Did the Tea Party takeover/ruin libertarianism?

My dear Indie, it would have been the honest and appropriate thing to apologise but I never expected you would.

But is it a false or inaccurate summation of your viewpoint - as I’ve explained at length I don’t think it is and I notice you are not disputing my arguments but just once again evading addressing what has been posted.

 

Balbus:

Perhaps if you were to put as much effort towards presenting a valid argument instead of attempting to debase your opponent you might begin to achieve the answers you claim to be looking for.

Personally, I find you unworthy of attempting to have a meaningful conversation with, and more so an example of a troll ignoring the topics of each thread you post in.

 

Indie

Yet more evasion and yet another old tactic of yours.

Claiming that a criticism isn’t valid is not the same as addressing (let alone refuting) that criticism it is just an indication that you can’t address or refute that criticism so you are just going to say it isn’t valid.

If you really honestly and truthfully thought my arguments were not valid I’m sure you would take great relish in explaining why they are not valid. The lack of any counter argument makes it abundantly clear you have none.

Which once more makes me wonder why you hold onto ideas you can’t defend?

 

Disaster

So let’s see –

What is ‘limited government’ I mean shouldn’t good governance be what people should aim for.

What ‘liberty’ are you talking about?

How is America ‘exceptional’?

 

What Reagan said may have been true to some extent. Should we act upon what he spoke of? It depends. When you advocate doing away with government programs, you must show how these programs will be replaced with private programs and how the economic situation will improve under such a scenario. I feel (felt) that Reagan and other 'conservatives' fail(ed) to do this. Whenever people hear the words 'free market', they get scared as they fear the days of the robber barons, company towns, the situations that Charles Dickens wrote of in 19th century England, and so forth. This is not what the free market was all about.

To answer your question, though, I think it's important to show how one individual was enlightened, but it's also important to show how that same individual was shortsighted.

 

thespeez:

I was speaking of Federal government programs, and you need to recognize the fact that the source of funding all Federal mandated programs comes from the States, who are also the intended recipients of the revenues collected.

The U.S.A. is NOT a single society, but many societies within each of the 50 individual States. Central planning and control over such a large and diverse population cannot be done efficiently and rationally and leads to much waste and corruption.

As originally intended by the Constitution, States would be responsible for collecting taxes from those who reside in their States, and the Federal governments budget would be apportioned and funded by the States relative to their population proportion. The Federal governments responsibility primarily being to protect the Nation as a whole, and the State governments having responsibility for the citizens who reside within their borders. Federal laws could be passed to assure that States treated both their own citizens and citizens of other States equally and fairly leaving the States and their citizens the freedom to decide how to comply with Federal law.

What I'm saying is that Federal programs should be eliminated and made a responsibility of the States to continue if they feel they are necessary, and the private sector should be left free to assist where they will. The Federal involvement should extend ONLY to the point of laws and not funding as it has no funds of its own. The funding it provides must first be taken from those who are to receive it, and the Federal government taxes future generations by borrowing additional money in order to give back more than it took in to fund the social programs it has created. This only promotes continued irrational, and unsustainable, deficit spending.

The words "free market" are soothing to hear and something we should be striving to achieve. What we have been experiencing for nearly 100 years now is a Federal government micro managed economy which has brought us nothing but economic chaos, and near the brink of total economic collapse.

I personally think it is most important that we take a close look at where we're heading and begin to make rational economic decisions which will result in turning us around regardless of WHO said what. Concentrate on the problem and its causes are many, but most important is finding and implementing the correct solution, regardless of WHO caused it.

 

It must be complicated to understand that if you tax the rich and business they take the business where the taxes are not consuming all the their money. When the business goes so do the jobs. Now when the gov contiues to TAKES half of what I work hard for, I LEAVE with the money and your job. This class warfare bullshit is pushed by lazy excuse making parasites that think they are entitled to my earnings. Oh, here's an idea, STOP TAXING US ALL TO DEATH!! Just come try and take my earnings and see what happens, suprise you lose again!
Stop crying and put your big boy pants on and go start a business, make as much money as you want, and enjoy it! Working hard on the right things has repeatedly proven to be a more effective approach to wealth, especially when compared to reaching for gov support. Silly wabbits, welfare is for lazy people.
Now I know some folks fall on hard times due to things out of their control but THAT'S LIFE! I have been there myself and I myself got out the hole without the aid of others. It meant doing things I didn't want to do like adjust to live within my means, and then work on my means if I wanted a higher standard of living.
If you support redistribution of wealth, free health care (thats my favorite one, ITS NOT FREE MORON!!) and all the rest of this leftist socialism, marxism, communisim shit, then LEAVE, GET THE HELL OUT OF AMERICA!!!! Why don't you go live in that crap elswhere? I'll buy you the one way ticket. The cost of taking ones freedom will be your life.

 

6

WOW what a lot of pent up anger you have.

But although there is a lot of shouting there’s not much of substance I mean you haven’t presented counter arguments to what has been said just told it that its wrong.

Please calm down and actually present some rational and reasoned argument.

*

There are two things here.

1 - If you are a residence of somewhere and wish to make you country a better place for yourself and everyone else then if you can isn’t it better to stay than leave. This would be like telling the founding fathers that since they didn’t like British rule then they should have just got THE HELL OUT OF THE COLONIES.

2 – It assumes that the US is in some way superior to other countries, when many people would disagree (and have done in this forum).