Don't be fooled by Obama...

i don't think anyone is forcing catholic run food banks and shelters to hand out birth control... the bill was going to force the health plans of catholic institutions to cover the cost of birth control, was it not? just want to make sure we're talking about the same thing.

 

Yeah, but those companies do have some paid employees, who, if they provided healthcare, would have to provide birth control. It's not fair.

 

i guess we should stop debating then, because we're on the same page but just have different opinions on what is fair in that situation. agree to disagree, I guess?

 

The federal government shouldn't even be in healthcare IMO.

 

I read this and laughed out loud. Ron Paul says he'll do all theses things, but hasn't past presidents said similar and other things just to get elected, then make it to office and give the people a big ol' 'fuck you' on most of the things they got elected under the presumption that they'd do?

Sorry, but use your common sense for once, I feel like it's 2008 again and everyone's like VOTE FOR OBAMA! He's gonna do all this great shit and blah blah. He did surprisingly well (imo) considering the amount of bullshit that was left for him to clean up. That saying on some of your points, if you don't want people 'watching you', simply don't do anything stupid that would get you into trouble, so many people are going to be supportive of that law and there's nothing you can do about it. Also, Catholics being 'forced' to preform abortions? Sorry, but if you don't wanna preform abortions, don't become a fucking doctor. No pity for people who don't use their common sense, not saying that I use common sense 24/7, but come on folks seriously. Everyone is going to fuck up, everyone is going to go against things they said that they were going to do, and nobody is going to be completely 100% happy 100% of the time...

 

:2thumbsup: Sounds like a plan. But just let me say that as a women who's been on the pill, I don't think anyone, anywhere should take it. It's terrible for you.

:iagree: They should stay the hell out of our lives is what they should do. But they have their head so far up their asses that every time they can play texas hold em with their esophagus

 

And what of women, such as myself, who have ovarian and uterine diseases that cannot be cured but can be made more comfortable from the hormones in birth control because you cannot produce your own hormones? I am not sexually active but I take birth control, without it I am extremely uncomfortable and feel excess pain that I shouldn't be feeling, and without it I get my period once every 8-14 months which is also very uncomfortable and can cause cancer.

I disagree. Without the government (state, not federal) I would not be able to afford the doctors that I need to see or take the medication that I need to take. Perhaps if you were in the same boat as some others, you could open your mind as to why it's good for some government involvement, to say the least.

 

I'm sorry, I didn't mean to offend anyone.
I have PCOS, which is also an ovarian problem, which causes ovarian cysts, decreases ability to get pregnant and can cause cancer. I know, it sucks. I got my period every week. But, I did find, and most women can if they're willing to try, a natural supplement I can take, which is awesome, and my healthcare pays for it.

And I believe that while christian institutions shouldn't always have to pay for the pill, I think that maybe they should have a program where if someone needs it for medical reasons it can be repealed just for that person, you know? That way they aren't paying for someone to be sexual active.

 

That's awesome if YOUR healthcare pays for it, but I'm also saying that MY healthcare is provided by the government, not everyone is so lucky to have private health care or even any health care at all. For the moment I live with my parents, neither of them have healthcare to pass on to us, so you just consider yourself lucky, I'm sure if you lose your health care you would be looking for some way to get some kind of help, and you'd be pretty damn upset if every avenue for healthcare was closed to you and the government told you to fuck off, not my problem, because you told us to stop meddling. That would be quite unfortunate for a loooot of people.

 

I don't think you're aware of Ron Paul's record at all. He's been saying the same stuff since the 80's, has stuck to his principles when voting in Congress every time (even when all his peers went the other way), and has made predictions that have all come true (9/11, housing crisis, and many others I can't even think of because the list's too long). He's a Libertarian running as a Republican, and if he was running for President to simply gain power, the media wouldn't be censoring him and the primaries wouldn't be getting rigged against him.

Obama is a puppet, and a very evil one at that. Assassinating U.S. citizens with drones, including teenagers. (He sympathizes with Trayvon, but has no remorse for killing Awlaki's innocent 16-year-old son?) Signing the NDAA 2012 (ask the senators, and they'll say he actually pushed for the line about indefinite detention of U.S. citizens). Continuing to expand the American empire, pushing war propaganda, and starting illegal wars undeclared by Congress at the expense of people's lives. Increasing funding for the drug war, raiding dispensaries and employing fear tactics on states considering medical legalization. Expanding the TSA. Racking up the national debt more than any other president. Allowing Bernanke to thrive. I'm sure there's more, but those are the biggest ones off the top of my head.

Obama didn't "clean up" anything. That's a complete misconception that's been going around for a while, mainly from people who haven't done the research. He picked up where Bush left off, and pushed things to the next level.

 

I'm not saying the Government shouldn't provide it. Not at all. I'm just saying that I don't think christian businesses should have to.
But yes, I don't think we should have Government run healthcare. It'd be a disaster because the government is corrupt. Insanely so. Maybe state healthcare would work, or something, I don't know, but the thought of the president controlling everyone's health care scares the shit out of me, doesn't it you?

Also, when I said that I didn't think women should be on it, I meant that because when I was on it, it made violent sick. So much so that I ended up in the hospital.

 

I think some government control is necessary. No, the thought of the government controlling my health care does not scare me in the least bit. What scares me is not having any health care, at all. And yes, I do think christian business should have to, you don't see other religiously-run businesses or businesses with a religious leader/purpose pitching a fit, do you? As a born and raised catholic, I think these people are being stupid. If you don't want to provide birth control for women, especially those who need it, then quit your business or stop providing health care for everyone.

 

health care here is provincially run, funded partially from the federal government. works pretty well, allows each province to budget differently depending on their needs. it could definitely be improved but it works much better than the system in the US. that said, our government seems to be (slightly) less corrupt here.

 

That's not totally true. It's not just catholics, all christians and Jews are. Plus, it's not just birth control they have to provide, it's surgical sterilizations and abortion-inducing drugs.

Government run health care would be fine, if the Government wasn't a corrupt piece of shit. :2thumbsup:

 

Like our government is the worst, loool.

And yes, provide everything for everyone or don't provide anything at all, fair is fair.

 

I really think everyone should realize that it's not a dictatorship where a president can pass any laws he chooses. It's a government made up of several factions. As of now the presidential election has been a sham, it's now "choose a lesser evil". I think people as of right now want nothing but a small government that they can depend on, something that has credibility. Our current government has lost much of it's validity as a reputable form of power. It's been overrun by lobbyists who cater to the rich, why? Because every politician cares about staying in their position of power, they need money for campaigns, the campaigns are then funded by corporations; under circumstances. If said politician get's elected he shall do what is in the favor of the corporation. That is the problem with government, nobody would be up in arms if the government had actually worked for the people rather than give them the finger while they profit and we get crumbs. It's not about socialism, it's about a fair society. The one we are living in right now is far from fair, the unemployment has risen but people are saying "it's getting better"... that's mainly because it has risen so much that every indication of suppression is being looked at as "fantastic". We're still fucked, we are still fueling an oil war. We are living like kings, people will gladly enjoy it as long as they are the ones that aren't being fucked up the ass. Truth is truth and that is, we are reaping the benefits at the expense of others oppression. We want a world that is fair, it might be a big demand but we should accept no less.

 

tl;dr

 

Government needs reform, it's representing the wrong people. President can't do much with a department that is heavily funded by corporations and working in favor of corporations. :afro:

Oh yea, & government needs to stay out of our business. Things like phone tapping, internet data retrieval = violation of the 1st & 4th amendment. Things like "Terrorism" is fucking made up, maybe if we weren't overseas killing them since the 50s they would have left us alone. Where do these crazy radicals get weapons?! We fucking sell them

 

Really, just accept it and move on, they're always going to find a way around the constitution, always. Honestly, maybe I'm lax about the fact that I don't care, but I also don't have anything to worry about because I'm not up to things that I shouldn't be doing.

 

The founding fathers came here to liberate themselves of oppressive governments, yet we become the largest of them all in the end. Oh, who cares, might as well just live by it right?