The Psychedelic Revolution

One of the points of this is I see nothing untoward about members of this generation looking around and asking 'what happened to the revolution?'. Wondering where the passionate drive to make the world a better place went to. Trying to figure out where things went wrong. Because that is one of the great skills of youth, figuring out what the people who came before them did wrong. And that means pointing out where you and I, and our generations, fucked up.

And generally, that's going to be uncomfortable. Especially in those instances where we feel they are -wrong-. Where our 'greater' perspectives, from having lived through it(and having studied more), give us the notion that they aren't seeing the whole picture. But the fact is, we aren't either. Not only can no one ever, but in the same measure our having been there gives us insight, it also blinds us. The 90's and aughts will forever be colored by my experiences of them. The 80's less so, because I had limited perspective, I was a child, and a teenager.

I'm pleased to see people questioning where all the urge to better the world went. It seems a good thing to me, as I value good. I worry some about the fear, the despair, in some of the statements. The fear that the US is on the road to destruction. Such fear can often lead to reactive, contractive action. But I don't worry overmuch, fearing fear seems silly. And overall, it feels we are on a good path. The world is slowly, ever so slowly, getting brighter. Perhaps we do need another revolution. Perhaps someone needs to pick up where the 60's left off. Perhaps the messiahs of this generation will be the Leary's and the Cassidy's of the next, the trailblazers that set the next action into motion. Or perhaps they will simply be the torchbearers, passing along the flame of hope, duty and purpose to those who will.

The absolute conviction that -his- ideas are the right ones... in some ways that's troubling for such conviction can be blinding and lead to horrors, but such conviction is also a great power for change, for growth. And coupled with a fervor to do good, and an honest focus on love I think that even if he is -wrong- on every level about every facet of the divine nature of life, that he still has good odds of helping the world.

And what do I, who believes only in cycles, or spirals, believe could help the world? We can move toward a more loving nature. We can learn to help one another more. We can learn to love ourselves more. I have no goal of perfection, I simply hope I leave a world a little more loving then the one I found. Even if we cannot escape the cycle of life, we can learn, slowly, generation upon generation, how better to live on it.

 

It got televised.

 

Whether it's felt as a personal revolution or to influence the feelings of others..... "Be the change you want to see in the world."

Also the "revolution", pushing for a better world has gone no where. Open your eyes, and probably your heart, to feel the little things people are doing for us.

Living the cycle, is the "escape from the cycle." And disliking the cycle, labeling it as something wrong with our minds, isn't taking part in the cycle at all.

 

Not one life has been saved, the value then in the spending.

 

the circle exists to be broken, so that we may be freed. the circle exists so that life may 'experience.' for without experience, new life would not be able to be created, and to grow and to experience. the goal of the life is to enter into these in further divions of creation, and then seek to harmonize the polarities, in order to once again know oneself as the creator of them. it would be to forget who we really are, in order to remember, and know ourself once again, as the creator.

so ultimatly the meaning would be that we are stuck in the cycles of life until we can be liberated to know ourselves again as the creator, so that we may once again be subjected to forget.

but even that is cyclical, and doesn't that seem a little futile that we would constantly be in that state?

well in order to further exmplify my thought it would probably be best to quote a passage from the bible. sorry if that creates a stigma to anyone.

"I consider that our present sufferings are not worth comparing with the glory that will be revealed to us. The creation waits in eager expectation for the sons of God to be revealed. For the creation was subjected to frustration, not by it's own choice, but by the will of the one who subjected it, in the hope that the creation itself will be liberated from its bondage to decay and brought into the glorious freedom of the children of God.
We know that the whole creation has been groaning as in the pains of childbirth right up to the present time. Not only so, but we ourselves, who have the firstfruits of the spirit, groan inwardly as we wait eagerly for our adoption as sons, the redemption of our bodies. For in this hope we were saved. But hope that is seen is no hope at all. Who hopes for what he already has? But if we hope for what we do not have, we wait for it patiently.
In the same way, the spirit helps us in our weakness. We do not know what we ought to pray for, but the Spirit himself intercedes for us with groans that words cannot express. And he who seaches in our hearts knows the mind of the spirit, because the Spirit intercedes for the saints in accordance with God's will." Romans 8:18-27

the purpose of suffering would be to teach us to learn to overcome. we are confronted with hate and greed so that we may learn to be selfless and loving. so that we may choose 'good' over 'evil' while subjected to our own free will. that we might choose to love, instead of hate. again, we are presented with 'other than' so that we may know 'that.'

it is a sad state that purpose is so unknown to so many, and that so many others fall into a false purpose. but maybe that is just part of our growth, i don't know. but it makes me cringe. we must grow, because we were created for the growth of the creation. as we grow so does the creator.

i've come to the conclusion that either i'm right about all this, or i'm going to bare part of the brunt of the cosmic joke which is creation. but if that is the case -- that it is a joke -- i think that i would cause the creation to buckle and shudder out of disgust.

but still, what you, and everyone, need to understand that the older generation should warn the youth of where the pitfalls and the rocks are, and place lighthouse on the rocks so to speak, and that the youth should heed their warning. otherwise the life of the older person has gone to waste if none of his understanding can be passed down and actually recieved by the younger generation. which also places a burden on the youth to actually be able to recieve what his older counterparts are saying.

but none of this should be confused with the fact that in some cases knowledge is subjective, and that we are all different human beings with different giftings and strengths, and weaknesses. so where maybe you failed, i may suceed. where someone crashed on the rocks and set up a lighthouse there, someone else might just fly right over. there is no amount of wisdom that can amass to the understanding of the uniqueness of human life. because we are all different parts to a puzzle. for where you failed, maybe just part of the puzzle was missing. and maybe sometimes someone will just have to be able to have the insight to be able to tell whether his own giftings will be able to overcome the things that other people are warning them about -- or whether they will just crash on the rocks too. and if they do, you should be there to help them up, so that they can get going again and not have to spend their time building the lighthouse that you have so earnestly worked to build. because it would be vain for them to sit there and build another lighthouse right beside it. instead, they maybe ought to move on and find a pitfall that maybe no one else has discovered, and help to overcome it. in this way we are all stepping stones for eachother so that we might be able to progress.

this all reminds me of a situation in my life recently. not long ago i parted company with some very wise and very experienced older individuals. they had a host of wisdom to share and really brought my life into a positive direction. but when i realised that i might not be able to tell whether i had anything else to fulfil if i stayed in their company i knew that i had to leave. even against their better judgement and their having known people doing the exact same things and failed. 'you have to follow your heart,' one of them said. another said, 'you know, i'm curious to see what you come up with.' they told me to let them know when i was done exhausting all my efforts and ready to come back and accept the lessons they learned -- or to call them from the other side when i got there!

but as far as the ideas of a truely loving society with real unity and understanding -- i can tell you that it does exist. so don't stop searching! because the good things come to those who search. just hold on to your hope and it will carry you through, and think twice before you swallow a bitter pill. and if what you are searching for doesn't exist -- even after you have been to the four corners of the earth -- then you'd best start making it exist. utopia might seem illusive, but you can get pretty damn close! you could spend a lifetime looking for a perfect blossom, and it would not be a wasted life. but if you do happen to find one, you had better hold onto it with all you have -- and never let go.

 

Hey Desos!
Wondered if you were going to revisit this thread. So to continue our previous discussion.....

It's an overcast day here in the low 70's, how is the weather in your neck of the woods?

 

yea i think that my thoughts were just becoming muddled when i started posting in here like every day lol, my thoughts were much clearer and more correct when i posted once a week.

hmm yea it's pretty warm, and cloudy. but not too bad at all, not too bad at all.

 

I always wanted to dip a strip in my HS algebra teachers rather clearly alcoholic morning "smoothie",

 

For those who work so hard
And never see the children
Never see the children grow
Into the gifts they give them

This life is all unkown
Gotta listen to the laughter
Everyone must be heard now
Even in the dark

For those who seek no answers
Keep it from the table
Ignorance is eaten up
When everyone must be fed

This life is constant hunger
See it in the dreamers
Believe in the believers of never-ending love
An endless kind of love

Even in the dark

 

Come on, you can do it! Only 25 more pages...

 

lol, in that case, i'll go ahead and throw this out there:

why is it that the essence of my thoughts are Judeo-Christian? why is that is so wrong? what is it of my thoughts that are judgmental, forcing guilt, or coercing the need for redemption, or blaming? i am simply stating truth. if the truth is threatening to you, then maybe you should think about why. no one can force you to feel any way unless you grant them permission to do so. why would there not be a seperation of good and evil? if there is no seperation then why shouldn't i just forget my life goals and go around killing people? why love when there is no difference between loving someone and killing someone? there is a difference my friend.

 

Are you playing devil's advocate? The fact of death behind non action? The fact of rebirth not behind action? One may attach value, but who are you to assume one's thinking? What in the reality you hold dearest to your mind and feelings, perhaps in value, is to make true no sharing of this life?

 

Well, I didn't say that the evolution/revolution was gone. Just that I can see how young people would look around this world and ask 'What happened?'. I did myself, not too long ago. In some ways, I still do.

And I also said that I don't think them asking that, and trying to restart the general widespread interest in making a positive change to be a bad thing. I see it as a positive.

 

Except, do you? I mean, you have this story in your head. A story, as I said, told to you by a young man who isn't you. A man who was once you. But you're not that kid anymore. You can't see with his eyes anymore. It's just a really complex, extremely powerful story. Sure, it's a story that's shaped who you are today, it's -the- story that's shaped who you are. But it's still just a story.

Your age, your wisdom, your knowledge, does give you insight. It gives you some idea of the terrain that younger ones will follow. But it also blinds you to the terrain that you never found. And you're more blind for thinking you know. I really like Desos's response on this, and agree with him.

Let me tell you about the greatest lie ever told. A child sees a flame, a pretty dancing blue and red light, on a stove. The child, full of wonder and curiosity reaches out to touch it, to feel it, to know what it is. And it burns her. She recoils in pain and surprise and cries for her mother. Her mother comforts her and gently explains 'That's fire dear. Fire burns you, it hurts. Fire -always- hurts'.

This lie, or one much like it, is told to every child. It sets a pattern. If it hurts you, it will always hurt you. It is to be avoided. And so life goes on. And curiosity reaches out again and again to touch the wonders of the world. And some things lead to pleasure and joy, while others lead to pain. And each time something new leads to pain, a door is closed. And many things that held pleasure, that then cause pain, are also closed off. And a world full of infinite possibilities contracts, slowly.

And this gaining of knowledge, this accretion of limits, is part of what wisdom is. It's a piece of what we pride ourselves in, when we call ourselves wise. In a larger part, it is simply growing accustomed to our limits, being less quick to close doors, but also less interested in opening new ones. It is a peace that arises from having explored the limits of one's world, and feeling like there are few surprises left. And in part, this peace that comes with wisdom is grand.

But... The doors we close are not always the right ones. And certainly not all the right ones for everyone. Sometimes, pleasure and pain is far more random then we like to believe. Sometimes what we term good, and pleasant, and we are at peace with is simply what we have grown accustomed to hurting us. At least occasionally. Or things that would hurt others. But because we've decided this is good and that is bad, it is so.

I'm not saying this is true of everything. I'm not saying that all positive and negative things to a human are purely subjective. Though this is a possibility, it certainly doesn't fit into a rational skepticism or scientific framework(though remember your quantum physics: locality, causality, reality, pick 2).

What I am saying is just because a path didn't work for you doesn't mean it is the wrong path. Just because you've closed a door doesn't mean that others should avoid it. The folly of youth is both a gift and a curse. Gentle guidance of it is certainly called for, but it shouldn't be discouraged in my opinion.

From my own life: I was going to be a physicist. It was a plan long held and deeply cherished. For many varied reasons, it didn't work. I dropped out of high school, tried college briefly, dropped out of that. My life was over. I sat in my room for months, I did nothing. Eventually, I decided on suicide. Seriously decided, not just contemplated. I nearly did it. But as I was at the edge, I thought, a lot. I realized I hadn't done anything yet. I realized I hadn't tried anything else, other then that one dream.

So I decided to go out and try everything. Do all the things that I was told were foolish. With no fear, for how could life do anything to me after that? And so I did. I threw myself into folly with a passion. I made every mistake. I did everything wrong. I tried every drug, was indiscriminate with my associates, and eventually my sexual partners. I hitchhiked around the country. I climbed construction cranes and city buildings, I slept in parks and abandoned buildings. I hurt myself for the sheer thrill of it, and courted madness intentionally. I lived without any care for my own well being. The only levels I held any care was to not hurt others, as much as possible. I know I hurt those who feared for me, and those who tried to cling too tightly to me, but in this I allowed myself an indulgence.

And my life? Has been amazing. I have few regrets, and would not choose differently, if given the option. I'm saddened, sometimes, that I have grown wiser. That I have grown less foolish, and with that, less free-spirited, less uninhibited. Yet with it comes a peace that during my wild ride I never felt. A comfort. For part of what threw me into that grand adventure again and again was an unceasing restlessness. A restlessness that though I know of, I no longer entirely understand. I remember it, but no longer feel it. I can name it, and describe it, but can no longer see through that lens, no longer understand what that vision shows.

So my wisdom says, the wise do not know all. Common sense is not always sensible. And folly is not always foolish.

 

the government is way to manipulative now a days. they get what they want and if the people stand in their way, theyll get around us or through us.

 

no. that would be senseless. and i don't really know what your trying to say with the rest of your post.

 

Yes, I do understand.

This is not some high school math class where I have to show all the steps taken to arrive at the answer. I just give the answer and conclusions I have reached thus far.

You sure are making a lot assumptive leaps concerning what I do or don't know or understand based on very little. As I have stated before, Desos and I have hashed this stuff out before and already have some degree of understanding where the other is coming from and where they are at presently, at least I believe that over the last year and a half that I have conveyed myself to him fairly clearly.
Care to comment on that thought Desos?

So again you are making these sweeping assumptions and conclusions about me based on little evidence.
As far as the rest of your post, your preaching to the choir.

 

yea, but there is truth to what she is saying. not just in regards to you but in regards to the human condition. there's no need to get offended if someone tells you something that you already know. there are fundamental truths that affect all of us and then there are individual truths that differ from person to person based on their personality. you might be able to understand what it is like to be young again, but you cannot truly experience it again and thus have complete understanding again. because your views are shaped by your experiences. part of being youthful comes with having a blank slate.

but you can tell your story, and it will serve as a guide to illuminate the way for the future generations(or atleast you can hope so). but there still comes a certain accountability with wisdom, for if you offer someone guidance then you automatically become more accountable for their actions, or for actions they didn't take.

it's easy to understand where other people are coming from because we're all made of the same stuff, ya know?

 

I wish I could tell you a story
about giants, and monsters, and flying saucers.
then you would listen to me, I think...
then you would say, "Wow, that sounds cool..."
I wish I could tell you about bolts of lightning, flashing signs in the sky,
or maybe about kaleidoscopes of colors that point the way...
then you would listen and smile...
I wish I could make up a tale that would scare you and shake you
and burst open your heart...
then maybe you'd listen, yes, get really excited
and understand my heart.
Perhaps my simple story will grab your interest
and hold your attention
and you'll listen and smile and say, "Wow!"
If you are one who can hear the tiny voice within a gentle breeze,
and who looks for the faint rainbow after the shower,
and can tell that each unique wildflower must be made
by the hand of God, and who needs a true friend,
and knows there are none to be found...
Then this simple story I have to tell is for you.
It is the story of how, and when, and most important, why.
Lend your ear then, my friend, and I'll share my heart...
for I have the key that unlocks the door to a beautiful garden...

Have you ever heard someone say
i'm so Thankful to the God of heaven,
for all he is and all he does?
Has it ever been throughout the history
of this planet,
That someone loved him with all
Their heart and devoted their life
to being under his loving
kind influence?

Everyone will almost universally say,
"Well, God is love."
This may be a good way to begin to explain
his nature
but how can we explain how we who were
created in his image have so many
awful attitudes and problems
and are capable of all sorts of wrong-doing?

How is it we can fear another human being
or maybe someone is afraid of us.
No one ever taught me
how to lie or cheat, steal
but somehow these things I've done
well many times
and stuff about God never entered
into my heart.
Anyone who ever spoke to me about God
was so weird that i feared this God
having anything to do with who i am.

Who made the stars or the sky so big —
Whose idea was it for babies to come
out of women,
Why couldn't they just be found under rocks?
How come you get better when you get hurt
And you can laugh or you can cry —
Why is blue such a nice color for the sky
How is it, i know wrong from right
and all my life i have known what to conceal
or what to reveal —
Why has it always hurt me
when someone didn't like me

You're supposed to say thank you —
so i did
so i didn't —
They were just words that made me look polite
To be honest my life was worth not much
i've done everything except kill myself
and my thought-life is guilty
of unrevealable garbage.

i wanted something
and i want to have something
i wanted power
The kind of power that lets you love-
does it come from heaven or heroin
should i be gay or a Catholic priest
do i need tofu — fruit — raw veggies
or is beef ok
what must i do to have the power of life
no one ever showed it to me and i didn't have it
but somehow i want courage to be
who i was created to be

Ok — the search is this
Find Love.
My heart is this —
if you find love you'll find God

Where is Love
Years rolled by and all i know is where love wasn't
but i have courage to keep looking
cause i have a hope
a hope that love will change me
because nothing has changed me
not presents, gifts
not pain, nor money or relationships
and the music keeps me from listening to my heart
And your songs don't answer my question
And you sell your music
And you're rich and miserable
And i'm miserable and miserable

i hate the way things are
and i have hated the way they happen
And people hate me
for what i've put on them —
i have failed at everything except failing

My hope is this —
i want to change
and no one is saying you need to change
In fact they assure me i'm ok
but even they aren't

It's not money
and i always come down from drugs
The band always goes home without me
and my life is injured
and i don't think God wants people
to be like i am

Travel — so i do that
and i'm so cool i don't even want
to know where i am, cause i don't like
The crap of well, i was here
and i've been there
and i wear places on my shirts
like an old soldier wearing
a too tight uniform.
What does it matter
where i have been,
i'm miserable
and my life is lacking purpose

i want to be happy right here with who i am
and what i am doing —
And i want to love people
and i don't know how
and i'm sad cause something is missing in me.

When i was young, a boy was crippled from polio
People said he ate from the cat's dish
and that's why he couldn't walk
i thought that was stupid
even though adults told me that.
And they told me
the sandman put sand in my eyes
to make me sleepy
That the tooth fairy would give me a quarter
for a tooth put under my pillow
and Santa Claus was watching
and that trolls lived
under the bridge up the road
and Jesus died for my sins —
Adults told me these things
when i was a child

i'm a jerk
but i suffer
to have a meaningful existence

i've never met anyone who i want to be like
and no one wants to be like me
i'm not happy
maybe someone dead could come live
in me
— a famous poet who still
has something to say
— or someone

And you see how lost i am

i want to change
And you, Mr. Yogi man,
you say you will help me
but why do you charge
And why don't you pick the thorns off the
roses
and give them to me

No,
i don't want to worship man
or creation
but i want to be in touch with the Creator
i want to know the one who put the spin
on this marvelous planet.
i want to behold the one who holds life
the one who inspires Love
i want a peace
knowing he loves me
and i want to love him
because i want to love you

And this is love
and i want to love.
Look i want to love others
i want a kindness that won't expire
Nothing is more important
to me than this —
My mark in life — Love

 

I'm not offended, just getting bored with this thread. autumnbreeze is re-stating a lot that has already been discussed, but that is thier right, this is a public forum after all, I'm just getting tired of making what are essentially the same responses mutiple times.
That reminds me Desos, is it your turn on the :banghead: or the :beatdeadhorse5:? I lost track.

Well hell, if I'm going to be accountable for your actions, then please disregard everything I said. I got enough responsibilities and grief with teenage daughters

It's in the mid '60's right now and wet, not raining, just heavy mist.