OK, all you religious people, convince me there is a God. Give me evidence that cannot be argued. I don't think you can do it, but I think you should try. It's a lovely idea, but the story just doesn't seem to add up. Do you all ACTUALLY believe? Or do you just want to really really badly, so bad that you dismiss any evidence against Him? Or do you take God as a fictional symbol for what is just and right in this world? How do you account for other religions? Do you respect them as their own symbol, or do you dismiss and discredit them? What would your God have you do about them? Do you let it run your life, or do you take responsibility for yourself? Convince me!! You have been challenged!
Personnaly, I'm not a Christian at all - I don't believe in Jesus according to the conventional teachings of who he was. I respect everyone's decisions regarding religion - faith to me is 100% personal, I believe in God, but could care less if anyone else did. I'm not into convincing others in what I believe in. I'm also completely against those who are intolerant of the faith and spirituality of other's and try and convince them what they should believe.
I'm not trying to convince anyone of anything. I am attempting to have an intellctual, respectful, relevant conversation about this subject. Do what you want, but if you don't have an argument, please don't post in this thread. For every response I will do my best to listen and calmly respect your opinions. All I ask is that you calmly and fairly allow me to retort. I guess I'll begin by explaining my beliefs. Right now (my beliefs often change) I personally believe that the universe is a chaotic clump of matter, complicated beyond comprehension. I don't think there is any order to it, but I also believe that there are ennumerable (sp?) things in existence that we cannot percieve with our limited 5 senses. Therefore I cannot deny the existence of God, nor can I accept it.
I understand..... But I never said I needed anything, I WANT to see if anyone can enlighten me. That's great if just having blind faith works for you, but it doesn't for me. Is that what you all think? It doesn't matter if it's factual or not, it's just great to believe in something? Is that the point? Sorry if that's a harsh way of putting it, but I need more than that.
Ya, i didn't see that other post cause we posted at the same time......I'm not so much a beiliver in blind faith, but this is where i get into discussions with my Chirstian friends who say that things like the old grek gods are not real cause when the guy climbed mt. olympus, there was nothing there, maybe he didn't have faith... But i think my faith in a universal spirit comes from the fact that although i beleive that life could start out of nothing, how did that nothing come together in sucha way as to create the first DNA strands... I'll let you chew on that one...
OK, all you people of the atheological postion, convince me there is no God. Give me evidence that cannot be argued. I don't think you can do it, but I think you should try. It's a lovely idea, but the story just doesn't seem to add up. Do you all ACTUALLY believe? Or do you just want to really really badly, so bad that you dismiss any evidence for Him? How do you account for other positions? Do you respect them as their own symbol, or do you dismiss and discredit them? What would your position have you do about them? Do you let your position run your life, or do you take responsibility for yourself? Convince me!! You have been challenged!
Exactly what I was thinking Jatom. People try to say that Christianity is blind faith. I have to disagree. Why? Well, I study The Bible. In The Bible, there are many instances that are fortold before they ever happen. Many things that were known before man discovered them. There is archeological proof, prophetic proof, and scientific proof. Historians the world over agree that Jesus Christ was a real person. Not a ficticious person or made up hero. Christ was witnessed to do miracles in God's name. He wasn't just witnessed by people that supported Him, but by people that were afraid of Him as well. Firstly I have a relationship with God. Second I have faith in God. Third, The Bible strengthens my faith with proof. You could try all you want, but there is nothing at all that can make me change my mind.
well i have both proof and faith. I have personally felt God through the holy spirit...i can not see God yet i have felt him. I have faith through proof....until you feel that too....it will be hard for you to believe. If u ask God to enter your life you will feel this. roly.xxx
Love works that way, too... I wonder if it's related. When people ask me how you know if a person is "the one," I tell them that it they are asking that question, then it isn't "the one." When it's real love, you just know. There are no doubts and no reservations. Real love is absolute and unconditional and so incredible that it make you wonder how you could have thought you were ever really alive before. Joseph Campbell once said that love was the recognition of the divine in another person. Do you think that was what he meant?
The fact is that people don't really "know" anything. For instance, scientists don't "know" anything for fact, science is just a bunch of theories and arguments. Which is sort of similar to religion: Religions are just theories and philosophies on life. We really don't know. Now, anyone could be wrong, which means that anyone could be right. Who knows who that is? When it comes down to it, it's not about proof or experiments, it's about ideas. Ideas, and which ideas you personally except.
That's not true. You can break science up into fact and theories. In order for science to be factual sciece, it must be observable, testable, and repeatable. If that is the case it is beyone theory and now fact. Things like the evolution/creation theories can never be fact, because no one was around to observe it. Science and religion are nothing similar. Both may have theories included in it, but so does everything else. (psychology, sociology, math, etc...)
NOTE: Remember this is just an overview of the proofs of the Bible There is no God. The Bible is false. Religion is blind faith. Through my walk with Christ, I have continually heard these comments and I am sure many of you here can relate. I remember when I was younger telling my friends about Jesus and all they would say is, “Well how do you know the Bible is true?” and I would be stumped. Deep down I knew there was validity to this ancient book but I didn’t know how to explain it. I wanted to know the truth. Is the Bible just another myth or was it truly inspired by God? I started out by asking my dad what he thought. He told me about prophecies of the Bible. He said everything that the Bible predicted up to this date has come true. My dad then explained to me about the Messianic Prophecies as an example. Almost the whole story of Jesus is told throughout the Old Testament yet Jesus did not come until hundreds of years later in the New Testament. He also told me about the prophecies concerning the Jews returning to Israel. The Bible predicted that in the last days the Jews would reclaim Israel. As I took history in high school I found this prophecy to be true. In 1948 the Jews took Judah first and then in 1967 they retrieved Jerusalem second. The Bible predicted this exact sequence in the Zechariah thousands of years before it happened. My dad also informed me about the archaeological proof that the Bible presented. He explained to me a new theory of where the Red Sea crossing site was. A man named Ron Wyatt had discovered this site and found at the bottom of the sea laid chariots, chariot wheels, spears, human remains and much more evidence in and out of the water that this amazing Biblical event truly did happen. Later, as I was doing my own research I came upon another proof of the Bible—scientific accuracy. It turns out that the Bible talks about scientific things before they were even discovered. For example in Isaiah it says the earth is round yet this fact had not been discovered until thousands of years later. As I close, through my dad and my own research I found that the Bible is more than some ancient book-it is God’s word. And instead of blindly telling others about God, I can now tell them with confidence that the Bible is true. Prophetic, archaeological, and scientific proof of the Bible is what separates Christianity from all other religions. And as a final result, I am know confident in my faith knowing that what I believe is not blind faith but based on actually fact.
Interesting contradiction. You just said science and religion have nothing in common, then you mentioned a similarity in then. Just because the similarity it's evident in other places doesn't mean it should be taken out of consideration.
So because something has one element the same means it is similar? Hardly. Is the theory of creation similar to the theory of evolution just because the word theory is used to describe both? No.
They are similar because they discuss two different arguments on the same topic. You said it is by no means similar, and that is just wrong.
I suggest you look up the meaning of the word similar. Two different arguments on the same topic is not the correct definition. In fact, you are trying to say two different arguments are similar.... Anyway, it is a moot point. Back on topic, you can't really "prove" the Bible, that's why a person needs faith to believe in christianity. Things like finding chariot wheels on the bottom of the sea prove nothing except that somehow there are chariot wheels on the bottom of the sea. Just like finding what looks like a boat on some mountian only proves there is something that looks like a boat on the mountian. And the earth being round was not an unpopular theory, even when many thought the earth was flat. There is no scientific proof of God in the Bible.
Sera Michele, "Things like finding chariot wheels on the bottom of the sea prove nothing except that somehow there are chariot wheels on the bottom of the sea." What about when the chariot wheels are dated back to when moses lived on the earth? All this chariots, chariot wheels, spears, human remains, and horses remains are all coral encrusted showing their age.... And ITS just a Coincidence?? ... you have more faith then I do. "Just like finding what looks like a boat on some mountian only proves there is something that looks like a boat on the mountian." -Then how do you explain a wooden object that is 450 feet long and 75 feet tall that has the same measures as Noah's ark? AND HOW DO YOU EXPLAIN IT BEING ON A MOUNTAIN THAT IS 17,000 FEET HIGH? And why is the Turkish Government so protective of it that they will not allow any archaeologist to see it? "And the earth being round was not an unpopular theory, even when many thought the earth was flat." There is no scientific proof of God in the Bible." <LI>Roundness of the earth (Isaiah 40:22) <LI>Almost infinite extent of the sidereal universe (Isaiah 55:9) <LI>Law of conservation of mass and energy (II Peter 3:7) <LI>Hydrologic cycle (Ecclesiastes 1:7) <LI>Vast number of stars (Jeremiah 33:22) <LI>Law of increasing entropy (Psalm 102:25-27) <LI>Paramount importance of blood in life processes (Leviticus 17:11) <LI>Atmospheric circulation (Ecclesiastes 1:6) Gravitational field (Job 26:7) I am sure these were all popular theories back thousands of years ago too. Nothing about the prophecies?.... To hard to explain I guess when the only argument is "They're to vague"
It is proof that they found chariot wheels dating back to when moses was alive, but not proof of god by any means. All that is is proof that ther is what looks like a wooden object up on that mountain. It isn't proof until it's proof, no matter how much coincidence you want to put in it. Coincidence isn't proof. And they don't even know this object is wooden. FOr all you know it is a rock. Vague or not, it isn't proof of god's existance. None of those verses you cited proves God's existance. All it proves is that someone had the idea that the earth was round, etc...
