one big illusion.

Science has proven that no god was needed to create organisms or evolution. It has proven that a god was not needed to create matter, atoms, or even subatomic particles.

Who put the energy here? That's the only thing not explained. And I do admit that.

But I also think that I am no more alive than dirt.

The calcium in my bones is the same as inorganic calcium ions in seawater. The water in me leaves and enters my system and goes back into the "non-living" world. One day, a water molecule is in the ocean, then in the atmosphere, then it is rain, then it is in me, then it is back in the ground. It is the same H20 molecule.

Sure, scientific theories of the past have turned out to be not true, such as the "flat Earth" theory, and some might say that even religions are disproven attempts at explaining what science has done. But so much is known now, especially over the last 100 years, and even the past 30. Just look at the Large Hadron Collider. If these "theories" were not true, how could such a thing even be possible?

 

yup and in another hundred years folks will look back at all our great, groundbreaking theories and exclaim, "what idiots"

 

I don't know about that, though. Obviously, your logic makes sense... but we pretty much know EVERYTHING by now.

You can only dissect an atom so far. We know the entire structure of the universe, star systems, galaxies, galaxy clusters, superclusters, and galaxy filaments that are like huge "walls" of matter separates by voids when seen on a large enough scale.

As far as we know, human beings are the most intelligent "clumps of matter" that exist and we know our biochemistry, for all intents and purposes, down the atom.

The only boundaries now are in things like string theory and quantum physics. That is the only way I could see that happening.... who knows what they will find with even more powerful "microscopes." In fact, the most powerful instrument of this type are particle accelerators that smash subatomic particles together and that is how they just found the Higgs particle back in 2012.

Oh and also mathematics in unexplained. How did things come to be in such order. Who "put" mathematics here to work so perfectly?

 

If you believe that, then hold your breath. Air is not poisonous.

It is 78% nitrogen, 21% oxygen, 1% other gases.

We can use scientific instruments to see how oxygen is taken into our lungs, into our bloodstream through hemoglobin, and delivered to our cells where it assists in the metabolism of carbohydrates.

You can't just say some little "phrase" that someone made up and use it to disprove 1000s of years of human knowledge.

 

Okay if Einstein says it, I will listen.

I have always been a "science guy," but when I actually read about what he discovered in his relativity stuff, I was like "what?!??!??!" and it just blew my mind.

There are 4 dimensions? WTF??!?! Every time I move, I am causing ripples in space-time. Until then, I thought that was just something fictional from movies with Michael J. Fox in it. And it has been proven. They have seen rays of light dilate when next to the Sun's gravity, and they have put atomic clocks on high-speed jets and measured that time flows at a different speed on board the jet.

And e=mc^2 is like his "side project."

But, 1+1 = 2. I am sure of it.

 

If you are serious about that remark, then you are very, very, very far from being as intelligent and as educated as you believe yourself to be
or
your just trolling the forum with stupidity.

 

We know everything from the smallest subatomic particle to the largest structural units of the universe. What is left other than quantum physics? What could we possibly not understand?

The periodic table is not going to change tomorrow. Protons will always be protons. And look at how much was discovered just in the past 100 years. Basically everything.

Look at the times of Napoleon. How "long" ago was that in terms of technology compared to today. But it was just over 200 years ago, which is nothing in terms of geologic time or even the timeline of our species.

 

actually, there is a lot we don't understand, especially on the cutting edge of physics. every time a problem is solved it leads to many more questions.

some questions that come to mind are "how do you reconcile general relativity with quantum mechanics", "black hole entropy and information loss problem"?

we can do experiments in particle physics, the large hadron collider took a lot of effort and was very expensive to build, and very expensive to operate. we have good experimental data, and have a pretty good understanding of particle physics at "LHC-ish" energies, but this still is not close enough to the energy levels at the very earliest moment of planck time when the big bang occurred.

 

Yea that's what I said. The only field that is still left with any questions is quantum physics.

And when (if) they solve those riddles, it will be amazing to see what they find.

Trust me, I have read Stephen Hawking's book and watched probably every episode of "Through the Wormhole" with Morgan Freeman. Lol.

 

I think the newest theory of the multiverse is that everytime someone farts they create another universe. Of course NoxiousGas is adept at creating new universes.

 

I believe this...must be an infinite number of universes created each day.......

 

I think the OP is very intelligent. But I take issue with certain things.

First of all, his book is just a belief system. He doesn't substantiate his claims. It just feeds into the suspicions of religious people that atheism is a religion. Why should anyone believe anything you said? Because you said so? How do you know any of that is actually true? Where's the logic, proof and evidence?
For example, Melanie? the Buddhist? said the devil planted the fossils. He could have planted the Gilgamesh tale, or created the other religions.

Now my personal take:

I think religion is stupid and useless. The stupidity varies from religion to religion.

Islam is about enslavement to a social, political, and judicial system. It has ZERO to do with morality (and I realize there are lots of moral philosophies from Kant's categorical imperative to Rand's objectivism, but I follow the Golden Rule). Who cares about alcohol, praying repeatedly, and pork? That's asinine.

I think there's some element in Islam that generates narrow-mindedness, hypersensitivity, and rage, although it's just a suspicion for now. Sam Harris did say though that Muslims are "utterly deranged by their faith."

Christians are experts at mental masturbation. Excuses and excuses to do whatever you would naturally be inclined to do. If you're an asshole, the God is an asshole, or it's "righteous anger" or "you're somewhere else on your walk" or something. Just stop being an asshole!

If you commit adultery then you're "not religious, you're spiritual" or "it's minor".

True Christians like Joel Osteen (loving, altruistic, antiracist, egalitarian, sexually contained) are slaves. They're in a box and have no free will.

I could get into some of the logical issues. Like Paul said you're either a slave to sin or slave to righteousness. What happened to free will as an explanation for the existence of evil? But that's not important.

I'm not Christian anymore because I simply didn't see the purpose of it. The purpose is a relationship with God. What's the purpose of THAT?

New Age spirituality is what I practice. The purpose of it is the end of suffering.

Oh and on an aside: Allah, Elohim, and Yahweh are not the same god. Why would one god write The Torah, The Bible AND The Quran? And Catholics believe in a triune diety: Father/Son/Holy Ghost.