Gun trade

Amnesty, IANSA and Oxfam have launched a global campaign aiming to stop gun running and control the arms trade - and they need your face as support now. Simply go to:


http://www.controlarms.org/million_faces/en/index.php/register?s=660374

 

that's a nice dream...

 

the link didnt work for me

if you take the jews in world war two wouldnt it be a good thing to have run guns to them, wasnt the fact that they were disarmed a large reason for the nazis being able to kill so many of them with so little effort .

personally I think the world needs more guns to defend the population from acts of genocide commited by goverments .

what would have been wrong with running guns into Rwanda or selling guns to the marsh arabs or kurds when saddam was ruler of iraq

http://www.jpfo.org/

http://www.thehomegunsmith.com/links.shtml

 

of course if no one had guns we'd be far more peacefull. you dont stop bullying by teaking all the kids how to punch better.

 

but the reasons those genocides happen is because of the huge amounts of arms anbd the power that dictates. If more guns and arms appear, the more in danger humans are. If one nation keeps building up a bigger armory then other nation will follow in suit in aims of 'defence'.
peacex

 

yes I think the way to stop bullying is to teach all the kids to punch better, I tried dealing with bullys in school by reason and turning the other cheek and I found it didnt work .

The best way to stop bullying is to make sure that the bully knows he will have pain if he bullys you and if he trys to kill you that you will try to kill him back

I speak from experience on this issue as if I did not have this attitude I would be personally dead , I was attacked by a group of men for no reason and the only way I was able to survive was to try and stab them, If I had had a gun I would have shot them .

I disagree that arms cause genocide I agree with jews in favour of firearm ownership that a lack of a means of defence does.

 

Sorry, Fleassy. That kind of campaign is foolish.

For one thing, these feel-good campaigns are really just shrouded attempts to ban gun ownership by law-abiding, average people who are entitled to the right to have guns for their own defense.

DISarmament has caused more innocent people to be SLAUGHTERED by governments, warlords, and assorted other evil people by the MILLIONS in the 20th century. Take an honest look at history: EVERY society, every culture, every ethnicity that has ever been the victim of genocide, has first been disarmed. Everyone has been told that the way to civilization is to render yourself harmless.

What kind of fool believes that only good can come to him once he has given up the means to protect himself?

That is insane on its face.


The UN can shove its "small arms reduction treaties" up its bloated, corrupt fuckin' ASS, as far as I (and many other people) are concerned.


We saw in New Orleans just how well the authorities are able to see to the people's protection when the shit hits the fan.

Thank you very much, I'll just keep my rifles and handguns. I am not a criminal, and the only people who have anything to fear from me are those who would come to me to do unprovoked harm -- and those people should have to be afraid of the righteous and innocent.


-Jeffrey

 

AMEN, Jonny! Thank you!

JPFO tells what every jew in the world should know. It's a shame that any jew would have to be told that the way to "Never again" is most certainly NOT to be DISARMED against potential aggressors.

I would add Very good site.


-Jeffrey

 

Oh please.

Tell us when you have figured out the magic formula to miraculously make ALL GUNS in the WORLD DISAPPEAR -- AND ALL AT THE SAME TIME. (If it doesn't happen simultaneously, whoever is not first will own whoever is.)


Do you really think that the world would be better off if those who had might were able to make right? Think about it: if you have a gun, you are the equal of a 250 lb. athletic muscular male. What the fuck makes you think that if he has a sword and you have a sword, or if he has a club and you have a club, that you have an equal chance of defeating him in a challenge for power over the other.

Anyone who thinks that the disappearance of GUNS from the world would make the world PEACEFUL is a fuckin' IDIOT. For how many thousands of years did man do jussssst fine making war against each other before guns were even conceived of? Did you just conveniently forget about those eons?




I'm not saying that your heart is not in the right place, but I sure am saying you're quite misguided.

I know you to be a good person, Fleassy, but attempting to make people lay down arms and then telling them that it will somehow bring about peace instead of slavery is just lunacy.


-Jeffrey

 

I dont think dissaprearence of guns will make the world peacefull..and i never said such a think jeffrey.

However i do think guns are awefull things. They are designed with ONE intention, to kill.
I hate swords, i hate numchucks i hate fighting.

I may have a naieve outlook on things in your head jeffrey but i know what i feel.

knowing that a 15 year old boy can buy a gun, and then go out and commit an armed robbery, scaring people half to death .... thats a petrifying thought.

Knowing that if i were in america and i walked aross a bit of land i didnt know that some famrer may misstake me for someone evil and shoot me. (a long shot i know but you get my drift)


The only good of guns is for power. Its a macho thing "i am bigger than you so dont come near me" The world will get nowhere if everyone had guns... its would be a stalemate yes ... but we would progress no further.

 

well i have to disagree, to stop a bully, you must work out why said bullying is doing as so, not hit them back as this will casue more anger and agression at a later date.

I always used to turn the other cheek, and ignore others and it worked for me if we are using examples. I was attacked once by some kids, who had a disliking towards me, one kid smashed me in the face but I refused to fight back, and lucky I did not because he and all of his gang had weapons they were planning on using if it turned into a fight. I was safe because I ignored them and tried to speak to them about reasoning.

if you own arms, it may seem like defence to you, but it could be a attack from someone elses point of view, so they will get weapons, and anything could spark off disaster. if no one had weapons, how serious could it get, a few words. In my eyes it would create a much more peaceful world
peacex

 

Your points are all about wishful thinking, hoping that pacifism will be well-received and convincing to someone who has already proved himself violent and lawless.

I can't believe what I'm reading: you actually think that a good person who does not avail himself of the means to defend himself is better off and somehow safer than someone who does know how to fight, and is capable of fighting to defend himself.

Once a bully has been created, it doesn't matter what made him that way: you still have to deal with him. How many bullies (and I'm not talking about schoolyard ones, either, but real, honest-to-badness evil adult people in the world, the kind who rape, maim and kill, not steal lunch money) do you figure can be talked out of whatever they were figuring to do to you?!

I view anyone who "refuses to fight back" as a coward, the kind of person who leaves it to others to defend him (like the cops or the school admin), or worse, counts on the better nature of the person who's attacking him. That's just insane.

-peacefuljeffrey

 

in switzerland every military age male has by law to have a fully automatic assault rifle in their home , yet they have a low murder rate and low gun crime .

as a country they are not known for being bloodthirsty the last war they fought I think was in the middle ages

I have to agree with peaceful jeffrey in that I think that a non violent response to being attacked encourages that violent attacker to attack other people

you can see in the case of the nazis that some people are happy to kill millions of defenceless people without their Conscience bothering them .

basically what stopped the nazis was people killing lots of nazis ,they had people like yourself turning the other cheek and really it didnt effect them damn all .

killing people is not always a bad thing by killing enough nazis you would have saved millions of innocent people including 1 million children .

its a pity that the jews didnt have more guns swords axes and such, and a more warlike attitude , its a pity they had not been more like the swiss .

but the jews for the most part followed your way of thinking thats how half a million nazis were able to kill 6 million jews, I dont think they would have been able to do that to the swiss or the americans

 

yes i do honestly believe that the less violent, and does not avail to portect ones self are more safe people. isn't it true that if you carry a weapon there is more chance that you will end up in a tragic situation. I know that is the case for guns. the only people i know who have ended up in serious trouble and in hospital are those who defend themselves and end up in a worse situations.

whatever i am a coward, yet i am a happy coward, i do not care. i don't use the cops to defend myself. so i am insane. so the hell what? so i trust human nature a lot more than you, it has served me well so far. i am not scared everytime i go out like some people. i live to my ethics.
pretty ironic name
peace

 

How would you know what kind of a situation they'd be in if they didn't defend themselves?

If a guy is going to come up to me because he thinks I'm someone who did something to him a while ago, and start pummeling me in the face, you believe that I would be less likely to be injured by letting him continue to beat my face unresisted than if I tried to fight back?! If you believe that, you must be insane.


You have been led to believe that by a very often-repeated MYTH, spawned by a whacko "researcher" named Dr. Arthur Kellerman. He came out with a "study" which cherry-picked data to come up with the absurd notion that if you keep a gun in the home, you are 43 times more likely to have you or another loved one in your home killed by gunfire than to use it defensively to save yourself.

Kellerman's "study" did not consider any use of a gun against an intruder a successful use of a gun unless it resulted in a DEAD ATTACKER.

That means that every time someone presented a gun and a homebreaker went running off into the night terrified, or shot a homebreaker and wounded but did not kill him -- those were not counted as successful defensive gun uses! Does that make sense?

Kellerman allowed that even drug dealers killing rival drug dealers counted as "loved ones" in his study. (As long as someone was "known to" the gun owner, it was a "loved one" by his account.)

Kellerman's study has been so roundly denounced and debunked by anyone who actually reads on this subject, that it's clear the only reason people like you quote it is because you simply don't have the facts. All that's reached you is this nonsensically dogmatic mantra of "Guns are bad; end of story."

I have had a gun (well, numerous guns) for over 12 years now, and never injured myself, and they have never brought injury my way.

Somehow you seem to figure that my having a gun will what, bring intruders to my door? And if intruders come randomly to my door, my having a gun to use against an armed attacker means I'm MORE likely to get hurt than if I have NOTHING to use to defend myself?

Do you realize how ridiculous that sounds? It's like saying that if I have a house fire, I'm better off not having a fire extinguisher than having one.


-Jeffrey

 

insane, ridiculous?? you do realize you are posting in a UK forum where guns are outlawed, because we do not have a constitution to misrepresent to create arms laws. here in the UK, gun crime is rising, but nowhere near the amount of gun crime in the US, not even close.

i lived in the second largest city for the past 18 years of my life, with the second highest gun rate, and i have only seen a gun once, they are mainly used in gang warfare in this country, not just to defend property, because property, AGAIN is not a major part of our constitution. you seem to forget you are debating on a different culture to your own.

for someone who calls himself peacefuljefferey, you seem a pretty angry unpeaceful cat
peace and no hatex

 

can you answer me a question, when were guns outlawed? it isn't like it happened a few years ago and we have seen a sudden change, this is a culture thing, not an inevitabality. these are percentages, not jsut on numbers because that would be obscene to quote on population, and i wouldn't use that as an example. the gun crime per person is higher in the US. i do not know about your area in the UK, but the average person i know of does not own a gun and has never seen a gun. if it was suddenly legal this would change, and i think we would be living in a much more dangerous place. what has happened to this website, where are all the peaceful 'hippy' people?
peacex

 

these times in the UK are scary
not really, the media make it out to be a scary ass palce to live, granted there are some places that are pretty bad, but the rest is exagerrated. as it says in the article you used, the gun crime figures are nothing to the united states, and because i believe we have similar cultures, then i do believe that it would be best for guns not to be legal, because we are better off at preventing it at present.

and i am sorry, this was on a particular gun issue, in the news a few years ago, to stop licenced guns by the snowdrop campaign, and because of said campaign britain now has the toughest laws on private gun ownership.

the british culture does not need guns, chaos would break out, if they became totally legal. in my opinion this shouldn't even be a debating topic, guns are weapons, that are used to injure or kill another human being or animal, and we in the UK do not need them.

i am a peaceful guy, because i do believe in peace, not worrying about protecting myself, i am not paranoid, why do i not carry around a nuclear weapon because there is a chance another state may drop one on us? crime overall is going down here in the UK, it is just coverage that has increased. we do not want to follow the misrepresented US constitution on this issue
peacex

 

your welcome, i am sorry to sometimes come across quite strongly on my views, i just do honestly believe legalizing guns in the UK would be the wrong move, although i can see the others sides point, i just do not believe this is the way to go.
making them legal and having them is different to having them illegally, because if you get caught with a gun, or having shot somebody then you have broken the law, and i do believe in that law.

i may be naive in believing this, but i do not believe that i will come across many situation in my life where guns are involved and i feel the need to protect myself so i would never carry a gun even if they were legal
peacex

 

No, it isn't true. Is it true that if you own a fire extinguisher, it will attract fires? WTF?
To elaborate on what peaceful jeffry(iirc) was saying. When I was at my most fit, I was 295 lbs, and running 3 miles a day. I've studied Muay Thai, Aikido and Brazilian Jiu Jitsu. I've spent a good deal of my adult life working in bars, throwing out unruly patrons. Just suppose for a moment that I decided I wasn't going to obey the law anymore, and let's throw decency out the window, as well. What would stop me from breaking down your door, and raping you? I could then take anything you owned, and oh, look, your mother walked in the door. Rape her, too. Kill your dog, and leave the both of you tied up on the floor. Maybe a bobby walks by, sees the open door, and decides to investigate. Guess what, dead cop. Are you disgusted? Good, people who do these things are disgusting animals. Now, lets say somebody even bigger and badder shows up at my house. He breaks down my door. I put several large holes through his chest and face. The police come and take a report. I like my ending much better than yours. Guns are a great equalizer. Without them, the world is in the hands of whomever has the most strong men with the sharpest sticks.
By the way, our Constitution has been misrepresented, yes that's true. It's been misrepresented as allowing firearms for the military. If you read the writings of Jefferson, Franklin and others, it's quite clear they intended us to have access to weapons as private citizens.
By the way, getting rid of guns won't work. You can't erase knowledge from the human race. Given common materials and a basic set of tools, I can fabricate a firearm in a day or so. If need be, I can make my own gunpowder.
I used to think like you. I used to believe guns were evil, nasty things. Then I played victim a few times. Never again. I carry a loaded gun with me wherever I go. I came within inches of drawing it yesterday, to stop a charging dog. Luckily, the owner arrived. See, I had my daughter with me, the most precious thing in the world to me. The dog is well known as a vicious biter of children in our neighborhood. So long as I am with her, my daughter is safe from evil people and angry dogs.
I don't ask that you own a gun, I merely wish that my human right to carry one be respected.

By the way, should you ever visit the Oregon, stop by. I'll take you shooting, so you can experience it.
See, putting holes in paper is one of my great joys.
And an olympic sport, by the way. Guns aren't just for killing. I sincerely hope to never use mine to take a life.