Fighting the Same Old Battle

...And knowing is half the battle!

 

I like your thought process.....

 

I think it doesn't really matter we are programmed what is right and wrong before we even leave the womb and we pick up our parents' values and take them on as our own. Sometimes Republician and Liberal is more then just black and white but some grey areas, it's like some people say yes for gay marriage but no for legalizing polygmous marriages... It's just how people feel about certian subjects.

 

refusal implies protection.To justify some of your opinions doesn't necessarily means a protection for yourself,which may be narrowly one for the opinions themselves.
insecurity is a good account for these conflics of opinions among people.nobody knows what it will be tomorrow,and nobody knows the precise confines of the right and the wrong.So they just let it be.Therefore, nobody is always ready to change,though the world requirs a bit of guts and tolerance.
the way towards a happy life may not be paved by the attractive "right" . let your own code be your guide.best wishes!

 

What a difference 6 months can make. That post now seems incredibly obsolete. Clearly, Obama is not going to push any social issues in a liberal direction. That will not likely happen in the USA again for at least another 7 years.

These trends may be more connected to the economy than politics anyway. When people are worried about day to day survival, they don't put much of a priority on anything else.

 

As proof for the original statement by NDY, take a look at the juvenile questions asked in the sex forums. How can you have an intelligent conversation about conviction or commitment with a bunch of kids (ok, ok mostly male, er...ah,...boys) who are asking things such as is my penis long enough?; rate a good cock; describe your pussy; do you lick your gf's crack? OMFG, where did all the kids come from? Any adult forums around?

 

we are fed a certain amount of conservative control everyday. we are taught that sex is something to be placed on a pedestal. yes you're supposed to enjoy it but in a civilized manor. blah blah blah. personally I believe whatever floats your boat is ok by me. as long as everyone is a consenting adult and nobody is being hurt than hey do what you want. it feels good. sure I have my kinks and i stay open minded for the sake of my partners. but I do have things I'm just willing to do either. but that's really my choice isn't it. that's the key right there. do only what you are comfortable doing and let everyone else do their own thing.

 

I tend to assume that all of Europe ranges from liberal to ultra-liberal on sexual freedom issues, but I got a recent reminder that there are parts of the continent where very little progress has been made along these lines. I saw a TV news report in which several jury members from the Amanda Knox murder trial had been interviewed. In this randomly selected group of Italians, a surprising number said that in their opinion, Amanda Knox lost all credibility with them when she admitted that she had been having sex with her boyfriend. In their view, premarital sex put her very close to the moral level of a murderer! In 2010, I would be hard pressed to find folks in the American South who would make similar, unprogressive statements in a public interview. It's like the 1960s never happened for these people. It made me wonder now how much diversity of opinion there is on this subject in Europe. Maybe this battle is not completely won yet anywhere.

 

broad generalizations are almost never really true. there's always liberals and conservatives, some like their parents, some in opposition to them, and some for reason completely their own.

 

I thought it was common knowledge that there are exceptions to every trend. Does that really need to be explained every time it comes up?

 

First, if it is the same, consistently engaging judgmental battle, it is not resurgent. It's source is self centered and fundamentally the same for all of us. It is called judgment or arbitrary evaluation. The battle is with ourselves.
It is the effort of perpetual arbitration that wearies and terrifies us. Why does it continue? Because we believe we are right.

The timing is purely individual but the remedy is identical for everyone, forgiveness. Love does not wait on time, but invitation. How long will it take? How long does it take to decide between being in love and being right.

 

The difference between the right and left perspective on this issue is the same. The right believes it is right and the left fears that they are not.

 

well i'm not a mind reader, and you clearly used the word "always," when "generally" would have been much more accurate. anyway, it seemed to pretty much be the whole point of the thread. you were worried because there were young people here with conservative views on sex. well, of course there are, as well as liberal young people, and likewise with the older people.

i would think you could expect to see a higher percentage of conservative young people than conservative old people, just because almost all young people are online whereas older conservatives are probably more likely to reject computers and the internet than their liberal peers.

 

Did you leave your electron microscope at home today?

:willy_nilly:

I am sure you will recover.

I'm sure that is true.

Let me make this a bit more complicated. Instead of thinking only in terms of liberal vs. conservative, let's also consider tolerant vs. intolerant. A tolerant conservative wants to make conservative moral choices for himself, but doesn't care what you do. An intolerant conservative wants other people to make conservative personal choices. It is the intolerant conservatives that bug the shit out of me.

I used to be a tolerant liberal about personal lifestyle choices. At this point, I'm actually more of a tolerant conservative. It worries me when I see intolerance in young people because it is a sign of society moving in a backward direction. I should have explained that better in the OP.

I made the OP nine months ago, and I don't see as much intolerant conservatism here now as I did then. In fact, I see as much or more of that in the broader American society as I do online.

 

fair enough. intolerant people are pretty annoying no matter what their political leanings.

i'll admit i have made very infrequent trips into the L&S forums for the past few years, so i don't really even know about the posts you were referring to. probably a lot of them were just trolls though.

i'm already showing signs of PTSD.

 

And you know we have a good bit of turnover around here, for various reasons.

Some of the pics in L&S are reputed to have high therapeutic value.

 

I believe that a major reason for what you are seeing in the "broader American society" is the trend towards young people living with their parents longer, due to economic reasons. As long as you are financially dependant on your parents and somewhat under their authority, you are likely to reflect their views and values, at least partially. Independent living works much better with an independent source of income.

 

You may be onto something.

 

A few comments. I’m not sure if the “younger generation” is less open-minded or if their attention is just going in different directions. For example, acts such as girl-girl relationships and anal sex are more prevalent among the younger crowd, so being open-minded might be more of a relative thing. At the same time, I know a lot of high school/college age guys who have little use for girls and would rather drink beer and play video games.

That said, I think there are different background factors with different age groups. For those who grew up in the 60’s, there was a lot of challenging of traditional values. The whole Civil Rights movement was coming to a head. The Sexual Revolution was in full swing. Drug use became common. This was all counter-cultural to the previous generation in which things were more “traditional.” Even if you weren’t old enough to be an active participant in the 60’s movement, just being alive during that period you were aware that a lot of traditional values were being challenged. That attitude carried forward into the 70’s and is still romanticized by many who weren’t fortunate enough to have been around during that period. The 60’s mindset probably plays a lot into the open-mindedness of today’s middle age crowd.

The second factor, and perhaps bigger than the first, is one of experience and acceptance. When you’re younger it’s easy to criticize anything that’s foreign to your values. Accepting gays, lesbians, and transgender individuals is often difficult because quite often there hasn’t been any exposure to these alternative lifestyles. As you gain more experience, you find that classmates, co-workers, friends, and relatives emerge from the closet and reveal their true sexual preferences. You know you like them, you always have. Should you suddenly dislike these people because of who they are? Slowly the awareness develops that gays, lesbians, and transsexuals are the same as everyone else, just different in their sexual preferences. Nonetheless, they’re still good people. That acceptance of these alternative lifestyles often develops over time and with experience.

I’m a heterosexual male. Last night I went out to dinner with two male friends, both gay, and not a couple. They knew when I was speaking about relationships that I was talking about my heterosexual relationship with my wife. I knew when either of them spoke about relationships they were talking about another guy. Beyond that, the stories were pretty much identical. A few years ago one of these guys went through an emotional breakup with his boyfriend. He needed someone to talk to and I listened. The feelings he was experiencing were no different than I’d experienced breaking up with girlfriends, it’s just this time it was a guy talking about another guy. I felt pretty bad for him because it was his first rejection.

Perhaps as the younger generation gains a perspective on the diversity of their peers things will change. It just takes time.