Individual vs. Collective Experience

It may take me a moment to phrase this, so bear with me:

I have spent a lot of time pursuing the subject of religion, and "faith in God." However, for the past 7/8 months, my own individual experience of God is not matching up with the collective Christian experience. I used to feel completely grounded and at home in my Christian community, and now I've found that I feel it to be nothing but a burden when I'm in church or doing any activities in my congregation. But I still am experiencing God. It's just that the God I am experiencing now is one that I don't feel a need to define in words and scripture. And if I did have to define my God right now, I don't think it would look like the Bible.

I think that community is important, whether that is being a hippie, and sharing your time with others who have "hippie" values and interests, or whether that means being a Christian, or Muslim, etc.

So, why do I feel completely turned off by what used to be my rock? Can I still be Christian? Honestly, if being a Christian is defined by my involvement with Church, am I now just a "spiritual" person, rather than a Christian; a follower of Christ?

 

You are probably going to have to solve this dilemna your self. Fools will readily give you their opinion as quickly as the wise.

It also depends on what you define being "Christian" as. If you throw out revelation, and some other parts of the N.T., the bible is a pretty good source of information on God. I don't really define myself as Christian or non-Christian. I love God, I love souls, and I have tribulations (growing pains) just like every other soul. Since God is actively directly involved in my life at all times, I don't really feel the need to feed on the scriptures (spiritual baby food) accept as a supplement at times. I feel like depending on the scriptures is like drinking from a bottle instead of eating solid food. At a certain level, you don't really want to be seen drinking from a bottle anymore.

Depends on if you are still called a Christian if you have learned what you were supposed to from Christ and have turned to God for further guidance.

 

I think the thing that has been bothering me the most is that I am tired of the constant struggle I feel between my own experience of God and the way that Christianity wants me to frame that experience. I feel like the doctrines concerning Sin (original), sins, free will and the "freedom" of the Cross are symbols and concepts that no longer explain what I am feeling and experiencing about God. I have no desire to evangelize because I no longer think I have the right to force everyone to interpret their experience through a Christian lense. ​

In light of all this, I just had this cosmic experience. I was at the bookstore, looking for something, not sure what, and I picked up a book opened it and read this (please excuse the non-inclusive language as this was written in the 18th century) I bolded some statements: ​

The injunction "Man, know thyself" must be applied by you to the pure truth of being and not to human concepts of what that truth is. It is dangerous, however, to be critical of another or of his concepts; for only the individual can apprehend, through the screen of his own being, his world and the cosmos beyond. When you realize the meaning of interpreting life for yourself, you will see how utterly impossible it is for you to perform this for another, inasmuch as the average person cannot successfully enter the consciousness of another life nor accurately assess his complete thought and feeling processes. ​

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--almost forgot to mention who wrote that. A man named Count Saint Germain​

 

(all my opinon)

I thinak i am having a similar dilemna but mine is before I am attending a Chruch (or any church for that matter) regularily. The reason of which is because I want to find one where i am confortable, and if i can't...oh well. I will attend one that is best, use it (among other places) for spiritual community, and as a place where i CAN ask questions if i need a little help trying to figure something out in scripture and that is that. I won't get Christened in if I am not 100% up to taking part...

The majority of scripture anyways is an attempt to define God and it's nature and what-have-you...What does it mean that Chrsit was Transfigured? What did the 3 disciples witness that made them say that Moses and Elijah were with him? These (I highly doubt with 99.9% certianty) will never be answeed to the living on earth...

dis Jesus ever set out a "definition of God"? No. At least, none that i can rememebr, and you would think that he is the best person to do so. What he did do though was call God Abba, Father, Daddy, a mother hen gathering her chicks (ok, so he used that one for himself, but whatever) or whatnot. A deeply personal intamite relationship in which love is the binding agent.

 

Yeah, I was going to add that bit about evangalism...The only open evangalism (meaning not like, working at a soup kitchen, but like acctually talking about God) I would EVER take part in woudl just be like a casual conversation (if it naturally is steered that way)... I would tell them what i believe, ask what they do and try to learn adn answer any questions they may have...

But yeah, my favourite church is my friends. most of us are Christian (a few are athiests) and most of us also attend different churches (or like me, none at all). sadly they are all prodestant (as in not roman catholic or orthodox..i think one is lutheran but he is kinda falling away from that because of the liturgy)...but anyways, talking with them i learned a lot about God and myself and it helped shape my individual spirituality. I know they will ALWAYS be there if i need a hand and are proboboy always willing to answer some questions (except the seminary student...he told me lightheartedly that during the summer, he doens't want to deal with anything theological draining )

 

Molly...it sounds like you need an expanded frame of reference for the spiritual place in which you now find yourself.


Reading Indian/Hindu scripture, Bhagavad-gita particularly, would give you some insights into a universal concept of spirituality that is supported by a long tradition, not just by New Ageism...come over to the Hinduism forum and join the discussion; no one is going to try and convert you to anything.

 

Molly, every moment is a fork in the road. All the choices are yours.

 

I agree. Also, I'd highly recommend Paramhansa Yogananda's 'Autobiography of a Yogi'. This book has been a real eye opener for many people, and Yoganada wasn't in any way hostile to an enlightened Christianity.

 

thanks. I certainly will join the discussion, although I don't think I need to necessarily replace one religious label with another right now. I'm happy being a seeker...but I def. will check out some of the discussions.

 

i REALLY think you absolutely HAVE TO read Conversations With God by Neale Donald Walsch. i'm not going to reccomend some eastern philosophy book, because i know you probably want to stay a christian, at least for now. this book will answer every question you ever had about life and the bible and god. it will completely change your life, and alter the way you experience everything, forever. PLEASE buy it or find it at a library. i would really love for you to read it.

 

Yes. Actually, I have a copy of that book on the shelf waiting to be read.

I think I have been trying to completely cleanse my mind from thinking about God. Or maybe I am thinking about God a lot, but not saying to myself, "Ah, now this is God" as I'm experiencing something.

I'm trying to just be: and then analyze later. And I feel more free than I have in a long time.

 

The Bible itself is an eastern philosophy book isn't it? Middle eastern at least.....

 

If you had faith even as a grain of mustard seed,said Jesus,you could move mountains-for there is no separation in love,there is no condemnation nor irritation,but power,joy,ecstasy even;and you know that God is All.