What is the Endgame?

I've been wondering this for a long time.
I, and I think most people, really don't know what the POINT is.
What is it Occupy expects the achieve?
What policies are they trying to institute?
What is the PLAN for change?

I've seen the generic rants and posters.
I know what the problem is. EVERYBODY knows what the problem is.
But what exactly are we going to do about it?

I've spent hours waiting at the station for my train, the leaders of Occupy Boston at the table across from me, hearing what they were talking about. There was never anything about a plan, just brainstorming ways to be more flamboyant.

Everybody sees what's going on in the country.
I'm just asking what Occupy's idea of how to FIX it is.

 

Unrest has been at a boiling point in this country for years. You showed up at an occupy movement waiting for someone to tell you what you're there for?

It's such an Amalgam of disenfranchised individuals that may not know what the end result to this may be, but know they're getting attention and voices are starting to be heard. I've been following this kinda stuff since protests for the Iraq war started and were right away ignored and ridiculed. You're suffering from the same apprehension and curiosity that much of America is experiencing right now about this.

I will say I'd rather reach other people through flamboyance than violence any day.

 

I didn't show up at an occupy protest not know why I was there. I was in the station waiting for my train.

 

Well considering an organized protest and a political party are not the same thing, I don't really expect the occupy movement to come up with a perfect plan to fix everything. I am glad they are doing what they are doing as its spreading awareness and showing the government and corporate america that a lot of the citizens are fed up and would like to see some positive changes. I would be more active in the movement, but it seems nearly impossible to get involved with it in colorado.

I would like to see people who criticize the occupy protestors for not having a plan to fix the already falling system come up with an idea to improve things...but things are so screwed up its much easier said than done.

 

I could be wrong, it's been know to happen before, but I don't see the Occupy movement as the ones that come up with the fix for everything. It's more like they are the ones that point out everything that it broken, so everybody can see it.


That last bit is the important part, there are so many clueless bumps out there that think everything is fine as long as their GPS can get them to the theater to see the latest movie and then to Micky Dees afterwards for a dose of cholesterol. If EVERYBODY starts looking at the system for what it really is, and starts questioning things, then it can't continue the way it is without change, hopefully change for the better.

 

YES! THAT'S EXACTLY IT! You can't go into Wal-Mart and just shop around, once you've come to understand the real consequences of participating in that system. Everything the Occupy movement is fighting against is completely dependent on the 99% allowing it to continue. If you stop participating in a system (stop allowing your money to be mishandled by Bank of America, for example - and instead putting your money in a locally owned credit union) then that system can no longer exploit you. But you have to be aware of the fact that you are being exploited (and I mean really aware of how badly you're being exploited). You must take it personal. You cannot possibly remain neutral, or apathetic, when you know the whole truth.

We can't topple the system by force - we'll be massacred, characterized as terrorists/anarchists, disposed of and forgotten. But here's what scares the shit out of the 1% - knowledge of their activites, knowledge that it's their game and the table is rigged, and the only way to win is to stop playing. STOP PLAYING THE GAME - and that power structure is instantly Corrected.

Imagine if all the serfs in feudal England decided simultaneously to say, "Fuck this shit - I'm not working your land and I'm not going to carry a spear in your army when the Vikings come. The only power you and your King have over me is what I give you. I'm taking it back." Sure, the Knights would slaughter the serfs, but how many serfs could they get by slaughtering before it became very clear that no one was left to grow the food or do all the "unimportant, menial" bullshit that was beneath the Knights and the King, but that needed to be done, nevertheless, for the kingdom to survive in the first place?

Now change serf to you, the Vikings to any number of nations we've pissed off with our foreign policy of blatant aggression, and the Knights and the King to Big Energy, Big Pharma, the insurance cartel, the defense industry, and the Banking cartel, the hordes of lobbyists they employ to not only seduce your legislator, but likely buy him and groom him at the birth of his political career - to be placed before you as a "choice". This is a corporatocracy. This is the United States of America. And you thought feudalism was dead.

 

:2thumbsup:

 

The lack of "endgame" is the real problem with this. Anyone can criticize. And many of Occupy's criticisms are well founded. But some are not. And there is no consensus.

I remember at university all these activists. There was no reasoning to their activism.It was just rebellion for the sake of it. Half of em are "greedy bankers" these days.

I think that there is a problem in Western political systems. There is a lack of checks and balances in societies. Unchecked and unsteered globalism is a problem, as are certain entrenched( and ignorant) groups or Cabals.

However, Occupy itself has certain problems that it needs to look at and resolve.

 

So the point is to protest?
Alright, I'm okay with that.
I was just wondering if I was missing something.

It's hard for me to imagine that anyone doesn't see how the system works. But when I really look at the schmucks buzzing around downtown, yeah, it seems like they need a wakeup call.
I don't have a solution to fix the system. My personal solution was just to drop out of it, grow my own food, produce my own energy, and leave everybody else to their mcxistence.
If you think the Occupy movement is really changing people's views about the system, more power to you. That's some chutzpah.

 

It's a beginning...... Not everybody is looking at the system yet, but many are that weren't looking just last August. It's going to take time, we may not have time, and we are being slimmed at every turn by Faux news, but some people are paying attention. Those people in turn talk to their friends and it grows. I just hope we can continue.......

Kudos on your personal achievements, not everybody can pull that off though.

 

I'm as disenfranchised and pissed off as anyone but I don't think most protesters really have a clue. They need organization, perspective, and understanding of consequences.

First of all, American protesters are not the 99%. That's a fucking joke. Even the poorest working class Americans are among the top 5% wealthiest people on the planet. It's more like the 4% protesting the 1%.

Second, does a bunch of hippies and kids getting arrested in parks hurt the 1% at all? Evil corporate executives don't give a fuck, your providing entertainment if anything.

The movement needs to focus on real ways they can twist some corporate balls. Ever hear of "Denial Of Service" attacks? A method used to bring down websites, hackers flood corporate servers with requests. People can also do this in low tech ways with phones and emails. Get 500 people to refresh a corporate website continuously... I worked for a company where the bosses would be in a panic if there was 100 calls holding...

 

Well, I'd like to see anything happen.
Hopefully the 'establishing a presence' phase is coming to an end...

 

I'd look more into this 99% vs the 1% more deeply before you go on about how the protestors only represent 5% of the population. obviously 995 of people are not involved in the occupy movement but it's about raising awarness about the fact a small group of individuals is exploiting a large majority of american citizens and even citizens of other countries...there is even a documentary called The 1% that goes into detail about some of the problems in this country and how the super wealthy 1% are screwing people over.

Also not that I think illegal=evil or anything, but hacking is illegal...protesting is a right we have. Besides being able to hack computers should not be a requirement to speak up against corporate america. that is a good idea though to freaking flood corporate servers.

 

if you think that the protesters are just made up of "hippies and kids" you obviously haven't actually gone to a site and got to know some of the people there... there are many, MANY people at Occupy who work AND protest... sounds like you have been relying on mainstream media perhaps?

 

And do you thing corporate executives give a shit fuck about these working people?

What do you think THEY are calling the protesters?

You totally missed point I was trying to make. People standing in parks and streets is a fucking joke to them. 500 organized people overloading websites and phone systems will hurt them a hell of a lot more than 5000 people bitching in a park.

 

well corporate execs are a mixed bunch... we actually have corp execs who work for Occupy... not all members of occupy are at the occupations... sorry, what point did i miss?

 

Well, I don't know if it would really hurt them,
but I don't think we should open a discussion of what would hurt them on a public internet forum.

 

Like setting up a high power cell jamming network around wallstreet? That kind of discussion?

 

From what I gather, it seems like the Occupy Movement will protest to bring about awareness of the problem of money in politics/ poor trade practices to the general public. I would imagine that they will stop protesting ONCE they see politicians START to enact legislation that helps stop those questionable practices.

I don't see any of the "game-changers" emerging from within the ranks of the movement. I see it as though the movement will inspire those of us who have some good ideas but WEREN'T going to do anything about it (say, take me, a trained mathematician with lots of knowledge of banking), to actually DO something.

As an example, I am now actively perusing the initiation of my career in the banking industry. It is an idea I always popped around my head, but ever since Occupy, I have decided that is what I want to do. I am already in the application process. I will use my skills in mathematical analysis to do MY part in starting to 'repair' America's investment banking system. Perhaps someday I will have a big voice in the bank and can actually FORCE change.

 

The aim being to slowly increase their rate of cancer over the next thirty years?