Should Guns be Banned in the US?

I always felt that people who wanted to ban guns should move to a place that would be safe for them, like china or russia.

 

Ban guns in a country that doesn't have an oppressive government and police force.

 

Well some people, oh I dunno, like to protect themselves rather than relying on some fatass with a high school diploma who is a 20 minute car ride away.

 

Other people like shooting as a sport.

 

yeah definately!!!

yeah there does be fights, just like everywhere else... they can get really nasty :-| ... but the outcome would be way worse if they had guns!!!

 

I am ultimately the person that is responsible for keeping me and my family safe.

 

Rather arrogant of you...

 

Found another good site with FACTS and STATISTICS about gun control.

http://www.justfacts.com/guncontrol.asp#constitution

It also has info on different states where gun bans were implimented. In EVERY SINGLE instance the homicide rate increased after the gun bans and in those places where the bans were lifted the homicide rates dropped back down, IN EVERY INSTANCE!

Here is data for the UK;




In 1920, Britain passed a law requiring civilians to obtain a certificate from their district police chief in order to purchase or possess any firearm except a shotgun. To obtain this certificate, the applicant had to pay a fee, and the chief of police had to be "satisfied" that the applicant had "good reason for requiring such a certificate" and did not pose a "danger to the public safety or to the peace." The certificate had to specify the types and quantities of firearms and ammunition that the applicant could purchase and keep.

* In 1968, Britain made the 1920 law stricter by requiring civilians to obtain a certificate from their district police chief in order to purchase or possess a shotgun. This law also required that firearm certificates specify the identification numbers ("if known") of all firearms and shotguns owned by the applicant.

* In 1997, Britain passed a law requiring civilians to surrender almost all privately owned handguns to the police. More than 162,000 handguns and 1.5 million pounds of ammunition were "compulsorily surrendered" by February 1998. Using "records of firearms held on firearms certificates," police accounted for all but fewer than eight of all legally owned handguns in England, Scotland, and Wales.
British homicide rate has averaged 52% higher since the outset of the 1968 gun control law and 15% higher since the outset of the 1997 handgun ban

So you anti-gun proponents would do well to actually research the FACTS and base your opinion on facts rather than emotionally charged rhetoric, or at the very least so you have some idea what your talking about so you don't look the fool in future discussions of this highly controversial subject.
I know I am comfortable with my opinions concerning firearms and the data supports my position.

(I did notice the numbers of homicide in the U.S. jumped across the board in the early-mid 1980's, but that is also the same time in which cocaine trafficking and South American drug cartels started to exert influence in the U.S. as well as gangs became more structured crime organizations with an accompanying rise in gang violence)

 

* In 1997, Britain passed a law requiring civilians to surrender almost all privately owned handguns to the police. More than 162,000 handguns and 1.5 million pounds of ammunition were "compulsorily surrendered" by February 1998. Using "records of firearms held on firearms certificates," police accounted for all but fewer than eight of all legally owned handguns in England, Scotland, and Wales.

That is also the reason I'm not a big fan of having to register all firearms either.

 

You stole my graph!!
http://www.hipforums.com/newforums/showpost.php?p=6696967&postcount=182

 

Great minds think alike I guess
Honestly I just came across the site I linked and they had the same info. Is that where you got the graphs you posted?

 

Realistically, what are the chances of ever banning guns in the U.S., when half the population owns guns. How would you even begin to collect all of those guns? Banning semi-autos could happen, but handguns, shotguns and rifles? Almost impossible to do.

Canada has the same percentage of gun ownership as the U.S., including handguns, shotguns, and rifles, and they have a low crime rate. Of course they don't have the sort of gangs we have, and they take care of their people better than the U.S. does.

 

You obviously have no clue what a "semi-auto" is.

 

Yep. I'm one of them.

I can't really tell if there was just a whole page of sarcasm-proof posters, or if they where all throwing it back at me

 

Yes, RooRshack, I was wondering why folks didn't get your joke. The key was your last sentence (in post #219):

My post was gonna be either "That was sarcasm, son, you missed it." or "Your sarcasm-ometer is obviously broken." But I was lazy so I posted nothing and set back and watched the fun.

Also, it's a little-known fact among the (largely ignorant) anti-gun crowd that an average deer-hunting rifle is between 2 and 3 times more powerful than the greatly feared "assault rifles," and is accurate to almost twice the distance. When hunting larger game even more powerful rifles are required. But folks are scared of silly things like the evil-looking shape and color, and frightening names.

Folks, you shouldn't fear the tool. Trust a good, gentle being who is using a tool for good. Fear a madman who is using any tool for evil. If you take away one weapon, he'll just get a bigger one.

Walk in the light that you have, and be nice to each other.

Peace.

 

Regardless of how many people ignore guns, the entire debate is moot since both the federal constitution in terms of the second amendment guarantees(at least according to the supreme court now from Heller Vs D.C.) the indidivudal right to own a gun that has to be delegated and followed by by the states. On top of that most state constitutions also specifically guarentee the right to own firearms.

 

Last week, in Lakewood, a 19 year old pedestrian shot and killed a cop in a patrol car who had pulld over to question him. It was a handgun.

This is in a State (NJ) with a permit requirement, 3-day waiting period, required personal references, and sign-off required by the local Police Chief for a handgun purchase.

I doubt the weapon was legal.

 

PB smith

OK lets put gun related homicides for the UK and US in context

UK – 73 (2001, BBC)

USA - 11,348 (2001, University of Utah)

The UK has 60 million people compared with the USA’s of 250 –280 million so lets boost the UK’s figure

60 million – 70 deaths
120 million – 140 deaths
180 million – 210 deaths
240 million – 280 deaths
300 million – 350 deaths

In fact I believe to get to the USA’s levels of gun related homicides we would need to increase the UK’s population some 160 times to 9,600 million people, the worlds population at this time is only 6,500 million

 

it was a hard call between the fourth and fifth choices... i don't believe there should be any control in the sense of telling you you can or can't own a gun... my partner, who lives in the US, reckons that people are far less likely to start something knowing that anyone could be carrying a gun... over here in the UK, it is usually the bad-asses who have guns... they usually stick to shooting each other but innocents have been shot too... i would like a gun for self-defense. my mum was an ace shot and i think i would be pretty good with one...

 

I’ve stated many times that to me the problem is that many Americans see guns as a way of dealing with (and therefore ignoring and dismissed) social problems that may be better dealt with if they were faced.

It is the kind of mentality that only tackles the symptoms and not the causes, think about these facts

The US has high incarceration rates and brutal prisons. (726 people per 100,000 compared with the UK’s 142 and France’s 91).

It has large numbers of ‘gated’ communities and American’s advice for not getting into trouble is to stay away from ‘bad’ areas and keep a gun handy just in case.

These are reactions to crime – they’re not enquiry into why that crime exists.

What we’ve had so far is the rather lame theory that ‘evil’ or ‘bad’ people do bad things, commit crimes, shoot people.

As a serious explanation it seems woefully inadequate, I mean why are they bad or evil were they born bad and if not why did they turn bad?

There are people with mental problems out there, but how did they get hold of guns and are people seriously arguing that all gun related homicides in the US are the acts of the insane?

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The idea that a gun is just a tool is crap, it is a weapon designed specifically as a weapon, a knife can be used as a weapon but has many other uses, a car can be used as a weapon but it was designed as a means of transport, a gun is a weapon it can be used to frighten, threaten, maim or kill, it cannot be used for anything else.

Sorry I’m rather straight forward and like to call a spade a spade.
(edit – My point being that it is a very efficient weapon with far greater killing potential than a knife or a car)


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The argument that if you ban guns ‘only outlaws will have them’ seems a bit of a copout, I’d instantly want to know why the guns are in the hands of the ‘outlaws’ and what you were doing to get them out of the hands of the ‘outlaws’? Too often it seems to me many pro-gunners are more interested in allowing or getting easier access to guns (for themselves and so also the criminals) than in trying to get them out of the hands of criminals.

I mean according to the FBI most guns in criminal hands in the US were once purchased legally in the US and either passed on to criminals or stolen by them.

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