so many people tell me to be more active against the government. people really bitch about it and say "the country is in such a state" gimme a good reason... seriously, though the country is far from perfect, its better than its ever been i can guess. example, the country was entirely racist a while ago, but now, seeing a black man in the street is just as common as seeing a white man. few people make a fuss about race anymore. to me, that has been one of the most pressing issues, and its pretty much solved now. 1 point to the government really. so what should they do that they haven't? there's a few things i think they should change, but there's not enough things for me to comment on how bad the country is - i think they are doing a good job wrong room - anyone move this into flyology by any chance?
people have concerns that they wish to voice at times... the government is supposed to represent the people... so it is normal for the people to speak up when they feel that they aren't "doing their job" *bites tongue*... ok... we all live in a multi racial eutopia then right????.... WRONG! ... and since when has one issue "solved" meant that all other issues get forgotten?... I really do not get the point you are trying to make here brother You really need to read more and experience more before you comment here me thinks.... sorry mate, but you really sound silly here... "Things are ok ish for me so why fuss???" Yes, you ARE in the wrong forum me thinks
I wish I lived in your world. Mine's totally different, racism is rife (as bad as its been for two generations), and the government are not at all representitive of the views of their own electorate let alone the country. Whats worse there isn't even the slightest difference between the two main political parties who are both giving out a right wing message. The country has become more right wing as a result which is going to make more and more people vote for extremist parties like the BNP. Did you know the BNP got 75,000 votes in local elections recently? As for a viable left wing party that can compete...there isnt one. Like I said I wish I lived in your world, sounds quite a nice place.
Hmm just re-read my post and I sound a little harsh towards you... please add some smiley smilies in and amongst it and please forgive me for being a grumpy arse I guess people all have a different perspective dependant on their life experiences and media they are exposed to. I don't agree with your perspective though.
There are many problems with the current government that I can see. Firstly how they blatantly spat in the face of majority opinion when they went to war in Iraq. I remember Tony Blair's speech on February 15th, 2003. I'd just got back from London, where two million people, and a good load of people from hipforums, were marching against the war. Tony Blair told us we were all wrong, and morally he had to attack Iraq. I think history has proved us right now. Other issues like the privatisation of the welfare state, the sale of council housing, Big Brother style ID cards, repressive 'anti-terror' laws, poor adherence to environmental pledges, tuition fees, top-up fees and the general presedential style of King Blair are sore points as well. You mention racial equality, which is very important, and I'm glad society has changed. But racism still exists. The fact that the BNP got 800,000 votes in the European and GLA elections is very frightening. Also the government's scapegoating of asylum seekers is nothing more than legitimised racism. It might not be acceptable to go 'Paki bashing' anymore, or maye anti-semitic remarks in public, but racism still exists. Even if it has changed its face, it still rears its ugly head. There are, therefore, many reasons to oppose the current government from a left-wing perspective, not to mention why right wing nutters may hate them. I'm certainly not going to be voting for Blair in May....
Jesikhaviolet...hmmmm well what an interesting post about this wonderful world we live in...It seems that it must be a place where the sun is always shining and everybody is nice to each other and that...Wow what a really super old place we are in.... You know then I kinda thought about it, just for a moment and not really that hard and I wondered about the institutanalised racism that invades just about every part of our culture, about the homophobia, the xenocism and the fear that is such a part of mainstream culture, the religious intolerance and the indiscrimante bombing of people for oil, the millions of people starving to death while David Beckham earns millions for kicking a piece of leather, the homelessness problem, the atrocities being commited in East Timor, China Saudi Arabia etc, and I thought about Tony Blair supporting a mad idiot in the USA against all popular support, about how money means more to people than life now, about the criminal justice bill, and then I thought you know what....I don't think this world is actually all that nice, and I thought that is why we cannot just sit around thinking how good the world/country has become...I am middle class and white so I guess things are good for me, but I am sorry that is not enough....I want it good for everyone....I don't want people being murrdered in my countrys name anymore...I want it to be the world you think it is....
well, obviously, that's why i posted - if i was entirely sure about everything being great, i wouldn't have put it up for discussion. i am young, and yes, i do need educating in this way. i do need to read and experience more, and people commenting is a way to learn. i can learn from others' experiences. but really, a lot of you have mentioned problems that are beyond the governments' hands - the racism issue. some have said that its still around. yes, of course it is, there is discrimination of everything wherever we look, but its not the job of the government to brainwash peoples' opinions. even racist people are entitled to their opinions. if the government MADE them not be racist, then people would complain about that right? the same is for all discrimination - its out of their hands - changing someone's opinion completely is hard enough, nevermind the thousands of homophobes etc out there. the iraq war thing, i agree, was awful. there's no point in me going into that, cos you probably all agree with that anyway. same goes for the "big brother like" id cards someone mentioned - i don't like that idea... it takes away quite a bit of freedom. the homelessness problem is being resolved. really. round manchester there are several places, that i've stayed at at times, that are intended for the homeless to stay at. its free, its sheltered, its warm, its secure and its comforting. the fact that beckham earns so much for doing so little - that's just the way people are paid. there is a lot of money going into sport, so its logic that he gets that money. again, out of the governments hands - its down to the businessmen of football. a ban on football would be dangerous - it would cause riots galore. i think its safer to keep it around, ignore it, and help the people who aren't earning what beckham earns. don't take this the wrong way, but i'm called naive... though i'm the one who can realise that a lot of problems are out of the government's hands. they can't be blamed for everything. there's discriminating people out there - blame the government; there's homeless people out there - blame the government; beckham earns more than he should - blame the government. its as though you need to shift the blame to someone who should sort it out. but put yourself in that position and think what you would do. think through the consequences: think what problems you'll cause to your own people, and listen to them argue about how wrong you've gone, even though you were just trying to put something right
No... obviously it is not the job of Government to control the way people think... nobody here would support going down Orwell's thought control nightmare senario... however, it is the job of government to protect its citizens from physical and mental harm... and this includes protecting citizens from rascism... but what do we see... a government that propses to give a politician the power to remove a citizen of his/her liberty... not a judge or criminal/terrorist expert... a politician... and who will be the people at the sharp end of this proposal?... undoubtedly it will be people of middle eastern heritage... just like people of irish heritage were subject to massive police and legal injustices during the 70s and 80s due to the fear of terrorism by the IRA... and let's be honest here... the proposals have to be seen in the context of what has been done by terrorist organisations... exactly how many Al-Quedda attrocities on British soil have occured?... This is a government that allows its citizens to be imprisoned by another nation without trial... it allows those citizens to be tortured because it hides behind some spurious legal definition of torture that allows sensory deprivation techniques and simulated sexual humiliation of its citizens... and remember, these techniques were not developed by our beloved american counterparts... oh no... the techniques employed in Guantanamo were initially developed in Britain during the cold war... But why has the homeless problem been allowed to develop... look back to the 80s when Thatcher encouraged the working classes to buy their council houses... no problem you think... ahh, but the stock of council housing was not replaced... instead, private enterprise moved in with the development of housing associations who were in the business of providing housing for a profit... look also at a housing market that has been allowed to develop out of control... so, even down here in Cornwall, people who are on decent wages (in comparison to the shit paid to people who work in seasonal tourist industry jobs) find it difficult to get on the housing ladder... so you can't say that homelessness is being solved when I see somebody over the road from me who has had his house reppossessed this week... But it is the job of the government to serve the interests of its citizens... they are voted into government to do that job... but the government does not put the people first... it puts itself first... hence you get fucking riduclous party politics that actually fuck up the important job of governing the country... Fly...
But it is the Governments fault... Banning racism is against free speech as you say but sometimes freedom of expression doesn't make it alright...So do you believe in Germany now that you should be allowed to rant nazi propaganda or do you believe their ban on this due to history is right??? I believe we should be educating people against the nonsense that is racism...but the Governmant is making it worse with its bullshit immigration laws, by its illegal detention of terror suspects in Belmarsh prison etc Beckham earnng all that money was not a slight on the Government but on the country as a whole, that we are prepared to allow someone to earn that much while people are dying of famine and AIDS....Sorry let me repeat that in case you didn't get the message...WE AS A SOCIETY ARE LETTING SOMEONE EARN ALL THAT MONEY WHILE PEOPLE ARE DYING OF FAMINE AND AIDS!!!! Is it me or does that seem really really fucked up!!!! The homelessness thing is not under control, there are thousands of people on the streets with no help, people die on the streets everyday and what do the Government do to really help..They do fuck all...In fact they make it harder for these people to get help, like not allowing job seekers allowance without a fixed address etc... I am sorry and this is not a slant on you in anyway but you have a very idealistic view of society......We do live in a very priviliged country and do have it better than a lot but pease do not even try to make out that we are pretty mnuch there when it comes to social problems as we are as far away as ever...and don't even get me onto free trade agreements...
not so well educated on this bit - i missed a big chunk of what was going on, and then i had to catch up, couldn't, and now it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me cos i've missed parts - its like learning about heart and liver disorders are, when you hardly know what the heart and liver are... and i suppose this is just a regional difference - up here, manchester, there are very little homeless problems. if i knew what it was like there, i would probably have a different opinion ok then, choose a situation we've got, any situation, and try and solve it - think of the consequences
To a certain extent the existing forms of racism are the fault of government. Look at the asylum issue, the government is blatantly playing to the right wing press, and into the hands of the BNP in flagging up a relatively minor issue, and whipping up popular fervour to gain support. As a result, it reinforces the idea that asylum seekers are somehow monsters who sponge off the state and steal everyone's jobs. This is a blatant lie. Also the anit-terror laws have a very racist flavour to them. One Labour MP today admitted in public that she supported them, and that they would mean more searches against Muslims and 'people of Muslim appearance'. RACISM. No the attitudes of societiey are not the government's fault, but there's plenty in national policy to bring them up on, that play into the hands of racism....
there we go - a good answer - a compromise. i agree with peace-phoenix a lot here, he's got it all right. good work dude, you've realised that although not everything is the government's fault, they have kind of reflected it and hinted a bit, and not done the best they could to prevent it. well done. i am aware of all the troubles, but i was just waiting til someone could realise that it isn't ALL the government's fault
See now you are misquoting yourself...We never ever said that it was ALL the Governments fault, we were responding to your above quote "that the Government is doing a good job". The whole issue of blame is a totally different argument..You cannot write one thing and then make a point on a different issue like you have just done above....No one is saying it is ALL the Governments fault, what we are saying in response to your above original quote is that it is a lot of their fault and NO THEY ARE NOT DOING A GOOD FUCKING JOB!!!.... You need to decide on which point you are making your statements...
Yeah... I gotta support Koolaid on this one... you've just copped out of your own thread... Go back to your original post... You never suggested that the government was to blame for "everything"... not in this opening post anyway... that would be an entirely unreasonable claim... just as unreasonable as it would be to suggest that the country was entirely racist a while ago... I would suggest that some people took umbrage with what they saw as a simple summarising of what is a complicated issue... and also with your statement that you believe they are doing a good job... particularly when people feel that the government have fucked up so spectacularly over things like the Iraq war... Fly...
It was a bit ass kissy wasn't it...he he..... If only I was super mod...The favours I could get....Peace Phoenix do you get HF groupies... *giggles*
Wanna be a groupie? Ok, it's 5 million for a kiss on the right butt cheek, 10 million for the left, I think that one captures my nicer side. Anything going anywhere near the middle is strictly out of bounds
