HERE is why i hate affirmative action the WAY IT IS

You have nothing to say? Why not? What happened then was horrible, but what should be done? You say you're owed, but by who? And why, were you a slave? I don't mean to be rude, but I find your attitude offensive.

 

what a cheap shot. are you such a lame bitch that you cant relate to the topic?

do you know that you are wrong?

 

Black people are no different from white people, other than for the color of their skin, therefore, they shouldn't be entitled to special treatment because of what happened generations ago. If we are striving for equality, affirmative action is heading in the opposite direction.

Besides, affirmative action does more to benefit the politicians than it does the people, who are merely pawns of the system. Rich, white politicians have literally used the black man for their own political gain for decades, as they continue to today.

 

maybe to annoy you

maybe cause you're a racist punk.

*mwuah*

 

dont expect missF to understand you. she wont even try. but there are plenty of dark skin people get "get it"... and that's why we are moving forwards.

i can feel it.

however, she lives in VA so

 

What are you confused about? She's taking the scholarship money because it beats paying out of pocket! She'd be a fool to turn down the money. I bet it hasn't even entered her mind that taking the money is like admitting that just 'cause she's black, she needs government help. She's thinking about the fact that it's X thousands of dollars SHE doesn't have to come up with!

Affirmative action is bullshit, and IS institutionalized racism.

Merit is all that should matter. Unless you want a shitty doctor who got to be a doctor just 'cause she was black, when really her grades didn't warrant her getting into medical school.

-Jeffrey

 

Under affirmative action, blacks often don't have to score as high on academic tests in order to place into programs and schools. Their scores are padded with freebie points.


I think we should encourage this approach with regard to training airline pilots.

Surely no one would mind if a black guy got an extra 20 points on the airline pilot exam, just for being black, and that took him from failing by 10 points to passing by 10 points. Right? Right? It's cool, he'll fly okay...



If we don't return to a merit-based system for everything, we're gonna drive this country right into the fuckin' ground, all for the sake of being "fair." :$

-Jeffrey

 

Dude, don't hold your breath waiting for fontella to come up with anything close to a logical rebuttal to your questions.

NO, she was not a slave. Born over 100 years too late.
NO, she's not owed. Who would do the OWING? Sure as fuck not ME: I never owned slaves, nor did anyone in my lineage. They came here in the early 20th century, decades after slavery was abolished. In fact, who knows, in Europe maybe some of them were slaves to somebody. Indentured servitude has been all over Europe.

We've had threads, threads and more threads about A.A. here. No one who supports it has EVER satisfactorily answered the questions about how to deal with the ambiguities of "who pays whom, and why".

-Jeffrey

 

I'm not sure where I sit on this. I like the idea of helping people (regardless of race) get somewhere they maybe need help to get to, like scholarships and things for people who can't afford to go to school. But like Interval said, passing over someone with good grades who is white for someone with bad grades who is black, that's unfair. And no, I don't think black people deserve extra just because their ancestors were MAYBE slaves. Should we start helping out the Irish because their ancestors died in the potato famine? What about people like me, whose Scottish ancestors were raped and murdered by the English? Do we get extra help too?

My point is not to be flip, but to be clear: this generation of people cannot use something that happened in a different CENTURY as a reason to get something now. Scholarships should go to people who have actually earned them AND who actually need them...black, white, green with stripes, whathaveyou.

 

Yes, you seem to lead it there...

*still biting tongue*

 

Im sorry, I am probably going to the only one sticking up for miss f
but I DONT think affirmative action is BS, sorry I really dont. (saying it is bs is just something white people whine about when they dont get what they want and see someone of a different color get it)

 

I think it's a great concept. Maybe the execution of it hasnt' been grand, but there is certainly a need.

Here in Saskatchewan for example, most of the Native people live in poverty. There is no other way for them to attend post-secondary without scholarships, there aren't enough large scholarships to pay for most of school EXCEPT for the ones that are now targeted towards Native people, and especially female Natives. I don't see the problem. Yeah, so I don't get that money. I'd rather someone who desperately needed it to get it than me, who can get student loans and raise money and have parents/family help out. I have resources, a lot of people don't.

And the whole "institutionalized racism" thing... just reflects a modicum of how racist society really is. Most Saskatchewan residents treat Natives and second class citizens. Most blame the crime rate on the Native people, without looking at the cause - the fact that we won't let most Native people escape poverty. How many well-paying jobs will hire a Native person when they could hire a caucasian with EXACTLY the same qualifications? In my experience, most hire the caucasian.

 

I think affirmative action is somewhat unfair, especially in this case, but on the other hand its necessary. There are a lot more minorities who need affirmative action because they go to shitty inner city schools,which is something they can't help. (I'm not saying this is the case for all minorites or that its not the case for whites) but just in general. They might be really smart, but if they don't have the books they need or the teachers who care to teach, they can't get far. With AA they get a chance to go to a good college and have a better education when they normally would have access too.
Racism is still very well alive, wether you choose to believe it or not. A lot of you (especially if you are white) will not understand this if you haven't seen it firsthand, or if you are not a racist yourself. White kids will always have it easier because they are automatically one step ahead because of their skin color. If a black man and a white man both show up for a job interview and the company is run by white people (and a hell of a lot are) I believe the white man would probably get first choice. Its drilled into peoples mind that a black man is dangerous, that he is lazy, that he is whatever. For hundreds of years blacks have been viewed negatively and that mind set will take along time to change.
So yes, its unfair that a couple of white kids don't get into their first choice college,but they will get accepted somewhere else. But there are so many more minorities who won't, just because of the conditions they are living in, and their chances.
Affirmative action is okay, they just need a better system.

I hope my reply to this doesn't sound ignorant. I don't claim to be completely right on this, I'm just giving my thoughts. I'm 1/2 white and 1/2 black, so I feel I can look at it from both sides. My white grandparents are pretty conservative and also don't agree with affirmative action. I've spent many nights talking to them about this and other things. I don't completely agree with them, but I do take their views into consideration.

 

Stateside there is a difference between 'Native Americans' (aka Indians) and other ethnic groups by definition/treatment/programs.

It's not a pretty picture when One looks at the unemployment/alcohol and substance abuse/crime rates on the 'Indian Nations' despite their obscene gambling/mineral revenues and other 'special' treatments which are not available to other Americans.
It's not a "fact that we won't let most Native people escape poverty."

Regardless, I don't see this Thread dealing w/Native Americans.
It appears to deal w/other races and sex.

 

I didn't touch on Native Americans. Its crazy, that is the only race (ethnic group?) that I do not know a single member of. I live in Maryland, and have yet to meet one. Its sad how a race of humans can become practically extinct. I don't know the whole deal, but I think its fucking sick what they are/have been put through. I think we would need a whole need thread dedicated to that.

 

It is crazy.
It's also a text book illustration of the folly in throwing $$$/'special' treatments at a problem...

 

well gee golly gosh, I'm sorry. I thought this thread was DEALING with affirmative action, and policies based on race. Black people aren't discriminated against very much in Saskatchewan, and we treat Native's like shit. I don't have personal experience in racism against black people, I do with racism against Natives, I was just sharing my experiences and thoughts on the topic. I didn't realize we were limited to one specific skin colour in this thread.


i'm having a grumbly bitchy day

 

There isn't much I HATE in this world, but one thing I DO HATE is when people play the race card.

"OH they OWE me this because I'm black"

"I didn't get this job because I'm BLACK"

I thought that the African American population didn't want to be segregated anymore? Then why would they want affirmative action? That's an act of segregation! Why do African Americans have a black history month? I thought they wanted to be equal? So they only want to be segregated in a postive way right?

It just doesn't make sense to me.

Personally, I think Native Americans should have supreme rights over any race, simply because they were here first and the whites came here and stole their land. If anyone should get any "special" treatment, it should be them, imho.

 

Unfortunatly we had to institute a program to keep people from discriminating due to race and as a result we now have government backed racism. Its tough being a poor white guy these days.

 

And equally as tough being a poor white woman...