Dakota's mom, could you help me out?

Sorry to involve you in this, but Pavel (BraveSirRubin) is convinced that mothers of adopted children cannot possibly love their children the same way as biological ones. To quote him, "You cannot love another baby as you love your own....
when you give it birth, such a conection forms that no other can be as strong."




I then used you as an example, and he said, "It is inferior to the love she would have felt towards a child she would give birth to. she would not answer honestly... it would seem evil for her to admit that she loves her own kids more."

Sorry for dragging you into this, but I do feel strongly about it, and since you have more experience than I do, I thought I'd ask for your opinion.

 

What a load! I am not Kathi (Dakota's Mom,) but how a child came into this world is not as important as how he or she is loved and cared for.

JMO.

 

How could you possibly know how I feel about my children. I have given birth to five children and I adopted one. My children are my children. No matter how they came to be my children. I love my youngest son as much as my older children. With my bio kids I went through nine months of pregnancy and incredibly long labors. During this time I was able to bond with them, love them as they grew inside me. With Dakota, I went through three years of adoption hell. I lost two referrals during the process. Don't even try to tell me that those to losses were any less than a miscarriage. These were MY children and I lost them. The pain is every bit as intense. When they put Dakota in my arms the tears of joy were real. The longing from all those years was finally fulfilled. The love that had been growing all that time finally had a focus. For months I carried his picture everywhere I went. This is my son. I don't care how our children come into our lives, adoption or birth, our children are our children. How can you say I couldn't possibly love Dakota as much as I do "my own kids" he is my own kid.

Wait until you have felt the love of a child before you make such judgements. His little sloppy snot covered kisses are so precious to me. When people ask my many children I have, I don't generally say I have 5 bio and 1 adopted, I say I have 6 kids. Six wonderful precious and totally MY OWN kids.

Kathi

 

((((((((Kathi)))))))))

Even your user name reflects how much you love that sweet little punkin. I can't belveive people, who don't even have any idea what being a parent is about, like Robin, could be so insensitive.

Mamas are mamas, whether that baby was birthed out of your body, or handed to you after an ordeal, often more tenuous than pregnancy itself.

 

Blood is not thicker than water, when "water" is a metaphor for LOVE!

i'm not adopted, nor have i adopted a child (though i certainly would love to, at least once, if money were no object), but my grandfather was adopted (and boy, did they do things differently back then!). When asked (like for the infamous family tree project in junior high), his adopted parents are the ones whose names are listed, and their heritage is mine. So some genetic features (namely, red hair) came from those people...that certainly doesn't make them my family, and i wouldn't call myself Irish simply because i look like them. That's my opinion on the whole thing.

I would think that if anything, the bond between an adopted child and his/her parents would be stronger (if not simply different, but certainly not less) than that of a bio-family. The adoption process is nothing short of difficult, costly, and exhausing--anyone who is willing to put themselves through that (especially people who are physically able to have their "own" children!) is by definition a good parent, and one who has more love to give than most. And how great must it feel to be that adopted child--like, my mom loved me so much, she worked for years to get me! And to think, most children are "surprises."

 

If I addopted a baby Id live it just the same as my son...because it is a precious being.

 

Bear and I have considered Fostering a baby or young child. But Bear said the bond he and, especially I would have would be so strong that it would kill us (well, me) when or if they ever had to re-foster the child somewhere else or he was given back to his mother. I know if we did this we would HAVE to adopt the child, and that can be dificult or impossible in foster care. I could see how fast that bond could happen and how strong it would be. Without a guarentee of being able to keep the baby, we opted out of fostering. I can see how Kathi likened those adoptions to miscarragies because they are very similar. Love for a child is something one cannot describe, and is stronger than anything.

 

I can see the beauty in having your own children, but when there's so many needed children in the world, a child is a child no matter what.

 

Ryver, I almost said the same thing, but I was afraid of what my bio kids would say. But yes I feel like the bond between my adopted son is stronger than the bond with my bio kids. It took an instant to get pregnant with them. I had easy pregnancies. It took three long years and two lost referrals to bring my son home. I am so protective of him. I'm also older, more mature, not drinking like I was when my older kids were small, in a better relationship. All the way around a better life than I had then. I love all of my kids. I don't know if it's everything I went through to get Dakota or if it's everything I've been through in life or just because he's my baby, but he is special.

Maggie, you are so right about the bond that develops with a foster parent. I remember so vividly the our foster mother sobbed her heart out as she said goodbye to Dakota. She had been his mommy for 5 1/2 months and it broke her heart to give him to us. She knew when she took him it would only be for a few months. She asked the interpretor if she could hold him one more time and she stood there in the lobby of our hotel and sobbed. She gave him back to me and quickly walked away because she couldn't bare the pain. She was so attached to our little one.


There is a poem that travels around the adoptive community that sums it all up:

Not flesh of my flesh, Nor bone of my bone,
But still miraculously my own.
Never forget for a single minute,
You didn't grow under my heart - but in it
-- Author: Fleur Conkling Heylinger

Kathi

 

Neither of my beautiful girls were adopted, but I can put in my 2 cents! My husband is Maddie's stepfather. He's been in her life since she was 3 years old. And he has loved her and cared for her as much or more than any biological parent could love a child. He considers her just as much his daughter as I do. He is so amazing because he made damn sure that when we had our daughter together, Maddie would not be jealous of Virginia. She never feels left out or loved any less by him. They have a special bond that makes ME jealous sometimes!


My point is, that even step-parents can love their (step)children as much as their biological babies.

 

I have a step-daughter. I have been her step mom since she was a year old. And I consider her my oldest daughter. If someone ask me how many kids I have I say 2. I love her with all my heart, like she was my own. I know that you can love children other than your bio, just as much.

 

I might only be 18, but I think I have plenty to say on this subject. I've not been adopted once, but twice. And I am the proud god-mother (soon to be adoptive mother...3 years :&) to a beautiful little girl.

As far as being adopted myself, I never once felt inferior to my other siblings. I felt, if anything, more special. I was chosen. And my dad never made me feel anything other than that. But it was twisted...but we won't go there.

As far as the second adoption, my step-father came into my life when I was 13 years old. He'd never had a child before, but he instantly became attached to myself and my two brothers. He often referred to me as his daughter, without any hesitation. He hugs me without reservation and would do anything for me. And when I decided that I wanted him to be my father, to take his last name as my own so that I could graduate as his daughter, he cried with joy.

I've been adopted, and the love, if anything, was increased because of those circumstances.

Now onto my god-daughter. I've said something about her before. When she was two weeks old, her parents sent her to live with me. They worked 12 hour night shifts six days a week, and wanted her to have a good schedule and loving people near her. So I volunteered. I was a senior in high school, taking 15 credit hours a semester at the local university at the same time, worked close to 20 hours a week to help keep a roof over my family's head, and came home to homework, chores, and raising a baby.

And not once did I ever regret my decision. Her and I have a bond that her parents will never have with her. I nursed her through countless fevers and belly aches. I stayed up at night with her, much to the downfall of my grades. And when she learned to say momma, she directed it at me.

When I left for university this past August, two weeks after her first birthday, after exactly one year as her mother, I almost contemplated staying home, just going straight into the workforce, and taking her in permanently. Her parents would have let me, I'm sure.

However, my mother, concerned that I would ruin a perfectly good chance to better myself, helped to strike a deal between Gracie's parents and myself. I stay in school until my bachelor's degree at least, and then after I settle into a career, they will sign their rights over to me. Until then, I see her everytime I'm home. She comes to stay with me, and even after not seeing her for months at a time, she still calls me momma. Her mother is "Tesa" (Theresa is her name) and her father is An (His name is Allen).

The bond I have with that baby girl is so strong that even when I feel that the world is caving in on me and there is no reason to continue with life, one word from her (over the phone) or to see her on webcam snaps me back to my ultimate goal: To have her in my life permanently.

So I have to disagree. A mother is a mother no matter if the child is of her body or not. A father is a father no matter if he is biologically linked to the baby or not. To think otherwise is to ignore the strongest bond ever: Love.

Holly

 

Thanks mamas!


Kathi, I was wondering....since there are so many needy kids in this world, why does it take so long to "match" you with one? I can understand why the paperwork takes forever, but why so long to find one? And when they do "match" you with a kid, is it based on your own requests of what you're looking for in a kid? Also, if you don't mind me asking, approximately how much does it cost (not including travel costs)? And do you have to pay all at once, or can you make it into monthly payments?

 

First of all, we chose to adopt internationally because we did not want to have a child in our home for a few months and then lose the child. Little did we know that we would end up losing twice before we finally adopted. We started out trying to adopt from China. The way their program works is after all the documents are submitted, your file sits in a huge pile until they get to it. At the time we were trying, the backlog was 15 months. They don't even touch your file until then. When they finally looked at our file they regected us. They never gave us a reason. They never even notified us. If it hadn't been for our agency pursuing the matter with many many phones calls we would not have even known we were rejected. It took another 6 months for them to send our file back to us. Our agency thinks it may have something to do with my age or it may be because of divorces in my 20's. We'll never know for sure. We were devastated. It felt like our child had died and we had no body to bury. I cried for days and couldn't work or anything.

We then switched to Guatemala. We received a referral of a beautiful little one month old baby girl almost immediately. We had to switch all of our paperwork, government clearances, child abuse clearances, FBI clearances, everything to Guatemala. The process there is much different than China. In China you do all the paperwork, wait for many months, then get a referral and go get your child in a few weeks. In Guatemala, you do all the paperwork, get a referral very quickly and then work through their legal system. It can take 3 to 6 months to work through the legal system. But you already have a picture and history of the child. You can even go visit the child. Part of the process is DNA testing to make sure that the person who says she is the mother really is the mother. The birth mother has to sign off on four separate occasions to make sure this is what she really wants to do. That's another difference between the two countries. In China the babies are abandoned. In Guatemala the birth mother places the child for adoption, usually at birth but sometimes at an older age. We went to visit the little girl that we were referred. We spent a week with her in our hotel and grew to love her with all our hearts. Then just two weeks later the birth mother changed her mind and took her back to her family to raise. Again, the devastation was almost more than we could bear. Much like a miscarriage. The crib was set up but would remain empty.

A few weeks later while talking to the social worker from our agency, she mentioned that they still did not have a little girl, (I had four sons, I wanted another girl). But she said, "We even have this little boy that no one wants." There was nothing wrong with him. It was just that everyone on the list from our agency had requested a girl. When she said those words, I knew this was our child. How could no one want him. The next day we went out and signed the papers accepting the referral of 19 day old Daniel. This time the legal system went smoothly and quickly. Just 5 months later, we brought our son home. We named him Dakota Garcia.

We love him with all our hearts. Although there are days as we struggle through the terrible two's.....

As far as the cost, the agency fees, the lawyer's fees, the government fees (our government and their's). Well it's more money than I'll make this year. But he's worth more than anything money can buy. From what I've seen, it's less than what a cesearean birth costs in this country.

You can adopt from the foster system. Costs are very low. Sometimes they will even pay you to foster the child until they become free for adoption. They also sometimes provide medical expenses and other assistance sometimes until the child is 18. But unless the child is free for adoption before you start the process, you run the risk of them being reunited with the birth mothers. Also, many of the children in the foster care system have been in and out of foster care. They have suffered all kinds of physical, mental, maybe even sexual abuse. Often there are problems with fetal alcohol syndrome or other birth defects, often caused by drugs.

To adopt a healthy white infant can run $100,000 or more in legal fees. There are a lot of choices out there. Feel free to pm me if you have other questions.

With our agency, you pay part of their fee when you start the homestudy. You pay more when you complete the homestudy and the balance when you accept the refferal. They lawyer fee was paid half when we accepted the referral and the balance when the adoption was final. The other government fees are spread out through the adoption process. The bulk of the government fees are at the very beginning and then the visa fees and such when you bring the child home.


Kathi

 

Thanks for sharing your story Kathi, it really makes me appreciate how easily i got my kids!

 

Kathi, your story made me cry. In some ways it is worse than a miscarrage, as you have seen the child and know she is alive and well. I am SOOO glad you guys got Dakota! Sometimes it seems that the baby "picks" you, whether you give birth or adopt. I've miscarried twice, so I know a similar pain, but I wouldn't have my Moon or my Sage if I hadn't had those miscarrages. Moon used to say, when she was a baby, that the baby we lost "was up in heaven, with me, and he needed to be there, and I told God that I wanted to be your baby now. So he put me in your belly" It was a weird thing for a small child to say. It looks like Dakota picked you and your man, too!

Blessings,

Maggie

 

((hugs)) to all of us mamas! Whether we've birthed our babies, struggled to get them, or took on the enormous responsibility at 17/18 of taking care of someone else's child as their own (holly, you rock), we are all awesome and wonderful people. Yea for mamas!

 

Thanks, Sugrmag

I think all the mammas of this site rock. YOu are all so dedicated to your babies.

Holly