Dextromethorphan as possible treatment for ALL addiction cravings & opioid toleranc

I posted this as a reply but I think it is important as a standalone topic. Trying to get doctors to listen to an addict is like, well, trying to get doctors to listen to an addict. Therefore I tried to make this a cogent as possible to spark some action. Even bought a godadddy at addictionawareness.net to try to make it more official. I have contacted the authors of many of these articles and received some excellent insight. Below is what I am trying to get researched about DXM. I never used it when I was actively using for withdrawl but I sure noticed effects on my addiction cravings w/o having a physical dependence. Trying to get the research community to get off their asses and research this....could help a lot of good people immediately. I want these medical jackasses fighting with each other to figure this out because I am tired of burying friends. There is NOTHING to lose.

Previous Message:
Members of the medical community in Taiwan, England, Holland, Australia and elsewhere are working separately on Dextromethorphan as a possible treatment for general addiction but it seems that no one is talking to each other and addiction is a deadly disease that cannot wait. It is even being used in pre and post-operative pediatric surgery to reduce morphine consumption. The summary of gathered and observed anecdotal information is as follows.

The world medical community is working on a possible treatment for general addiction and other compulsive disorders but it looks as if it will first be used for opiate dependency. After detox and a good 30-90 day treatment program, Dextromethorphan (ALSO A BADLY ABUSED DANGEROUS DRUG!!!) has been shown in some addicts, and rodents, to nearly completely eliminate addiction cravings and thoughts. This phenomenon is so pronounced that it was even noticed in a patient receiving spinal epidural injections in which his drug of choice, Dilaudid, was medically administered nine times. Dosing was 30mg 3X/day for a 3-5day saturation period then 30mg 1X/day PRN. The working hypothesis is that Dextromethorphan acts as a partial-agonist to the MU opioid receptor.

I am reporting all of this because I am extremely frustrated by the slow pace of the medical community and I am tired of seeing ruined lives. The only thing less responsible than releasing this information before the full research process is complete would be allowing people to continue to suffer in the throes of addiction any longer than necessary. My hope is that as many people as possible study this at the same time and pursue it like it were a possible cure for cancer. DXM is available OTC for $5, has been around since the 1950's and is FDA approved....I see no reason for any delay other than the stigma of addiction making it not a priority.

Please don't do anything without talking to your Dr. and please don't mess up any sobriety with an experimental use for a drug that has its own abuse potential. I simply wanted to make this information as available as possible. I have attached relevant studies below and please message me for any more information.

http://oto.sagepub.com/content/131/5/711.abstract - Oral Dextromethorphan Reduces Perioperative Analgesic Administration in Children Undergoing Tympanomastoid Surgery

http://www.anesthesia-analgesia.org/content/89/3/748.short - The Preoperative Administration of Intravenous Dextromethorphan Reduces Postoperative Morphine Consumption

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3430027/ - Effects of DXM on reducing methadone dosage in opium addicts

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15655510 - Dextromethorphan differentially affects opioid antinociception in rats

 

FYI - The opinion of a top addictionologist in Florida. This is possible kids, still getting drunk/high while cutting tolerance and slashing addiction rates is a real possiblity!

Off-the-Cuff Medical Opinion:
Very interesting and cool data. Since DXM is such a common abuse med for our patients it also holds potential for abuse which makes it difficult to know the best approach in the chemically dependent patient………similar to the ketamine data in refractory depression in regards to ketamine’s abuse potential. Your anecdotal data is really impressive in regards both to the smoking cessation as well as to the morphine induced craving reduction. Would seem to have amazing potential in the alcoholic/addict in a pre-op situation where you know they will have opiate exposure. Keep me in the loop.

 

Nah....

If it turns out to cure addiction, we would stop putting it in cough syrup, the DEA would say that it's too dangerous to use in that way because not enough research has been done, and furthermore, that not enough research has been done to prove that research into doing research on researching it is safe, and therefore, nobody can have it at all. Besides, think of the kids, and about the kind of message that this sends about drugs.... that it's okay to do drugs because you are addicted to drugs!!!!@!

Or at least, they'd make it so you can only get tiny doses without killing your liver.

Besides, the DEA has said that DXM is dangerous because kids abuse it, when in fact, perfectly safe effective cough treatment is available with little risk of dependence with hyrdocodone syrup preperations. Using DXM to quit opiates when what you need is more opiates is like trying to cure the cure

 

Yeah, don't know what would happen but you know the government would jump in somehow. You know someone would try to make a bunch of money off of it....even though it is dirt cheap and available at any gas station.

Do you know if it helps with withdrawl? If so, I wish I had known that last year when I detoxed for the first time after 7yrs of addiction. They used phenobarbital and it sucked!

 

Gabapentin works for me.

 

I heard about this. I've tried Neurontin but felt basically nothing. So I'm not one to say how it is for withdrawal symptoms.

I also heard about a drug called Kratom being used, but I believe that has the potential for addiction as well.

Glad to say that I have not had to deal with any addiction to opiates as I've steered myself clear of them. I've had enough problems with others drugs.

 

Gabapentin is not something I have had any experience with but I know it has known uses for certain types of pain and epilepsy. I am glad something gives you relief.

 

I don't know, never had an opioid dependance and don't plan on starting one.

I've heard for years, especially on this site, that it does help, though I have a feeling that it may also have to do with it's dissaciociative/analgesic effects. And I've heard gabapenten. And a bunch of other things.

I think there's a lot of things that could probably make W/D a speedbump instead of a brick wall for many people, but most people do not read up and stock up and plan and prepare and then kick the shit, most people just want another fix and only want to try to get through W/D until their check clears or whatever.

And even those who really want to quit, most are not in a position to get togehter the stuff or read about the stuff, they're trying to cop dope on credit instead of using the internet.

That's the feeling I get, anyways.

But yeah, I think that from ibogaine to DXM, the tools are all out there, a nationwide set of free detox clinics could be set up along with needle exchanges and really do some good, but ibogaine is schedule 1, and if a huge thing started with addicts actually cured by doctors with off-label DXM and gabapenten and shit, there would be a bunch of DEA inquests and they'd throw a bitch fit about it not being approved for use for those applications or in those doses or something.....

Sad, but we have a government in the business of punishing people for not having a way out of the drugs that the other arm of our government sells them.... they're not in a hurry to ACTUALLY help people. Cause I'm pretty sure that if I got a chunk of money and immunity from assenine US drug law, I could start doc roor's WD clinic, and get people clean with a fraction of the pain they typically go through, and with much better results than typically happen in the US.

 

I agree. Fear of WD was a brickwall for me and kept me from detoxing for the entire 7yrs of my addiction/chronic pain.

As far as disassociative/analgesic effects, this is another effect that I experienced when I was using it and it massively helped my chronic pain and depression. I even spent two weeks providing about 60hrs of data, including dosing information, to the author of the hypothesis below who was already studying DXM for use as a rapid-antidepressant. I used it to successfully self medicate my depression after college, 10yrs ago for two years. I don't take it anymore but it seems that the effect is permanent. I just felt like I didn't need it anymore and that was that.

In addition to the rapid-antidepressant, it is being studied to treat Parkinson's dyskinesia, MS, bipolar and many other diseases. They seem to get big resarch money in the West (US and UK). The work on DXM and addiction/medical morphine and methadone reduction seems to be mainly centered in Asia.

Thank you very much for all of your information thoughts, I am so sick of people going to jail and dying that I will happily make a fool out of myself for what could help some people. Plus, if it did spark a viable treatment for addiction, it would be nice to quit counting my 398 days of "clean time" and go out for a damn beer again!.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21367535 - DXM as potential rapid-antidepressant

 

Well, it does provide some relief for neuropathy. I'm prescribed 1200mg per day for that purpose. But I meant for wd's. At 2600-3200mg per day it almost eliminates wd symptoms. At least for me. It's not 100%, no, but close. Much better than Loperamide. But you have to have a prescription, that's the down side, or you really need to know someone personally who gets it. You won't find it on the street. Gabapentin is addictive in itself though, but when I'm finished using it for wd's I just go back to 1200mg per day again. There is still some diarrhea and mild cravings, but Imodium takes care of that. But there's no insomnia or RLS or basically feeling afraid you're going to die one minute and afraid you're going to survive the next minute. The Gabapentin itself knocks you for a loop, but it's manageable. You can get around and do things normally, you just feel kind of spaced out. Not like opiate withdrawal, which pretty much plows you under.

 

Amazing what these OTC drugs can have multiple use for. Actually, it is more amazing what the human body does with them. And yes, opiate withdrawl plow you under then feels like you are being hit with a taser!

As far as DXM, I found that a researcher at Cheng Kung University in Hong Kong has already filed a patent application and is successfully testing on rodents. I REALLY hope it works for more than just bipolar but even if it is only bipolar substance "abusers", we are still talking 6.9 million Americans.

http://www.google.com/patents/US20110281904 - Use of Dextromethorphan in Treating Addictive Behavior or Bipolar Disorder