This little question popped into my head the other day. I want to see what you all think. What was/is God's purpose in creating psychedelics? Things like opiates and alcohol make sense, because they serve medical purposes, and wine is good for cooking But whats up with psychedelics? What is actually happening when someone takes LSD and has a "spiritual experience"? If Adam or Eve had eaten a certain mushroom off the ground, or dried and smoked some marijuana, what would have happened? Did these mind-altering effects come about due to the entrance of sin and death into the world?
Well part of you post assumes a literal interpretation of the first chpters of Geneis, and so I cannot answer them. I will attempt to answer your post in a broad sense. If you ask about LSD you are no longer dealing with "creation" you are dealing with humanity. LSD is a synthetic drug. Speaking about natural drugs, like mushrooms, I will adress them like poisons (mainly is because that is what my opinion of them is, a poison). Why then would God "create" poison. Well it is important to understand that I believe in Evolutionary Creation, so poison developed as a survival mechanism. Some animals can ingest plants that are poisonous to us. Everthing has its niche. In fact, everything has its own niche so perfectly fit that some people use niches as a "proof" of creation. Yes, I do drink small amounts of alcohol so I also do ingest poisons, but not to mind altering states. I do see a difference between psychadelics and alcohols...Alcohol is old sugars, psychadelics are an evolutionary defense...
With magic mushrooms, the amount you would need to ingest to actually poison your body would be impossible because your stomach would reject them before breaking them down could even begin. LSD is a semisynthetic chemical, not entirely synthetic Burbs, so let's not try and get off the point here. The point being, that magic mushrooms are a fungus, and LSD comes from a fungus called ergot and is therefor just as 'natural'. There's no actual proof of course, but it is speculated that the magic mushrooms are being referred to as Soma within the Rg Veda from India, the birthplace of what has come to be known as spirituality, and for LSD look at the entheogenic theories of the Eleusinian Mysteries. I for one, from direct experience, cant deny that these feelings people are having from psychedelic drugs are in fact the very reason we 'evolved' into a form of hosting consciousness which accepts God in the first place.
Why, when I can break it down right here and now in 4 sentences? :tongue: Man eats mushrooms. Man gets dizzy and sees a bright neon light. Man meets God. The End.
In a reality with the presence of God, anything "created" by humans (LSD), or anything that evolvled or developed through the course of nature would still ultimately be God's responsibility.
It is also speculated that Soma is water, or honey, or pomegranate and many other things. Yes, Neo natural life is God's responsibility, however, I do not believe that man is totally depraived. Meaning, I do not believe that if we create something, does not mean that God nessecarily ordained it. No relayer, deriving a substance from a natural substance does not make it "natural" in my opinion. Anything is natural because it can b created from something pre-existing, but would you consider plasics to be "natural" substances because they are derived from petrochemicals which used to be plants and aminals?
well if you take it from that approach... a beaver is natural right? so the dam that he builds is natural too? well man is just as natural to this world as the beaver. therefor, anything we do could be seen as natural. still God. :afro:
Plants have intelligence, enough that even their synthesis is effective in use for humans. Even some plant like tumeric can stave off cancer. Pomegranates as mentioned are amazing antioxidents. So are walnuts. So also plants with mental effects are also good at effectively preventing suffering if used correctly. Unfortunately a medicine, if used without nessesity, sometimes becomes as much of a problem.
Well played. I do not have a retort to that. Still, I don't use psychadelics, nor do I think psychadelics are useful spiritually. I do think they are useful to unock what is in your own mind bu if you want to discover the "out there" I think you should utilize other methods...
Im a strong believer that any spiritual truths we could ever hope to uncover can all be unlocked by looking within oneself. And psychedelics open the door to introspection quite wide. After all, Jesus did say, "The kingdom of God cometh not with observation: Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you." Luke 17: 20-21
To me that signifies that it is in our power to create a utopian civilization. It is within us to live like Jesus, it is within our power to bring about social change for the better... BTW- Some translations read the kingdom of heaven is among you...
I personally have not done any reading in Bible commentaries about that vers so I couldn't say. I stil think that with either translation, it could mean that the kingdom is among the people. "within you" could be sen as a collective like "within the community"...
oh. That's just not how I interpret it. wow two different interpretations? so much for the infalliable word of God eh?
psychedelics imo are much more useful than alcohol, and much safer for you than opiates...they are also not poisons imo and have proven extremely useful in many different settings and when used properly can facilitate the most rewarding and outright unbelievable experiences imaginable, including spiritual experiences...try some and you'll know, for those that haven't done psychedelics, you will never be able to understand, it's too unique of an experience....like describing color to a blind person
Psychedelics are just a tool witch helps you let go of everything and find the God within yourself and in everything that surrounds you. You could do that even without psychedelics, but you would probably need some close to life expirience, like a bus hitting you and you wake up after a few days in coma. Coma...what is that? That is beeing on exactly the same place where we are born from, where we go when we sleep, when we trip. We all come from the same energy split in the bodies of all creatures inhabiting this reality and once you find out who you really are, God becomes so obvious, but when i say God, I don't think how this religion or bible interpretit it, I mean on something that all religions are pointing out to, something much higher and deeper than any religion, or all together can say. It is beyond words, it can only be felt and comuned by your soul. But in order to travel with your soul, you must kill the logic and let go of anything you know or belive and to let your soul make the connection with "mother ship". Thats where psychodelics come very handy, and somehow you all know that they are not there by pure accident, they are there with the reason, same reason that God exist, same reason why Sun is always coming up in the morning..... The more you know, it is easier to say I don't know, proudly like you are the smartest person on the world and only that is the right answer: I don't know, but I don't care because I know exactly what I need to know in that particular moment. All you do from love, it is the right answer, right thing to do. Its so simple, you can feel is something right or wrong, why questioning than did you do the right thing. Your logic will never make the soul happy, because it is there to link you to this body and reality, while our soul is always anxious to go back where it came from so it can make another circle, or to progress and make a new spiral on witch we can continue making circles. It is the never ending story, same questions and realizations all over again through the human existance, but it is soooo nice every time. Beeing a God is not an easy task, but there is also nothing more beautifull. It can be compared with beeing a parent. There are so many things that are hard to do, but for your children it is never a problem, it is more pleasure than a problem. Having a kid, thats where you really can feel the God in you, thats when you find out the unlimited and unconditioned love and you realize that you never loved anybody like that before. Beliving in God wakes up the wish to love everybody like your own child, without asking anything in return, unconditionaly! And it feels so good!!!! Love you all!
It really doesnt matter what you think in this case Burb, because it is a matter of personal experience. You can 'think' people should utilize other methods but your perfect world where everyone finds God the way you apparently have doesnt exist. Some of us come from certain situations where God is laughed at as an idea, and somehow wind up taking psychedelic drugs for kicks and are exposed to something that a book or a preacher or a parent can never show you because it is a very personal thing. Only the reverberation of your connection to God can be shared after it is established. What you do afterwards determines wether or not your spiritual use of psychedelics was authentic, but the initial exposure can not be denied. Nor can the insanity, but I have yet to see a method of turning on to God that doesnt have it's negative reactions. About unlocking what is in your own mind, this is something that happens at every moment you have life breath in your body. Psychedelics dont exactly unlock whats in your mind, they expose you to how false this reality is when we are the kind of person who are incapable of perceiving it from another persons point of view. And about the soma deal, sure, the translation, just as with all translations, could be false and merley coincidence. But I ask you to eat some shrooms and look at Hindu art and philosophy and then come state that the two arent ENTIRLEY connected.
