I started a project about five years to establish an egalitarian commune. I bought about 200 acres of land and it is owned with no mortgage. The ideas are to raise our own food (including meat) in an organic manner. It is not an anti-capitalist ideology at all, as we definitely have to establish some business to bring money in. Business possibilities are selling milk to a nearby cheese factory; running a private school or kid's camp; and running a campground-type of business for families to support a nearby tourist draw during summer months. The first few years I worked mostly on building a team of "core" people to put the plan into action. We spent a lot of time on group dynamics, having social gatherings, etc. We had about a dozen people sign up in total after having the whole idea explained and being around our group for extended periods of time (longer than a year). Four of these people we had to reject, because their expectations of the group weren't realistic or their ability was lower than necessary - one of my original rules to recruit people was "you have to put back more than you take, even if it's close". Now we have about as good a group as I think I can put together - a half dozen people or so - and have the money to build out the first phase of homes, put a well in, etc. The problem is that the goal is to be income-sharing and egalitarian in decision making, but our structure is not so much individualistic like the commune I grew up in where it was family units. We are more like a big family. We have had a series of crises recently that we've made it through ok, but we repeated a pattern that's been there the whole time - I'm the only one who takes responsibility. I work all the time trying to make this thing happen, and listen to other people complain about how their free time isn't fun enough. And I don't see anyway to fix this, to attract people who take responsibility for group goals and carry them through with some commitment. I have people who try to help with things, but when it's important and failing - it falls to me to figure out. And I have a big zero of free time to do anything, and it's been this way for years. Everyone wants to share decision-making authority. Everyone wants to share the profit activities bring. Nobody wants to work even a normal, full day to achieve that, or have the responsibility of making sure it works. I think the way to solve the reorganize it is to say it's a business (which it is - I've built a successful business that pays salaries to everyone but me - I do the planning, the sales, found the capital, etc., while the others work in the day-to-day operations) and forget about the egalitarian ideas. No one else will forgo a salary to build the thing anyway, not to any large extent (maybe a few hours a month but not more, where for me it's 10-20 a week). frustrated & hoping for advice.
Pushkin. Do not feel alone in your attempt and inability to find the spark plugs that are givers rather than takers. I was told to build it and they will come, but takers are like locusts that eat until nothing is left. I finally sold my land and moved on and am preparing to travel. It took me over 30 years to finally give it up. Sometimes we have to See that for whatever reason this Now with the people involved will not work. I was lucky enough , like you to be involved with communities back when people were willing to commit and give - without the security of "returns" - and that seems to be where the problem lies. It is extremely important when doing community to not compromise and involve takers -if you want to see any kind of manifestation that moves in a positive direction. Not that eventually you do not include them.but a recognition must be given at that point that you are ready to move on, because you Will lose most if not all of the kind of people necessary to build a community - those willing to give unstintingly of themselves. With a good foundation built by those kind of people, a community after bringing in takers can stumble along for quite a while, and slowly some of the takers may evolve into givers - those whose security is in Being that which they are - who Do without the need of compensation other than the Growth they Need to Become More. In my own process, I lived on the land and became a hermit - which leads me toward the high places of sparse populations to join with people of relatively more like-mindedness. I think that this Now points to the need for individual Growth, and those that are willing must go through the fire and be tested and become strengthened within for the times ahead. Sorry I cannot find a place within to give you more encouragement - I do think that our time will come, and that those who persevere in growing themSelfs will be needed AND will eventually be able to find like-minded who give of themselves , not for the material compensation but because of their own internal drive. Should synchronicity be right, then the ingredients come together and the leavening is there. It may well be that your efforts will be fruitful, but maybe not in the Way that you see at present. We all got a lot of Growing to Do. And That seems to be the message that keeps on showing up not matter how often we shake the ball and look for a different answer. Blessing be with you along your Way May you have the strength to continue and Grow further into your own Being. May the light of Love ever guide you - because That will not let you down - but often the Way is not what we thought it would Be. Namaste my friend (my spirit bows to your spirit)
Hi Oldwolf, Thanks for your thoughtful words. I have an obligation to the (small) group who've worked on the project for a while now. They haven't put much time in, but one helped me financially during a rough period in the formation (cumulatively a few thousand dollars). I think maybe I should take away the idea of the business side being a mutual venture (profit-sharing and consensus decision-making) and recognize it for what it in reality is - a private business that I've built. I'm thinking of that above, and just restructuring the whole thing as a business venture, with paid jobs for those who've been around a while and intend to join. I'd give them a plot of land and help them build a house, and maybe the egalitarian community would grow from that. Doing this gives me an inordinate sway in the group, but I failed in attracting "entrepreneurial" individuals to the project who would work hard to see it through. It's not that the people involved are lazy, just that they don't have much drive above the bare minimum to maintain their lifestyles. The changes wouldn't treat anybody unfairly as far as them having already done work and feeling deprived of it. That was always the idea, but (just as an example) I went seven months and had three total days of labor donated. I gave back as much in normal friendship give-and-take. Thanks again.
Pushkin, I'm in a couple groups on Facebook where you might find a few individuals looking for a similar scenario to what you're working towards there. I had actually been thinking about Russia as I had heard there was a Government program granting out land to encourage more agriculture in the region but now I'm down in Puerto Rico and we have Mangos and Coconuts and Avocado and seaweed etc etc. (Always nice to know that potential starvation isn't really an issue in a Community isn't it?)
keep on persevering my friend. no one said it would be easy. it sounds like you already have a few good core people. just stick with them, hash out your current issues and continue to grow. i mean this realistically when i say it can take a year or more to find a single reliable person.
If it's a business, then it needs to be managed like one too... If people aren't working, and doing their job, then they should be fired. I don't like hand outs, I like easy jobs, but I don't go in expecting money I haven't earned. Slam your foot down... Tell them "If you don't work, then you don't get to share the profit of those who did work." Dead weight is NOT acceptable. Starting over may take longer than just keeping the people you already have, but the day may never come when the people you have grow up and hold their own weight.
Hi All, FritzDaKatx2 said: > I had actually been thinking about Russia as > I had heard there was a Government program granting > out land to encourage more agriculture in the region Definitely not. I am in a region that borders Lithuania, which is suitable for cereals and vegetables. The growing season is short. The government was fearful that if agricultural land was privatized it would be grabbed up by foreigners and lead to resentment from the people. So it led to weird situations, like the former dairy farm I own. The land was returned to the government after the collapse of the Soviets, and I bought it at the standard price for the region (about $2,000 USD / acre - more expensive than productive farmland in the American midwest). But there is a dairy barn on the property, and it was given to the people who belonged to the farm sovyet (worker's association) at collapse of the USSR. Agriculture is very retarded in Russia compared to neighboring European countries. Driving across Lithuania, the countryside is under heavy cultivation and nearly all land is in cereals. As soon as you cross the border, the cereal is gone and at best there is hay cultivation. Such is our life. There is no infrastructure to support grain farming. There has been a big push the past few years to improve the agricultural conditions. We have the opportunity to borrow about $50,000 USD from a government sponsored investment group to buy automated milking equipment. Desos said: > it sounds like you already have a few good core people. just stick > with them, hash out your current issues and continue to grow. You are absolutely correct. I sat down with each person and talked to them over the past few days. I told them the problems that I was having, and I also realized that an issue with me was thinking failure was a possibility if we keep on the same path. It feels like an existential danger of everything going away. Everyone agreed freely to restructure as a business and accept a hierarchical organization. I think this is marx's thought too - an industrial capitalist face is necessary before the socialist revolution can proceed. There must be an economic base in place. > i mean this realistically when i say it can take a > year or more to find a single reliable person This is close to my experience, and I also find about a 50% rate for people who turn out to be not suitable. I'd like to hear more about your experiences and opinions about the comment you made. Vincent2012 said: > the day may never come when the people you > have grow up and hold their own weight. I had this experience with two of the people who didn't work out and I had to end my relationship with. Some people's sense of entitlement is incredible. That said, I am extremely loyal to people, and I still watch after and help these who didn't stay from a distance - although I don't think they realize it. It really hurt their feelings to be rejected, and in each case it wasn't so pleasant because it came from dumb things they did that caused huge problems. Thanks all!
I have traveled the whole USA and experienced a lot of communities. Every one wants to live in a place like this but very few are willing to give what it takes to make a place function. I have always got the comment that I work to hard, but I do not look at it as work. If you choose a life style you should be willing to do what ever it takes to sustain it. If I was in in Russia I would join you and make your community what it needs to be. It sounds like you have built quite an amazing place, I hope the others see this also.
Hello mntbear, I just returned from holiday. We don't have a web site set-up yet. We are hoping to buy a tractor and equipment this fall, so photographs now show tall weeds! I am interested in your thoughts on communities you visited in the USA.
Pushkin, unfortunately, that is the reality of why communes fail... people want to do the bare minimum and it falls to the few to do the extra to make that even possible. I agree that you should just make it a business and treat them as employees when it comes to the work side. If they aren't putting in equal effort, they don't deserve equal say. Meritocracy is always more fair than strict egalitarianism.
