All you people who believe in life after death...

Discussion in 'Metaphysics and Mysticism' started by walsh, Jul 2, 2011.

  1. MellowViper

    MellowViper Member

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    Well think of it this way. A massive body, say an asteroid, can create a gravitational field, potentially at any point of space in the universe (other than black holes and places that are being occupied by something else). There's virtually no place that it can't make a field. So, we know space-time is very universal.

    As for your brain, it can produce human consciousness potentially at any point in space as well (other than black holes). There's virtually no place your brain won't produce human consciousness, provided there's breathable air (which can be taken anywhere with a spacecraft) and nothing occupying the space. It indicated to me that consciousness is a property inherent in empty space, like space-time, and that the brain simply alters it.

    The gravitational field isn't something created purely in the asteroid anymore than consciousness is something purely created in the brain. The potential for either is present in virtually every point of space and time in the cosmos.
     
  2. dark suger

    dark suger Dripping With Sin!

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    When I die I shal become a blight upon the land and all will tremble at the sight of me
     
  3. GLENGLEN

    GLENGLEN Banned

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    99% Of People Would Tremble At The Sight Of A Rotting

    Corpse, So What's New...[​IMG].?



    Cheers Glen.
     
  4. dark suger

    dark suger Dripping With Sin!

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    I will be made a new glen. Not dead but something else entirely
     
  5. GLENGLEN

    GLENGLEN Banned

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    Did You Mean To Say Anew, Or A New...:confused:



    Cheers Glen.
     
  6. dark suger

    dark suger Dripping With Sin!

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    Glorious horns both sets of genitals the wings of a bat forked tongue six arms a snake for a tail the legs of a horse long golden hair and a third eye behold me and feel fear
     
  7. dark suger

    dark suger Dripping With Sin!

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    The compu wouldn't let me say it like that so I just said fuck it
     
  8. GLENGLEN

    GLENGLEN Banned

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    Your Computer Tells You What To Do...[​IMG].?

    Perhaps A Role Reversal Is In Order Here, Try Telling

    Your Computer What YOU Want To Do...:).

    Works For Me...:2thumbsup:



    Cheers Glen.
     
  9. dark suger

    dark suger Dripping With Sin!

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    I keep telling it to show me naked pics of glen but it won't do it
     
  10. walsh

    walsh Senior Member

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    That's a pretty big leap of logic. Why should I think of the brain in the same way as I do an asteroid? I don't think of an apple in the same way as I do an orange.

    It's an interesting theory but you need to show how you got from A to B rather than just stating an unfounded conclusion.
     
  11. thedope

    thedope glad attention Lifetime Supporter

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    Oh, gnu.
     
  12. MellowViper

    MellowViper Member

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    ...because both the brain and the asteroid are made of matter. I see consciousness in the same way as I see as gravity, because they're unseen phenomena that we only know exist by the way they interact with and relate to matter. Gravity's effects, of course, are primarily observed from our interactions with the world, but the effects of consciousness are, on the other hand, mainly realized through the basis of observation itself.

    Nonetheless, consciousness is an intangible phenomena, much like gravity. We only know either exist by how they interact with the material universe. Nothing is generated by matter so much as channeled or interfaced through it. A power plant isn't really generating electricity in the sense of it spontaneously erupting out of no where. The electrons already exist in nature, and its simply flowing and directing what's already there. Just as a river bed doesn't generate water that flows through it, the physical mind isn't generating consciousness but flowing and directing it. Whatever consciousness is exactly, it already exists everywhere, or at least the potential for it.

    Anyway, when a river dries up, the water doesn't go away. It evaporates and goes somewhere else. In the same way, the awareness that makes up the stream that constitutes the continuity of your life experiences doesn't just go away when you die. It becomes a potential that could re-manifest again at any time after you die.
     
  13. machinist

    machinist Banned Lifetime Supporter

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    life is something that arises from non-life elements when conditions are favorable. its not so different from a log that is stuck in the undertow at the bottom of a waterfall. it cycles over and over up and down until eventually for whatever set of instances over a period of time.. it comes out and floats downstream.
     
  14. walsh

    walsh Senior Member

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    But consciousness is a property of the fully functioning body (at least we think), whereas gravity is a property of all matter. You're right about the transfer of the properties of matter - if an asteroid is vaporised the gravity of the object disappears but the vaporised particles retain it. Not sure how that would apply to consciousness - if consciousness is a unique property of the body, where would it go upon destroying the body? If we compare it with the asteroid situation, that would imply that all matter has consciousness. I don't really know what that conclusion means.

    I saw some mathematical proof similar to what you're saying on erowid here, which I found interesting http://www.erowid.org/spirit/writings/spirit_writings1.shtml
     
  15. Reno91

    Reno91 Member

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    If ya wanna know about the soul... Read Seth Speaks: The Eternal Validity of the Soul
     
  16. MellowViper

    MellowViper Member

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    Well the gravitational field would disappear when the asteroid is vaporized, yes. However the space-time matrix that's warped by concentrated mass wouldn't disappear. Its a property embedded in the fabric of reality, and a new gravitational field could develop in place of the old one if there was enough mass occupying the same coordinates or set of coordinates. In a similar manner, when we die, our consciousness, at least in its current form, and human identities will fade away. However, the potential for consciousness will always be embeded in the fabric of reality. The electrical impulses that are inside our brains and outside our brains have some property in them that, when organized into the right patterns gives rise to the very phenomenon were experiencing now. I really don't think our consciousness is just some rare fluke, never to be repeated again. There's something very fundamental about it that we haven't quite put our fingers on as a species. Its really the only phenomenon we know, for a fact, exists, because its ultimately what we interface all externalities through.

    There's some type of primary awareness, which I think is present everywhere in the cosmos, and there's self awareness, which is more specific to humans I believe. I don't see the universe outside of the domaon of human consciousness as this absolutely dead thing. As for the possibility that the whole universe is conscious, there's an awareness that I think just is and always is and present in all things. It doesn't know it, itself exists. It just exists. Then there's our particular manifestation of awareness, which is something like a feedback formed out of the primary awareness, in that were aware that were aware.


    This awareness of our awareness sets us apart from the "external" world that is only aware on the most primary of levels. The contrast between these two domains is what I believe generates the human ego and human individuation.
     
  17. dark suger

    dark suger Dripping With Sin!

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    Fear my mighty hooves
     
  18. Raga_Mala

    Raga_Mala Psychedelic Monk

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    The question brings with it a set of assumptions that don't allow a truthful answer that fits the parameters of the question.

    This very life as a separate corporeal entity could be viewed as illusory. If you take this corporeal life as the real point of departure, it's very easy to arrive at the conclusion that nothing survives beyond death. If you instead believe that this corporeal life is a relative (not an absolute) reality, then birth and death are equally limited constructs.

    I only believe I will not die in the sense that I know I also was not born. My consciousness is one and the same with the very ground of the Universe and from it all other possibilities arise. It is indestructible.

    :daisy::sultan::sunny::daisy:
     
  19. dark suger

    dark suger Dripping With Sin!

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    Yes I agree with raga
     
  20. Dejavu

    Dejavu Until the great unbanning

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    Raga Mala:
    Go tell that to your mother!

    The universe has a ground?!

    Humans are lucky enough to be conscious, albeit in degrees, and then have the temerity to insist that the universe be so too! Can't we at least be as generous to ourselves in this 'matter' as the universe has been to us? I mean, the universe can't even help its generosity unless we help ourselves! :D
     

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