ewww....

PriceCheck · Dec 11, 2004

Pus, no pus...it's still mucous. That's something I only share with a select few human beings, and well....I like cows and everything....just not in that way...

Strawberry_Fields_Fo · Dec 11, 2004

lucyinthesky said:

We are the only ones who drink the milk of another animal, something about that seems wrong. The fact that people frown in disgust at drinking human milk, yet turn around and drink milk from a COW which is ALSO high in fat, pus and a bunch of other gross cowish stuff, is so hypocritical and wrong, in my opinion. This whole pus thing i never got from peta anyways, and i don't care whether it can hurt me or not. Eating my own zittie pus won't hurt me either, but im not about to suckle on my, or anyone elses ruptured zits, or lap at someones stab wound and naturally, I'm sure no one else would either. Then again, i'd be more likely to suck up my own pus, than that of a cow. And the fact that there is bacteria in a cow's milk that's so dangerous to humans that it has to be removed i think does all but disprove that a cow's milk is NOT intended for human consumption.

Why put all this insane amount of money and time into pasturizing, filtering, hormoning, pumping and drinking gross gross COW'S milk, when you can just make soy milk, which is WAY healthier, and no pus. YAY no pus. woohoo soy milk.
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Yes, we are the only animal that drinks milk from another animal. We are also the only animal that drinks soda, alcohol, tea, coffee, and Gatorade....So what's your point? And we are the only animal that can do algebra (let alone invent the concept of mathematics), build things out of concrete, write books, elect leaders, record history, invent things to make our lives easier, and we are the only animal to perform operations to save our fellow creature's lives. Human beings are different from other animals in alot of ways. It does not make us "unnatural".

And even if it did, you can't use naturalism as an excuse when attempting to persuade others not to do something; I can name a million things you do on a daily basis that are "unnatural" (including wearing clothes, wearing pads/tampons during your period, taking any kind of industrialized medicine, brushing your teeth, etc.)

If you don't want to drink milk, then don't drink it! There you go, problem solved! Contrary to what you may be thinking about me, I actually don't care what you injest or don't injest. My original post was in response to the rediculous scare tactics used by the original poster. There is NO "PUS" in COWS MILK! What they are calling "pus" is actually white blood cells--perfectly normal.

You cannot compare drinking pasteurized milk to licking your friends wound or sucking on a zit. The type of white blood cell found in the pus of a zit or on a wound is completely different than the type found in milk, and once it is pasteurized there are no harmful bacteria.

As a side note about the bacteria--There are actually a number of healthy, necessary bacteria found in dairy products, particularly yogurt and cheese. These beneficial bacteria aid in digestion. And to say that because we need to sterilize it is proof that we are not meant to eat it is rediculous--all food should be cleaned before it is eaten. Do you not wash or cook your vegetables before you eat them?

Of course human milk is best (and of course I advocate this for babies and toddlers) but to suggest that we drink human milk our entire lives is impracticle: What do you want me to do, go up to a lactating mother and say, "Excuse me, m'am, could you pump me out some of that milk?" Human milk and cows milk don't even taste the same--human milk is sweeter and has a higher fat content. Yes, cows milk has fat too, but buying skim milk solves this problem. You cannot deny that cows milk has no nutritional benefits--it serves as an excellent source of calcium and vitamin D, and drinking one glass of milk is the equivalant to drinking one glass of water, in terms of hydration.

And don't pretend soymilk is always an alternative to cows milk--some of us can't STAND the taste of soymilk, it doesn't even taste like milk to me. Like I said, if you're happy drinking soymilk, then FINE. But I'm happy with my organic cows milk (which is not treated with hormones), so why don't we leave the scare-tactics out of this.

Claire · Dec 12, 2004

Strawberry_Fields_Fo said:

My original post was in response to the rediculous scare tactics used by the original poster.
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it.was't.ridiculous...or.a.scare.tactic....it.is.a.fact.that.i.thought.i.would.share.with.other.vegetarians

Paratuberculosis and Crohn's Disease(Abridged)

by Michael Greger, MD

This is an abridged version of Dr. Greger’s full article, which includes references.

Often touted as the Pulitzer Prize of alternative journalism, a Project Censored Award was given to what was considered one of the most censored stories of 1999— the connection between Crohn’s disease and paratuberculosis bacteria in milk.

Described as a human scourge, over a half million Americans suffer from this devastating, lifelong condition with annual US medical costs in the billions. The director of the National Association for Colitis and Crohn’s Disease says the best way to describe the disease to nonsufferers is to have them think of the worst stomach flu they ever had and then try to imagine living with that every day. Since the 1940s, there has been a rapid increase in the incidence of Crohn’s disease in the US and around the world, especially among people in their teens and early twenties.

The US has the highest rate of Crohn’s ever recorded. The US also has the worst epidemic of a similar disease among cattle, called Johne’s disease, known to be caused by a bacteria called Mycobacterium paratuberculosis (MAP). There is now growing clinical, epidemiological, immunological, experimental, and DNA evidence that this bacteria is the cause of Crohn’s in people who drink milk from infected cows. Since transmission of this bacteria is facilitated by its presence inside pus cells, American milk drinkers may be at particularly high risk since the US has the highest permitted upper limit of milk pus cell concentration in the world—almost twice the international standard of allowable pus. By US federal law, Grade A milk is allowed to have over a drop of pus per glass of milk.

According to the USDA’s latest figures, there are now three quarters of a million cattle infected with paraTB in the US. Between 20 and 40% of US dairy herds have already become infected with paratuberculosis, and the infection rate is expected to reach 100%. Intensive, modern farming practices—grazing bigger and bigger numbers of cattle on smaller and smaller plots of land—are blamed for the rapid spread of this disease.

Until 1998, controversy surrounded paraTB’s ability to survive pasteurization. That year, however, researchers in Ireland grew live paratuberculosis bacteria out of 6 of the 31 cartons of retail pasteurized milk they tested— almost 1 in 5. This caused a national food scare. Dairy industry experts described it as a “significant blow to the industry.” Crisis management specialists called the ramifications “enormous,” “horrific.” Despite headlines splashed throughout Europe, not a word crossed the Atlantic, reminiscent of the media blackout in the US in the early years of the mad cow disease crisis.

The industry and/or government know what kind of time bomb they’re sitting on. According to one industry expert, the incrimination of MAP in human disease would cause enormous economic damage to animal agriculture industries. An article in MILK SCIENCE INTERNATIONAL entitled “Is Mycobacterium paratuberculosis a possible agent in Crohn’s Disease?” warns that “the present state of knowledge is…potentially catastrophic for the dairy industry should existing information be used in a sensationalist manner.”

This conspiracy of silence extends beyond the producers to encompass the entire industry to the point of interfering with scientific dialogue. From the JOURNAL OF DAIRY SCIENCE: “Fear of consumer reaction…can impede rational open discussion of scientific studies.” Rodrick Chiodini was a microbiologist at Brown University’s Rhode Island Hospital when he became the first researcher to show the presence of paratuberculosis bacteria in the gut walls of children with Crohn’s disease. He writes, “the dairy and regulatory industries are concerned vocally…but their concern is limited to the possibility of ‘bad press’ to the industry rather than a concern for the truth or public health.”

Last year, the USDA’s United States Animal Health Association (USAHA) rejected a proposal by a Crohn’s patient advocacy group to test retail dairy products in the US because they were concerned about “the usage of this information.” The USAHA statement reveals the gamble the industry is willing to take. In Britain, when asked what the industry planned to do about paratuberculosis, spokespersons said that it was “something that bears watching” but that they “preferred to defer action” until paraTB is proven to cause disease in humans. This sounded all too familiar to the British public after the mad cow debacle, where the beef industry made the same wager—and lost.

Despite the fact that paratuberculosis is now a known human pathogen, it continues to be tolerated in our food supply. After finding of MAP in their retail milk supply, the Food Safety Authority of Ireland now requires that cattle infected with Johne’s be excluded from the food supply. The flesh from an infected cow is no longer considered fit for human consumption and her milk is simply dumped. Karen Meyer, co-founder of the Paratuberculosis Awareness & Research Association, commented, “The government of Ireland is to be commended for exercising the precautionary principle. Instead of trying to sweep the problem under the rug, they acted swiftly to give human health priority over special interests.”

John Hermon-Taylor, chairman of the surgery department at St. George’s Medical School in London, is an internationally known expert on Crohn’s and paratuberculosis. In his view, “There is overwhelming evidence that we are sitting on a public health disaster of tragic proportions.” Europe’s Scientific Committee on Animal Health and Animal Welfare, however, concluded that the currently available evidence was insufficient to confirm or disprove the theory. This uncertainty should not impede the government from taking concrete steps to prevent further potential human catastrophe. If the British government had acknowledged the precautionary principle over mad cow disease, millions of lives may have been saved. A headline in THE TIMES sums up an inquiry into the mishandling of the mad cow affair released this year in Britain: “Lack of Proof Led to Disaster.”

Every few hours, another child in this country is diagnosed with Crohn’s disease and may be condemned to a life of chronic suffering. The balance of evidence strongly suggests a causative link between MAP and Crohn’s disease. This public health issue has been at the periphery of the dairy industry’s agenda for years, a nagging concern on the back burner. The consumer movement needs to move it to the front burner and turn up the heat.
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http://www.notmilk.com/lawbreakers.html ...there's.more.if.you.like?

loveflower · Dec 12, 2004

ooh ive been to notmilk.com before

its a good but gross site

PriceCheck · Dec 12, 2004

I'm on the veganly side of this issue but I wanted to say that Dr. whatshislips of notmilk.com seems to be a psycho-nutter. In some of his articles he starts ranting about how all vegans should be pro-lifers, the evils of cocoa, conspiracies to cover up cheese related fatalities, etc.

I haven't been to the site in quite a while so I don't know if everything is still there.

Claire · Dec 13, 2004

PriceCheck said:

I'm on the veganly side of this issue but I wanted to say that Dr. whatshislips of notmilk.com seems to be a psycho-nutter. In some of his articles he starts ranting about how all vegans should be pro-lifers, the evils of cocoa, conspiracies to cover up cheese related fatalities, etc.
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eeek!...hmmm.something.to.take.into.considertion.when.reading.his.views.then...thanks.for.the.info ...it's.an.interesting.issue.thats.for.sure

amberfilter · Dec 13, 2004

Reply to Giant picture of couple about a page back......

Oh My God Its Nancy Mckeon!!!!!!
(from The Facts of Life)

MountainGirlie · Dec 16, 2004

Store bought chocolate milk is the worst. It has the most amount of pus and BLOOD in it so...they dye it brown. Never will I ever drink that. SOY MILK WOO

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ewww....

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