Sativa vs. Indica still relevant?

You are completely right, PAX.
I even said ealier in this thread that todays strains are bred mainly to produce the most in the shortest period of time=$$$$$$$$ for the grower.

A concept that seems to elude some of the younger growers but they have grown up in that atmosphere of commercialization and marketing of weed to turn a profit so they don't really see it the way us old farts do.
Not bad in and of itself, but not good for variety at all.
Sometimes good things are worth waiting for.

 

ZW- you didn't really do anything wrong to that Thai that you were trying to grow. That strain is really unforgiving. Even the best of growers will have at least one or two male sacs on their plant. You have to remember that this strain is hundreds if not thousands of years old. It 's sole purpose is to carry it's genes onto the next generation. so if it feels like it is not going to get pollinated then it will self-pollinate.So even if your thumb was green it probably wouldn't have helped. LOL. It's too bad that it's such a great strain- I've heard that growers have been taking their little popcorn buds and tying them to stems and covering them in sugar and selling them as Thai Sticks.

PAX

 

This makes me drool :drool5:

http://www.hempcity.net/travelreports/11strains2003/thaisinse/index.html

 

PB, those first two photos (drool)... yup, thats what regular old Thai stick looks like...rich and beautiful...

But I remember some even more beautiful than that.

Golden/silvery/lavender colored like some exotic guilded filigree...

I heard once the Thai "pot doctors" achieved this by tying small silk bags over the buds during the final maturation...

Earlier in the thread it was mentioned that the Columbian weed we were getting must have been dry and harsh coming all the way from Colombia in a brick and what not. This was only sometimes true with the commercial varieties.
I Know for a fact that the premium golds of Mexico and south/central America were subjected to a curing process not unlike the curing of fine tobacco. It was not cut and immediately dried like everyone does today.

Yes, I believe there was a lot of weed that was left to die in the ground and that shit still looked ok, but when you got premium smoke, it did not come in a brick, it was "loose pack".
It had a lot less seeds and it had a cure that left it not brittle dry, but more leathery by virtue of the slower cure, the partial polymerization of resin makes the cell structure less hygroscopic. And makes the smoke smoooth!
Even the shake was leathery and very tasty with no harshness.

I really wish modern growers had the knowledge and would take the time to properly cure their weed.







ZW

 

My own experince and research indicates to me that you guys are close, but off the mark.

it's not some much the presence of "lower cannabiniods (CBD and CBN being most significant) as the ratio of those chemicals to THC and each other that accounts for the variation in "highs".

Thus, indicas have(had?) a higher amount of THC and CBD, but a lower ratio between them, while Sativas, due to the longer growing period, have a higher THC/CBD ratio and a significantly greater amount of CBN (remember cannabinol? it's a breakdown product if THC) even though overall THC content is lower.

Any of you guy smoked isomerized hash? (Dr. Atomic?)
It has a higher form of THC than delta 9

 

I think that grow journal that you posted gives a good indication on why alot of the strains available in the sixties and seventies are no longer being sold to the general public. Look at the amount of time that the fellow spent growing those two plants- and his harvest yielded ounces not pounds. It's just not commercially viable. Who would pay a thousand plus for an ounce??? I know I sure wouldn't.

PAX

 

Yep. Weed has been bred to yield the most in the least amount of time to realize more profits. Oh it should look pretty regardless if it's any good or not.

 

My understanding is that delta9 is pure THC. There is no higher form. It is the highest isomer.
With isomerisation, the idea is if we cause a carbon molecule to break off a lower isomer, it will rotate to the next highest isomer.
A tiny amount of strong acid is added to the extract (The acid is later
neutralized)
causing a carbon molecule to break off of a delta7, then it naturally rotates upward to the delta 8, making it a delta 9. (pure THC)

I had a buddy with an isomeriser ( the Iso II, really just a compact distilling device) who was also a pharma major.
I used to contract him to run batches of Colombian red bud to hash oil. Due to the high amount of these lower isomers present in Sativa, after rotation the amount of pure THC was actually increased!
This was only true with sativa, when we later ran some west coast indica sensi, the potency and buzz remained about the same. ( a bit cleaner though)


I really liked the high of "iso hash" as we called it. With almost no body high, it didn't even give the munchies, didn't make you sleepy at all and I swear it didn't even hardly make your eyes red, just kind of glassy and slightly puffy.

The isomeriser eventually fell out of favor when some unscrupulous fucks ran some kansas ditch weed expecting to get something for nothing.
Cries of "Iso hash is a rip-off!" echoed throughout the land, dooming the isomeriser to old stoner history...



ZW

 

I forgot about ISO machines!

 

When I was 17 I had my couple of sources save me all the stems from the pounds and personal.
After collecting the "trash" for about three months I had close to 6 ounces.
Used a crock pot as a refluxing still and made some iso oil. Crock pots are great for that, slow, low heat, invert the lid, blue ice on top so vapors condense, turn on low and leave for a few hours. Strain out the lumber and evap off the alcohol.
I ended up getting about 5-6 grams of oil, not honey oil quality but still did the trick.
My friends thought I was nuts until I sparked up a big gooey oiler joint with them, instant converts.

I still save the bud stems from my stash and when I have enough cook up a little goo. There is a lot of good stuff stuck too those stems.

 

That's pretty much Dr. Atomic's method.

Except you take the additional step of washing the oil with activated charcoal, which clears it up nicely, and up the quality quite a bit.

Used to do it in a lab with a condenser. Worked great.
---
In the last three days I have smoked 3 "indicas" and 3 'Sativas" from a weed clinic, and the difference is negligeble

 

Yeah I never did try the activated charcoal, was afraid I'd lose to much.
I did discover another trick that works ok to clean it up a bit if using isopropyl or acetone, the two I have experience with.
You make it and strain the plant matter out as usual and start to evap the solvent away.
Remember boys and girls, NO open flames.
Then when you have got about a third of the volume you started with you add about half again as much water, shake, stir vigorously, let sit a few minutes shaking from time to time. Then procede to continue to heat and evaporate. After a while you will notice that you have oil slicks forming until you end up with oil and dirty water. At this point I remove from heat and use either a pipette or paper towel to remove the water and then let the remaining oil just air for a couple of hours. Sticking it in the freezer for a bit to make the oil cold helps too keep the oil and water seperate.
Make sure to NOT let the water boil off or you just redeposit the nasty shit back into your oil.
This will remove a good bit of the chlorophyl and other water soluble elements from the oil. It works because the oil you want isn't water soluble and the solvents have a lower boiling point then water. This is also a good way to make sure all the solvent has been removed.

I have had the best luck with removing crap when I used acetone as the solvent, mainly because alcohols are hydrophylic.

Admittedly low tech, but it does help produce a less harsh final product.
So much for my kitchen lab experiments.

 

You guys need to come to California, ALL the weed is great! Green Crack, Northern Lights, White Widow, Ak-47, Blue Dream, Top Dog. I don't think we should debate which generations strains are better or more diverse, Let's just smoke weed.

 

I wish IIII WAS a shaman....well I am....or was......well WE were.......


point being, THOSE strains may be lost, but your crazy if you think that a TON of time/effort wasn't put into making some of THESE new strains. ya dig?
I think now that the strictness is dying down, and as mary-j becomes legal, we will bring the magic back....as for the fields, huts, native spirit guides, sacrifices, and other Shamanistic rituals.........that we might have to do ourselves......

oh and also,

made my f-ing night.

 

:sifone:

 

i like indica types of hash and if i smoke weed i still prefer some type of indica

 

I've heard most people take .2 gram hits and about .5 grams for oral consumption although the THC really needs to be decarboxylized (heated to convert the THC) before consuming.

 

i love them both and use each according to the effect i want to achieve.